Class 701 'Aventra' trains for South Western Railway

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Bigfoot

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701023 was moved from Wimbledon to Farnham Depot today. It’s understood a further three may follow.
There were definitely 2 units parked up in Farnham today. 2 in Clapham, however many in Feltham/Wimbledon. Space filling up fast!
Correct, GBRf are providing the staff for the test runs. So so far, only GBRf can drive these units despite SWR now having a small contingent.
No SWR drivers are trained to drive a 701.
 

Big Jumby 74

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Space filling up fast!
Quite so. In general railways terms, not just the area you comment on, a very pertinent fact, especially during (stock) transitional/cascade periods, when both old and new are vying for space. Something that is, regrettably, not always understood by some, outside of those directly involved in operations/planning ;)
 

TEW

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Seems the talk of the units being accepted by ASLEF recently was a little premature. Doesn't look like training is starting imminently.
 

the sniper

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He's the only person on this forum then who is exempt from providing a source.

Seriously? We might as well wait for Rail Magazine to come out every fortnight and see if SWR have treated them to a press release...
 

Invincible

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It's still a fairly lengthy list and I only had a brief read through and can't remember off the top of my head.
Presumably ASLEF and the SWR are discussing how many of the issues are critical, or have a temporary workaround, so some driver and guard training can start?
 

TEW

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Presumably ASLEF and the SWR are discussing how many of the issues are critical, or have a temporary workaround, so some driver and guard training can start?
ASLEF certainly don't consider the units to be in a state where training can start.
 

pompeyfan

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I wonder how much training guards will need? For drivers the physical units are probably similar to 707s, but the big thing will be DOO dispatch and the soft skills it requires.
 

boiledbeans2

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I wonder how much training guards will need? For drivers the physical units are probably similar to 707s, but the big thing will be DOO dispatch and the soft skills it requires.
Yeah, to get the 701s to behave, they need frequent pep talks... :lol:
 
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I wouldn't expect Driver Training to start anytime soon. The DFT Call the shots and are not going to sign off doing anything for fear of antagonising the Unions. If they do the Union will no doubt do their level best to disrupt the Schedule by "Advising our Members to not make themselves avaliable on days when their Name comes up on the Training Roster" or similar. It will descend into a Farce so the DFT will simply say "Fine. We'll carry on as we are and leave all the shiny new trains in the sidings indefinitely." It'll be like the early 80's when the 317's all sat at Cricklewood for about 2 Years whilst BR and the Unions fought to the death over DOO...
 

Goldfish62

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The DFT Call the shots and are not going to sign off doing anything for fear of antagonising the Unions.
If that's their ploy then it would appear to have already been a spectacular failure given that it seems inevitable that we're facing months of national railway strikes.
 

gabrielhj07

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If that's their ploy then it would appear to have already been a spectacular failure given that it seems inevitable that we're facing months of national railway strikes.
DFT Policy is well understood, in pursuing the worst of both worlds. We get no new trains, and the existing service is disrupted!
 
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swr444

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I wonder how much training guards will need? For drivers the physical units are probably similar to 707s, but the big thing will be DOO dispatch and the soft skills it requires.
Guards will have dispatch training for degraded working. Its been mentioned multiple times now in this thread
 

pompeyfan

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Guards will have dispatch training for degraded working. Its been mentioned multiple times now in this thread

Have SWR or RMT publicly confirmed this? I’ve certainly not seen anything official. Does this mean certain services will be run with the guard dispatching to maintain competency?
 

TT-ONR-NRN

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The DFT Call the shots and are not going to sign off doing anything for fear of antagonising the Unions.
The unions need to get a grip. The entitled attitude (that then affects passenger services greatly) to throw all of their toys out of their pram whenever they don't like something is really quite shocking. It's selfish to wreak such havoc on what is supposed to be a passenger service. Anyone can argue with me if they want but them being offended won't change my mind on it.
 

TEW

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Have SWR or RMT publicly confirmed this? I’ve certainly not seen anything official. Does this mean certain services will be run with the guard dispatching to maintain competency?
I don't it's been confirmed publicly, but it is definitely the case. Only for a time limited period though, at least for now anyway.
 

adc82140

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What are the actual issues now that are not acceptable to the unions? Are they easy to fix, or are we looking at a fundamental cab redesign? What about the door opening at speed issue, was that sorted?
 

Goldfish62

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What are the actual issues now that are not acceptable to the unions? Are they easy to fix, or are we looking at a fundamental cab redesign? What about the door opening at speed issue, was that sorted?
The cabs have already been completely redesigned once. The original drivers desk was standard Aventra, but ASLEF considered that unacceptable to SWR drivers despite being acceptable to drivers elsewhere.

As time goes on I'm more and more convinced it's just a deliberate ploy to delay indefinitely DCO on SWR (despite agreeing to it as part of a pay and conditions package). I can see it ending up in court just as it did with Southern.
 

43102EMR

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The cabs have already been completely redesigned once. The original drivers desk was standard Aventra, but ASLEF considered that unacceptable to SWR drivers despite being acceptable to drivers elsewhere.

As time goes on I'm more and more convinced it's just a deliberate ploy to delay indefinitely DCO on SWR (despite agreeing to it as part of a pay and conditions package). I can see it ending up in court just as it did with Southern.
The moment GTR brought on legal action, ASLEF dropped the claim against them… so might not be that bad an idea - guess it depends on how true it is that the cabs are still very poor following the modifications.
 

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