Class 701 'Aventra' trains for South Western Railway

[D365]

Definitely for the best I suppose. I don't think the 701 delivery is too much of a big deal at this stage. Even if everything was to instantly get back to normal tomorrow, there's no reason why the current fleet couldn't hold on for another year to see these trains properly tested and introduced.

Only that Southeastern will need the 707s at some point...

 

[Warrior2852]

Only that Southeastern will need the 707s at some point...

Is there a timed contract for Southeastern getting the 707s from SWR? Are we going to potentially end up with a situation like the 172s going to WMR from LO, or do they just go once SWR has finished with them and the 701s have arrived?

 

[Energy]

Is there a timed contract for Southeastern getting the 707s from SWR? Are we going to potentially end up with a situation like the 172s going to WMR from LO, or do they just go once SWR has finished with them and the 701s have arrived?

I believe the 707s are meant to come when SWR can free them.

 

[theironroad]

I think it needs to be remembered that ASLEF is made up of several regions with different reps. What might be acceptable to Anglia region may not be acceptable to Wessex region etc, each region is only as good as their respective reps.

ASLEF districts aren't totally autonomous entities. Most polices and many decisions have to go before the EC which is comprised of representatives from all distticts. Most of the covid policies have been implemented from the EC , with support of the district's. It's aslef hq that has reached agreement with the RDG on a national policy for covid.

 

[pompeyfan]

ASLEF districts aren't totally autonomous entities. Most polices and many decisions have to go before the EC which is comprised of representatives from all distticts. Most of the covid policies have been implemented from the EC , with support of the district's. It's aslef hq that has reached agreement with the RDG on a national policy for covid.

thanks for clarifying.

 

[D365]

I believe the 707s are meant to come when SWR can free them.

Really? There needs to be some sort of date, otherwise Southeastern won't be able to plan their timetables accordingly.

 

[samuelmorris]

I can't find anything about the actual terms of the direct award - is it still subject to a cool-off period, or not deemed necessary to release to the public in current times?

 

[Domh245]

The EMR franchise agreement is still yet to be released so it's just one of those things that could take a while to come through, certainly I wouldn't expect it amidst the current situation. As for the 707s, ISTR a tweet from SouthEastern saying they were working with the ROSCO, DfT, and SWR to come to an agreement, so nothing is set in stone for them yet.

 

[TrainTube]

Has there been any progress in deliveries after the 18th of May, or any tests in the UK?

 

[Goldfish62]

Has there been any progress in deliveries after the 18th of May, or any tests in the UK?

Given that CAF have just delivered the first 196 to WMT for testing I assume there's no reason Bombardier can't do the same with SWR assuming the first 701 is ready.

 

[JamesC357]

Given that CAF have just delivered the first 196 to WMT for testing I assume there's no reason Bombardier can't do the same with SWR assuming the first 701 is ready.

Plus Greater Anglia have recieved a few 720s in the last few weeks so Bombardier are still delivering

 

[Bigfoot]

Once the restriction on number of people per cab is reduced I predict a set will be delivered.

 

[Goldfish62]

Once the restriction on number of people per cab is reduced I predict a set will be delivered.

Is there not such a restriction at WMT (or at TfW for the Class 230)?

 

[Bigfoot]

Is there not such a restriction at WMT (or at TfW for the Class 230)?

Each company sets their own restrictions, but aslef has also set out basic guidance too.

 

[WWTownEnth]

Any news on when deliveries might begin?

 

[Goldfish62]

Each company sets their own restrictions, but aslef has also set out basic guidance too.

The first TfW Class 230 is currently undergoing mainline testing as are GA's Class 720s. I wonder how they are able to comply with restrictions when as perhaps suggested on here the Class 701 can't comply.

 

[Domh245]

The first TfW Class 230 is currently undergoing mainline testing as are GA's Class 720s. I wonder how they are able to comply with restrictions when as perhaps suggested on here the Class 701 can't comply.

I can't say for certain, but I expect that the 720s and 230s are being tested by FOCs and are just doing mileage accumulation. It is possible for them to run around with just a driver in the cab so long as they have the necessary route/traction knowledge. I don't see why the 701s can't also be tested in this fashion, unless the plan is to skip FOC-driven mileage accumulation and do that concurrently with driver training to minimise the amount of trains they've got at Wimbledon at any one time?

 

[palmersears]

First one provisionally due for delivery tomorrow:

Realtime Trains - 6X20 1054 Derby Litchurch Lane to Eastleigh Trsmd

Realtime Trains provides live realtime running information for the Great British railway network using open data.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Should be 701002

 

[Dan15812]

First one provisionally due for delivery tomorrow:

Realtime Trains - 6X20 1054 Derby Litchurch Lane to Eastleigh Trsmd

Realtime Trains provides live realtime running information for the Great British railway network using open data.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Should be 701002

That's great news. I'll be watching out for that! Chears for the update!

 

[WWTownEnth]

Thanks for the info. Is this a 10 or 5 car unit?

 

[Domh245]

Thanks for the info. Is this a 10 or 5 car unit?

Richard Clinnick is saying it'll be a 10 car

 

[RealTrains07]

Should be interesting to see how a 10 car set works out conpared to 5.

 

[Goldfish62]

Richard Clinnick is saying it'll be a 10 car

It always was going to be a 10 car first.

 

[Ethano92]

This tweet shows 701003 in complete livery with SWR logos and the first passenger door in a contrasting light grey colour in line with disability regs.
(Sorry if there's a better way to link it)

 

[Snow1964]

It always was going to be a 10 car first.

Sensibly I printed a couple of pages from the DfT franchise agreement with the table of franchise commitment delivery dates (before it was amended on DfT website)

One 5car and one 10car is required to be in service (in service not delivered) by September 2019, dozen units in service by end 2019 and all by start of 2021. Table does split the 5car and 10car and has various minimum quantity dates, but is clearly fiction now, and has clearly been removed from from franchise agreement.

Would have been couple of 10car units, then first 5car, for service, with all 5car within earlier months of the 16 month delivery timescale.

No idea what current 5car and 10car delivery order is, but clearly first unit is about year late being delivered. I think the order was placed June 2017 so has taken 36 months for first one.

 

[Goldfish62]

Sensibly I printed a couple of pages from the DfT franchise agreement with the table of franchise commitment delivery dates (before it was amended on DfT website)

One 5car and one 10car is required to be in service (in service not delivered) by September 2019, dozen units in service by end 2019 and all by start of 2021. Table does split the 5car and 10car and has various minimum quantity dates, but is clearly fiction now, and has clearly been removed from from franchise agreement.

Would have been couple of 10car units, then first 5car, for service, with all 5car within earlier months of the 16 month delivery timescale.

No idea what current 5car and 10car delivery order is, but clearly first unit is about year late being delivered. I think the order was placed June 2017 so has taken 36 months for first one.

Yes I was referring to the delivery programme as last outlined, which was sometime last year.

From recollection, it stated that initial deliveries and service entry will be based on 10 car units because there's no added complication of coupling and uncoupling and the Reading line would go over first to 701 operation first.

 

[pompeyfan]

I hope they’ve put a crew locker in the middle of a 10 car if they expect guards to patrol the train. Bit of a long walk to the rear every time the guard fancies a drink, and seeing as they were always planned to have someone at least rostered on the train, you’d hope that’s taken into consideration.

does anyone know if they went ahead and put the bio toilets on the units like they originally planned?

 

[Goldfish62]

I hope they’ve put a crew locker in the middle of a 10 car if they expect guards to patrol the train. Bit of a long walk to the rear every time the guard fancies a drink, and seeing as they were always planned to have someone at least rostered on the train, you’d hope that’s taken into consideration.

does anyone know if they went ahead and put the bio toilets on the units like they originally planned?

The bio toilets were always part of the spec, weren't they?

 

[WWTownEnth]

This tweet shows 701003 in complete livery with SWR logos and the first passenger door in a contrasting light grey colour in line with disability regs.
(Sorry if there's a better way to link it)

If its the same tweet as I am seeing, it suggests it's a five car.

 

[pompeyfan]

The bio toilets were always part of the spec, weren't they?

i think I remember reading back in 2017 that the technology was unproven for the size of the toilet provided and it was touch and go as to what they would do.