Class 350/1 refurbishment

[Grumpy Git]

No plans in place to reduce them to 2+2 as they will be leaving London Northwestern once the new Bombardier Aventra fleet for them start to enter operational service.

When are they due to be introduced?

Crazy diagramming if you ask me currently as the unit was coupled to a 2+2 unit for the rest of the journey south of Birmingham New St.

On the 18:46 EUS-CRE return, it was a 350/2 again coupled to a 2+2 unit, but the shorter BHM-LIV service I changed to was a 2+2!

 

[TH172341]

When are they due to be introduced?

Crazy diagramming if you ask me currently as the unit was coupled to a 2+2 unit for the rest of the journey south of Birmingham New St.

On the 18:46 EUS-CRE return, it was a 350/2 again coupled to a 2+2 unit, but the shorter BHM-LIV service I changed to was a 2+2!

Due to be delivered from next year, but I am unsure of exact dates. There 45 "5 car" sets for LNWR, with 29 of them having an outer suburban (i.e 3+2) layout, and 16 will have a long distance (2+2) layout.

Yes the 350/2s tend to be tried to be stuck on the Crewe services now after continual complaints regarding the 3+2 seating on what is viewed as an intercity route from Birmingham to Liverpool. Having had to endure the 3+2 myself on the latter a few times, cannot imagine how a Crewe to Euston would feel.

The problem is that of course now with such long routes being operated, it is harder to isolate the 350/2s on to any shorter work unfortuntately. Really you would think one train an hour on the Birmingham to Liverpool route in would be better sat under XC operations, but they have enough issues as it is.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The problem is that of course now with such long routes being operated, it is harder to isolate the 350/2s on to any shorter work unfortuntately. Really you would think one train an hour on the Birmingham to Liverpool route in would be better sat under XC operations, but they have enough issues as it is.

It was an XC route, with Regional Railways Central providing a stopping service, but this was cut when the impossibility of Operation Princess became clear.

 

[zn1]

it would Be so much easier for the Roscos or fleet owners to specify a standard interior refit to entire generic fleets,

in this case all 350's have same seating standard, trim standard , etc with only the exterior paint or vinyl to be specific to the operator, rather than this piecemeal approach to scheduled heavy overhauls such as C3, C6 and C1.

any interior changes that are extra to the overhaul can be added as extra work to each fleet and TOC charged accordingly

small operator fleets such as the Northampton 319s the same, a generic paint job for them with the Owners name on the unit

this would keep costs down.

just a thought

 

[TH172341]

It was an XC route, with Regional Railways Central providing a stopping service, but this was cut when the impossibility of Operation Princess became clear.

Thanks for the insight with that, was unaware. Far better kind of set up that sounded.

In regards to the refurbishment having seen some photos on the other thread cannot say it looks nearly as good as the West Midlands class 172 refurbishment or the TPE 185 level either.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Thanks for the insight with that, was unaware. Far better kind of set up that sounded.

It had its ups and downs. Now you have 2tph that are usably fast, then it was 1tph plus a stopper that was no use unless you wanted the local stations. Though I'm not sure which TOC would win the awfulness competition between LNR and XC, they are probably on a par. At least you can get a seat on LNR, even if not at the time specified on the work of fiction that is the south WCML timetable.

 

[RealTrains07]

Thanks for the insight with that, was unaware. Far better kind of set up that sounded.

In regards to the refurbishment having seen some photos on the other thread cannot say it looks nearly as good as the West Midlands class 172 refurbishment or the TPE 185 level either.

But then again TPE is first. Quality means something different to them

 

[andi]

Have all of LM's 350s between Crewe <> London been refurbished now? I do really like how these look..

Doing a trip to from Stockport to London 2nd November and I wanted to initially go via Doncaster/Leeds on the new Azuma but they don't look anything special + there a major delays on ECML that day. Doesn't make it worth it. Was tempted via Sheffield on EM but there are no trains due to engineering works.

I could just go on a Pendolino, but really quite fancy something different and it's only an additional 30-40 minutes on the journey, especially if going via Tamworth. So if I can 100% guarantee one of the new freshly refurbished ones turn up then that's my route of choice!

 

[NewSt]

Have all of LM's 350s between Crewe <> London been refurbished now?

No, only 3 have been refurbished at present and I believe only 2 have actually been in passenger service. You've got a less than 10% chance of getting one at the moment.

 

[RealTrains07]

No, only 3 have been refurbished at present and I believe only 2 have actually been in passenger service. You've got a less than 10% chance of getting one at the moment.

I saw 350/115 working a crewe - euston by chance while i was at the station.

whats the 3rd 350/1. Has 123 been refurbished inside?

 

[NewSt]

whats the 3rd 350/1. Has 123 been refurbished inside?

123 was the third I was talking about, which I believe has been refurbished internally and is being held up at Long Marston.

 

[setdown]

There must be a slight irony in Transpennine 350’s running around with dark green door panel trim, whilst LNR 350’s run around with blue door panel trim!

 

[Bletchleyite]

There must be a slight irony in Transpennine 350’s running around with dark green door panel trim, whilst LNR 350’s run around with blue door panel trim!

It's grey on /2, /3 and /4 isn't it?

 

[387star]

Why did 350/1 seats and 360 seats get threadbare
Siemens to blame ?

 

[setdown]

It's grey on /2, /3 and /4 isn't it?

The 350 I had from Edinburgh at the weekend had (smart) blue decor everywhere, apart from the panels by the doors, which were definitely dark green

 

[Bletchleyite]

Why did 350/1 seats and 360 seats get threadbare
Siemens to blame ?

Heavy use without being replaced frequently enough.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The 350 I had from Edinburgh at the weekend had (smart) blue decor everywhere, apart from the panels by the doors, which were definitely dark green

This is the only pic I can find:

Class 350 vestibule

...and it definitely looks dark grey to me (same as 350/2 and /3) which is what I thought. Unless they have been swapped recently in anticipation of the move to LNR.

 

[setdown]

Yeah the lighting in that photo kind of makes it look so, but standing by it, definitely green. I did think it a bit odd that the whole train had a nice blue scheme but these panels were a different colour.

Although, it’s probably not high up on the list of priorities for either operator right now!

 

[F Great Eastern]

Why did 350/1 seats and 360 seats get threadbare
Siemens to blame ?

Be stupid to blame Siemens, all seats need to be recovered after a good amount of use as they wear down.

 

[37057]

Yeah the lighting in that photo kind of makes it look so, but standing by it, definitely green. I did think it a bit odd that the whole train had a nice blue scheme but these panels were a different colour.

Although, it’s probably not high up on the list of priorities for either operator right now!

They're dark grey, not green.

 

[RealTrains07]

They're dark grey, not green.

Thats what i thought. If they were going to do. They wouldnt change the panels untill after the move.

i dont think the refurb spec included green panels anyway. Might as well keep the grey it goes better with the overall scheme. Better the the 350/1 blue at any rate

 

[Grumpy Git]

I noticed the headrest part of the green seats on the (awful) 350/2's I rode at the weekend were very manky.

 

[NewSt]

Why did 350/1 seats and 360 seats get threadbare
Siemens to blame ?

On the 350 front, I’d imagine that when they first really needed a refurbishment, London Midland had found out that they would be losing their franchise and therefore didn’t choose to spend their money on it, however considering that these units have been on the rails since Silverlink days it’s not that bad.

 

[NewSt]

Deleted

 

[NewSt]

I noticed the headrest part of the green seats on the (awful) 350/2's I rode at the weekend were very manky.

Yes, they’re truly disgusting. Unlikely that LNWR will even go as far as cleaning them now, though.

 

[Bletchleyite]

350/2s aren't that bad. So far as 3+2 seated units go they are quite good - in particular the legroom in the bays is excellent.

 

[nuneatonmark]

3 plus 2 on any services, not just longer distance ones, is crap. Hardly anyone will sit in the middle seat of three. Less room for bags or cases too. Crap, crap, crap! Why LNR are specifying 3 plus 2 on some of their new Aventras I don’t know, just hope they never turn up on Nuneaton services. Haven’t seen a refurbished 350 yet, the one I’m on at present 350 120 isn’t.

 

[pt_mad]

I can only assume that once the 350/2s have left the West Midlands franchise that the main long distance routes will see mainly 2+2 in the form of 350/1,/3,/4 and the handful of 2+2 layout Aventras, although a poster further up suggested some Aventras will be 2+3 as well as some 2+2.
So whether these will be separated so they are dedicated to certain routes to keep say Trent Valley services 2+2 based who knows?

 

[Grumpy Git]

Does anyone know if the heater ducts under the windows on the 350's encroach more than on any other E/DMU's? I suspect they don't, but it's made to seem that way (when you are sat by the window) due to the 3+2 seating on the 350/2's, (which I always seem to end-up on)?

 

[Mordac]

3 plus 2 on any services, not just longer distance ones, is crap. Hardly anyone will sit in the middle seat of three. Less room for bags or cases too. Crap, crap, crap! Why LNR are specifying 3 plus 2 on some of their new Aventras I don’t know, just hope they never turn up on Nuneaton services. Haven’t seen a refurbished 350 yet, the one I’m on at present 350 120 isn’t.

People definitely seat on the middle seat, indeed I have in more than a few occasions. That said it's not pleasant, but on peak time services out of New Street I've occasionally wished for a /2 in lieu of a /1 or a /3 because I knew that would make the difference between getting a seat or not. This was when I lived in Northampton, so this was an issue for the journey time, although to be fair I'd always get a seat by Coventry, and usually by International.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Does anyone know if the heater ducts under the windows on the 350's encroach more than on any other E/DMU's? I suspect they don't, but it's made to seem that way (when you are sat by the window) due to the 3+2 seating on the 350/2's, (which I always seem to end-up on)?

They encroach a lot less than Class 195/331 where it's near impossible not to touch it with your leg. They also have a flat top so you can put your foot up on it.