Class 365 future

Discussion in 'Traction & Rolling Stock' started by jopsuk, 12 Jun 2016.

  1. delticdave

    delticdave Member

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    A new bridge & trackwork would solve most of the problems, but platform 4 is also used in the AM to facilitate an easy interchange for London-bound passengers.....

    As for the lengths, both just over 100 metres, & demolition of the station buildings wouldn't be a good idea either.
     
  2. Mordac

    Mordac Established Member

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    Are Great Northern still holding on to 365511 and 539, or have they finally given them back?
     
  3. MatthewRead

    MatthewRead On Moderation

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    Scotrail are thinking of extending the lease of the 10 365's they have according to the latest issue of Modern Railways.
     
  4. Jonny

    Jonny Established Member

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    It depends on which bay is used. A quick glance at Google Earth and RealTimeTrains suggests that the vast majority of services use the (shorter) Platform 4. Platform 1, also a bay, may be long enough for 5 cars and have less potential for conflicting moves required to reach it.
     
  5. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    Modern Railways intimates that they’ve now been given back, however I’ve been on 365539 pretty recently - I forget exactly when but might have been as recently as last week.
     
  6. grid56126

    grid56126 Member

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    365511 and 365539 are both working off of Peterborough this AM.
     
  7. 306024

    306024 Established Member

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    Fortunately the professionals now looking at this are doing a bit more than a quick glance at Google Earth. Neither bay in their current configuration can accommodate a 5 car 24m EMU. The 365 rumour is just one of many doing the rounds.
     
  8. Jonny

    Jonny Established Member

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    The 24m is a bit of a complication. I thought that 20m carriages were the norm on former Network South East routes...
     
  9. delticdave

    delticdave Member

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    That was then.....
    The 10-car 720/1 is 243 metres long, the 5-car 720/5 122 metres, so 24 metres long.
    Reason, it's cheaper to have long bodies & fewer bogies than the 20 metre alternative.
    It seems that the Aventura is modular & can be ordered in various lengths.
     
  10. delticdave

    delticdave Member

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    Interesting but not accurate....

    I've just checked the Monday - Friday working timetable for departures from Wickford to Southminster.
    Platform 1 (the down bay) has 13 departures, Platform 2 has 6, Platform 3 has 2 (ECS from Southend, then into service at Wickford) & Platform 4 has 6.

    Platform 2 handles the obvious Ex London Starters, but there are other early morning down trains from their overnight stabling points.

    HTH.
     
  11. Class 170101

    Class 170101 Established Member

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    The cheapest way would be to extend the service to Shenfield and terminate in Platforms there.
     
  12. delticdave

    delticdave Member

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    That means reducing the frequency to hourly.
    There are a few trains from Shenfield to Southminster, the all-stations ex Shenfield 0630 arrives in Southminster at 0719 so 49 minute running time + turnaround time would allow an hourly service. The locals would not be too keen.....
     
  13. Class 170101

    Class 170101 Established Member

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    Or stick another unit in the circuit, probably not as cheap as your suggestion but still an option to be considered.
     
  14. Alfie1014

    Alfie1014 Member

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    Fitting in an extra turnback, (every 40 minutes), whilst not impossible wouldn't be ideal at Shenfield with increases to off-peak Crossrail and GA services and would add a fifth train per hour between there and Wickford. One inelegant solution would be to divert one of the extra Southend Vic services down the branch every 45 mins but that would worsen the interval between Wickford and Southend Vic just when the 4th train is indended to improve the service especially at Southend Airport! My monies on the retention of some classic units at least in the short term to maintain the status quo?
     
  15. 306024

    306024 Established Member

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    Your money is on the bookies favourite. It may take GA longer than hoped for total fleet replacement.
     
  16. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    365539 took me home this evening. Like most of the GN 365s nowadays in fine condition internally, virtually spotlessly clean and tidy. The niggling faults like gangway doors not working which was an issue a year ago now seem to be a thing of the past - evidently the less intense working means the trains are now getting a bit more depot tlc.
     
  17. Mordac

    Mordac Established Member

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    So, those this mean they're keeping those two for the long term after all (so a total fleet of 21 rather than 19)?
     
  18. 317 forever

    317 forever Member

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    I read some months ago that these would be leased to ScotRail for a year, so until July. Apparently the final 385s could be delivered by March and in service by May. So, in case of any delay, or any 314s needing to be withdrawn early, July seems about right.
     
  19. Bigfoot

    Bigfoot Member

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    https://www.scotrail.co.uk/about-sc...s-happy-trains’-–-scotrail-replace-class-365s

     
  20. Prestige15

    Prestige15 Member

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    Reform them into 3 car, send them to scotrail an replace most of the 318/320?
     
  21. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    Not easy to do - the 365 has equipment distributed across all four cars.
     
  22. Class465fan

    Class465fan Member

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    Maybe send them over to northern rail and replace the 321s?
     
  23. theblackwatch

    theblackwatch Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    They will be replaced by 331s in the next few months.
     
  24. Southsider

    Southsider Member

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    Scotrail have found them to be horribly unreliable and are withdrawing them early.
     
  25. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    Sounds like issues with the maintenance regime, as they weren't unreliable when in service on GN, nor are the units still in service with GN. The ScotRail units were essential chosen randomly, so can't even be said to be the worst examples (unless they were run down before leaving GN knowing they were the ones departing?)

    Perhaps this is what happens when rolling stock goes traipsing round the country on a whim (aka lease). Hornsey has been maintaining the 365s for 25 years, so perhaps know what they're doing with them.
     
    Last edited: 16 Mar 2019 at 13:37
  26. 433N

    433N Member

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    This is certainly, rightly or wrongly, the conclusion that I have come to. I think Scotrail have just not tried very hard on maintenance since they are only around for a year. Whether they have the cover to allow standing them down early is the crucial question.
     
  27. Mikey C

    Mikey C Established Member

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    It does seem with modern and modernish stock that local expertise is key to maintaining reliability
     
  28. Jonny

    Jonny Established Member

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    They will probably try to get away with short-formed services.
     
  29. 433N

    433N Member

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    Yes they probably will ... which rather makes a farce of serving improvement notices, doesn't it ?

    I do wonder in all this, who actually paid for the lease on the 365s ... and shouldn't money have also been available on making sure they were reliable, or if not, taking the ones currently in Crewe sidings aswell to improve availability. At the end of the day, this situation is caused by Hitachi and Wabtec not delivering their products on time (if Wabtec had, Dunblane services could probably now be adequately covered by available 158s and 170s).

    ON EDIT
    I would be interested to hear what mileage 365523 has done on its Scottish holiday.
     
  30. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    It might not be a case of money, but simply depot staff familiarity. Extra units might of course have helped simply to give more cover. A one-year lease isn’t really enough to expect a big push on reliability.
     

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