Class 387s to Swindon

[TXMISTA]

Now that training has started for temporary 387 shuttles to Swindon, could we see future permanent Paddington - Swindon 387 services? I imagine the fact that Swindon is an IC service with first class offerings might make this unrealistic but it could be an interesting idea.

 

[HST43257]

I’ve wondered about a service all the way through to Bristol (when wires go up) or Cardiff, acting as a service not for London to either destination, but things like Reading to Wooton Basset (if that opened) or Didcot to Chippenham. It would mean that services fast in from BPW were more practical. But to answer your question, I’m not sure if I see point in such a short extension (assuming you’re extending the didcot 387 terminators), since I see less demand for Goring to Swindon journeys

 

[JonathanH]

Now that training has started for temporary 387 shuttles to Swindon, could we see future permanent Paddington - Swindon 387 services? I imagine the fact that Swindon is an IC service with first class offerings might make this unrealistic but it could be an interesting idea.

Why would it be necessary in the longer term? If it is about serving places like Grove or Steventon, I don't think the lack of training on 387s has been the factor holding it back.

It does seem possible that some of the Didcot peak terminators could be extended to finish in Swindon but a) they would need guards and b) there doesn't appear to much point.

 

[RobShipway]

The only time you will see a class 387 heading towards Swindon, after the situation with the class 800 units has been resolved is for stabling the units overnight which happens now anyway.

I cannot see GWR getting agreements from the Rail Unions to have the class 387 units being run permanently with passengers on board even with guards on the train to Swindon. Once the class 800 units are fixed, there would be no need for the class 387 units to be taking passengers to Swindon.

 

[JamesT]

Isn't there a potential issue of capacity as Didcot-Swindon is only two track, so 110mph 387s would be getting in the way of the 125mph 800s?

 

[Failed Unit]

Not really at the moment. Not many are running at all

 

[JamesT]

Not really at the moment. Not many are running at all

Yes, at the moment it's fine. But I understood the proposal was for Class 387 operation to carry on as a permanent thing, so it would have to be fitted into the normal timetable.

 

[hexagon789]

Isn't there a potential issue of capacity as Didcot-Swindon is only two track, so 110mph 387s would be getting in the way of the 125mph 800s?

I wouldn't expect the journey time to be significantly longer for the distance. A couple minutes at the most if at all, it's only just over 26 miles between the two.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

Why would it be necessary in the longer term?

To maintain the traction knowledge that has been learnt by guards in case of any other issues in the future with the IETs.

 

[reddragon]

I’ve wondered about a service all the way through to Bristol (when wires go up) or Cardiff, acting as a service not for London to either destination, but things like Reading to Wooton Basset (if that opened) or Didcot to Chippenham. It would mean that services fast in from BPW were more practical. But to answer your question, I’m not sure if I see point in such a short extension (assuming you’re extending the didcot 387 terminators), since I see less demand for Goring to Swindon journeys

A lot of TV local station travellers go via Reading, so extending otherwise usually under used 387s off peak or those stabled at Swindon on such a service would work.

Whilst no wires reach Oxford, the trains are deserted at the Didcot end as even Oxford is quicker via Reading. Once wires reach Oxford, that viability drops a lot.

 

[JN114]

I hope that a few services start/end of day do remain a permanent feature so that the guards don’t lose traction knowledge.

 

[thatapanydude]

I hope that a few services start/end of day do remain a permanent feature so that the guards don’t lose traction knowledge.

I hope so too - tbh more ECS movements like this should be put back into service !!

 

[Starmill]

The only time you will see a class 387 heading towards Swindon, after the situation with the class 800 units has been resolved is for stabling the units overnight which happens now anyway.

I cannot see GWR getting agreements from the Rail Unions to have the class 387 units being run permanently with passengers on board even with guards on the train to Swindon. Once the class 800 units are fixed, there would be no need for the class 387 units to be taking passengers to Swindon.

I'm not saying that it's necessarily desirable, but why would a union agreement be needed? And why would getting one be a problem if it were?

 

[swt_passenger]

The only time you will see a class 387 heading towards Swindon, after the situation with the class 800 units has been resolved is for stabling the units overnight which happens now anyway.

I cannot see GWR getting agreements from the Rail Unions to have the class 387 units being run permanently with passengers on board even with guards on the train to Swindon. Once the class 800 units are fixed, there would be no need for the class 387 units to be taking passengers to Swindon.

The last Western Route Study included the possibility of running peak only 12 car 387s from Swindon, two in the morning, and two back to Swindon in the evening. Calling Didcot and Reading only. So the possibility has at least been officially considered.

 

[RobShipway]

I'm not saying that it's necessarily desirable, but why would a union agreement be needed? And why would getting one be a problem if it were?

From details that I have read and with speaking with friends that work as guards on GWR services, Union Agreement would be needed should guards not be available and GWR decide to run the train anyway to Swindon as a driver only service. The current agreement as far as I am aware, that the unions have is that the class 387's can be driven driver only from London to Didcot Parkway as either 4 or 8 car trains. Further than Didcot, then guards would be needed on the trains, hence why GWR have been training guards on the service since last Sunday.

The guards being trained, would normally be guards on Class 8xx services. So once the class 8xx units are fixed, those guards will be going back to their normal duties. Hence, why I say that I do not see the Class 387 units running to Swindon with passengers on continuing after the fix to class 800's. GWR would need to be hiring in more staff as guards for the service to continue as far as I can understand.

 

[Starmill]

From details that I have read and with speaking with friends that work as guards on GWR services, Union Agreement would be needed should guards not be available and GWR decide to run the train anyway to Swindon as a driver only service. The current agreement as far as I am aware, that the unions have is that the class 387's can be driven driver only from London to Didcot Parkway as either 4 or 8 car trains. Further than Didcot, then guards would be needed on the trains, hence why GWR have been training guards on the service since last Sunday.

The guards being trained, would normally be guards on Class 8xx services. So once the class 8xx units are fixed, those guards will be going back to their normal duties. Hence, why I say that I do not see the Class 387 units running to Swindon with passengers on continuing after the fix to class 800's. GWR would need to be hiring in more staff as guards for the service to continue as far as I can understand.

Oh yes I see now, you meant an agreement to run them without guards. Indeed, in that case. I think the suggestion was that a small handful of additional guard duties would be needed. Of course if that's simply not possible then they will almost certainly not be running.

 

[Aictos]

Extending Class 387 operation to Swindon would be beneficial especially in the peaks as Reading, Didcot Parkway and Swindon passengers can be pushed towards using the Class 387s freeing up seating for passengers traveling further afield to the South West and to South Wales.

Operate four to six 12 car services in the morning peak towards London and the same out of London in the evening peak, that should massively increase seating capacity for ALL passengers.

GWR could even make Reading Set Down only in morning peak and Pick up only in evening peak.

 

[SouthEastBuses]

387s to Swindon would be a great idea, but only when new stations at Steventon and Wantage (for example) are opened.

There is also the 2 track issue around Steventon as @JamesT rightly pointed out.

Wasn't there a plan to run 387s all the way to Cardiff?

 

[thatapanydude]

387s to Swindon would be a great idea, but only when new stations at Steventon and Wantage (for example) are opened.

Even extended to Wotton Bassett instead of Swindon.

 

[Ianno87]

Wasn't there a plan to run 387s all the way to Cardiff?

As Millennium Stadium events crowd-busters, I believe.

 

[SouthEastBuses]

Once Oxford finally gets electrified, as well as the new stations opening between Didcot Parkway and Swindon/Chippenham, I'd do the following.

Run 8-car or 12-car to Didcot Parkway (calling at the current stations), where the train divides. The front 4 or 8 coaches continue to Oxford calling at Appleford, Culham, Radley and Oxford. The rear 4 coaches continue to Swindon (or Chippenham if Wootton Bassetts opens and the wires go to Chippenham) calling at Steventon, Wantage, Swindon, Wootton Bassett and Chippenham.

And viceversa going to London.

 

[reddragon]

The GWML was simply devoid of local stations, many of which were viable but "in the way". If local EMUs can go to Liverpool from London, why not Cardiff?

 

[PTR 444]

As there are only 2 tracks west of Didcot, would such a GWML stopper get caught up by the fasts to Bristol and Cardiff assuming these are left in place?

Also apologies for the text size, it seems to have been made larger after I deleted a quote tag and I don’t know how I can make it the same size as the posts upthread.

 

[Kite159]

As there are only 2 tracks west of Didcot, would such a GWML stopper get caught up by the fasts to Bristol and Cardiff assuming these are left in place?

Simple solution would be to rebuild one (or more) of the stations on loops and timetable a slightly longer dwell to allow a fast service to overtake

 

[reddragon]

Also, the acceleration of 387s versus fasts is somewhat different to that of 1st Gen DMUs versus HSTs

Wantage & Grove has also grown a lot!

 

[30907]

The GWML was simply devoid of local stations, many of which were viable but "in the way".

Which were the viable ones? Pre Beeching, Challow deserved a couple of London fasts, so did Badminton (to keep the upper crust happy!); I imagine Wantage Road, Wootton Bassett and Corsham might each have a business case now.

 

[reddragon]

Which were the viable ones? Pre Beeching, Challow deserved a couple of London fasts, so did Badminton (to keep the upper crust happy!); I imagine Wantage Road, Wootton Bassett and Corsham might each have a business case now.

You could say that about many stations that remained open after Beeching.