Class 88 UKDual & EuroDual

Discussion in 'Traction & Rolling Stock' started by Sunbird24, 13 Oct 2014.

  1. Sunbird24

    Sunbird24 Member

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    Last week I saw the EuroDual mock-up at Albuxech. The front-end is similar in shape to the class 91 but it is said the bodywork will be similar to the Euro 3000/4000 series. The class 88 is said to have the same body as the class 68, but I wonder if it will have a similar front (& rear) end as the EuroDual mock-up. The front can just be seen here behind the Desert Hawk mock-up: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10204079052075244&l=2dd99703fa
    There is a better picture here:
    http://www.railwaygazette.com/filea...aygazette.com/PDF/Inno_daily_24.09.14_web.pdf
     
  2. Loki

    Loki Member

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    This mock-up looks nothing like the renders. Our locos could end up differently as well.
     
  3. Sunbird24

    Sunbird24 Member

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    The renders show a Euro 4000 with a pantograph sitting on top and the original design trial was done with RENFE Euro 3000 334 001 which had a dummy pantograph mounted on the roof, which is still there: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...10094822.1073741862.1192973669&type=3&theater
    As part of the modular design the bodyshells and cabshells are separate components which are inividually customisable. The cabshells appear to be 1-piece mouldings - see Euro 4000 cabshells here: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...10094822.1073741862.1192973669&type=3&theater
    The African EuroDuals will likely use the same cabshell as on the mock-up but the 88s have a slimmer body design so could have the same cab as the 68 as the bodyshell is the same, or it could be a new design. We will only know for sure when they start to appear next year, or when the datasheets are published by Vossloh. Personally, I don't see too much change in shape for the 88s as otherwise the buffers and couplings etc., might need extending unless there are opening shrouds for coupling purposes.
    The Vossloh image for the class 88 is here:
    [​IMG]
    and their image of the South African EuroDual is here.
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: 14 Oct 2014
  4. Peter Sarf

    Peter Sarf Established Member

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    The following quote from the 68 thread contains two photos of the first 88. this was originally posted there by Sunbird24 before this thread got un-closed. Its the last two thumbnails of a very blue loco with cabs missing (but all there in the landscape photos). Thought I would get his 88 thread going again.

     
  5. Sunbird24

    Sunbird24 Member

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    Thanks for getting it going again Peter.
    As for the cabs, they are only missing from the thumbnails as Facebook makes them all square but they are there on the full size pictures.
    I have other pictures including some taken on the 22nd but many cannot be posted on public pages. I had a verbal agreement with Vossloh staff that I can take pictures of the locomotives for personal use but should not include any workers and they should not be published unless permission is obtained beforehand. The test track exits the works compound between properties not connected with Vossloh then runs past a junction with the Renfe/Adif line alongside a canal, public roads and footpaths etc. where photography is considered acceptable.
     
  6. Peter Sarf

    Peter Sarf Established Member

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    Thanks for the photos and keep the info coming. I expect the rather plain looking blue will look much more familiar once the decals are added. I think those are added after delivery to Carlisle ?.

    Wonder when 88001 will set out on UK metals as testing in Europe is first.
     
  7. Sunbird24

    Sunbird24 Member

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    When 68001 went to Velim it was in Vossloh white livery and after testing returned to the factory for several months before going to UK.
    Earlier there was talk that it might go to Old Dalby for testing and since it has appeared in blue....who really knows for certain.
    The first 15 left the factory complete with decals, numbers, nameplates, etc, basically ready to run. The last 4 were shipped in plain blue without any logos, numbers or names, except or the Vossloh ID plates. The six left here are in the same condition. I understand some problems were found with 18 & 19 so the rest are staying here until they have been resolved. A similar thing happened with the 67s. Nothing new, many of the RENFE 335 class were left here for well over a year and there are still 7 AFRO 4000s parked here as well. Now waiting to see if the next ones to appear are 68s or 88s.
     
  8. Sunbird24

    Sunbird24 Member

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    Just read in Railway Magazine that class 88 deliveries are set for Q4 2016 and 2017. The previous statement from DRS was for Q2 2016. Since then a further 7 68s were ordered so maybe they are being slotted in first. There is still an 88 sitting in the engine test bay with a large group of 68s, at least 4 anyway, but the bay can hold at least 8 in four rows of 2 so there could be a couple more behind. Everything else they build has a higher roof line so can be seen when behind 68s.
     
  9. gimmea50anyday

    gimmea50anyday Established Member

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    The additional 68's may be the order for TPE, think they will be in service from December 2017 so will obviously need crew training time. It is still open to speculation exactly what the 68's will be hauling/shoving but 442's have been ruled out by TPE management as has the pretendolino (at least in its current form)
     
  10. grumblingalong

    grumblingalong Member

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    That's funny because down here in the land of the east angles that's where it's supposed to be going. Good riddance generally also included in the conversation.
     
  11. gimmea50anyday

    gimmea50anyday Established Member

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    The pretendolino rake is supposed to be in use for cover while the GA mk3 rakes are refurbished, hence why TPE have been ruled out. The slam doors being another reason but this doesnt eliminate a chiltern style refurb with plug doors. Its also the reason the 442's as LHCS conversions just wont die its slow and painful death...
     
    Last edited: 22 Mar 2016
  12. Sunbird24

    Sunbird24 Member

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    Please refer to the thread title. The class 68 are neither UKDuals nor EuroDuals. There is a separate thread for class 68's.
     
  13. leomartin125

    leomartin125 Member

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    When is the first Class 88 meant to be delivered? I heard it was meant to be Autumn last year but haven't seen anything yet.
     
  14. Philip Phlopp

    Philip Phlopp Established Member

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    Q4 2016, as stated half a dozen posts above. 88001 should arrive earlier but there's lots of testing elsewhere first to complete.

    It'll need the same testing as IEP is going through now (i.e operation on 25kV AC).
     
    Last edited: 22 Mar 2016
  15. gimmea50anyday

    gimmea50anyday Established Member

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    You made this statement so I made a comment in response. A possible theory explination as to why the 88's have been delayed. So how can you then complain I am not on topic?
     
  16. Peter Sarf

    Peter Sarf Established Member

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    Does anyone know how the testing of 88001 is going and how soon it might get to our island ?.

    There is the DRS Crewe open day (23/07/2016 iirc) to speculate about ;).
     
  17. Mag_seven

    Mag_seven Established Member

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    We seen to have been waiting forever for at least one Class 88 to arrive on these shores - time will tell!
     
  18. 61653 HTAFC

    61653 HTAFC Established Member

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    Is it not the case that 88001 is going to Velim for extensive testing, with any lessons learned leading to any necessary mods to the rest of the fleet as they are built. 001 then returns to the factory for those mods before being delivered- therefore the first on these shores will most likely be 88002?
     
  19. Sunbird24

    Sunbird24 Member

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    There was no sign of the 88 at the factory yesterday (I have been away for a month hence the lack of reports) nor any other 88s, of the 68s only 68025 (as 2703-2015) was visible. Current output appears to be only Europorte 4000s and Prasa Duals for South Africa, and trams for Germany, so maybe an earlier report elsewhere on the internet that deliveries are scheduled for late 2016 or 2017 may be correct.
     
  20. 59CosG95

    59CosG95 Established Member

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    88001 has now left Albuixech, on the back of a low loader. I can assume from that that it's off to Velim for testing.
     
  21. alexl92

    alexl92 Established Member

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    Last edited: 2 Apr 2016
  22. Sunbird24

    Sunbird24 Member

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    The lack of any further reported sightings of 88001 since it was seen on a transporter last month leads me to still believe it may have been on the Eendracht with the last 3 68s. That ship is now approaching the German ports where 68001 was offloaded for its final move to Velim 2 years ago and could easily reach any of those ports over the weekend. As before, its cargo and destination have not yet been disclosed. Where-ever 88001 is, it is likely to be in Velim by the end of next week.
    68001 spent about 3-4 months in Velim, returning to the factory in April for several more months before heading on to the UK and then back to Germany for Innotrans in September. If 88001 follows a similar timeline it could be the end of the year before it gets to the UK and if one is expected mid year it could be 88002.
    Please remember this is speculation only - nothing is definite until it actually happens!
    Update: Destination Hamburg, ETA midnight tonight Fri 8/Sat 9.
    Update Sat 9th Eendracht is berthed in Hamburg alongside the railway near the southern end of the port.

    --- old post above --- --- new post below ---

    88001 has been photographed in Belgium. http://www.mainlinediesels.net/index.php?nav=1000001&lang=en&id=8775&action=shownews#.Vw5FT_mLSM8
    Not sure if it went Velsen - Antwerp by rail or took a different ship to Antwerp.
     
    Last edited: 13 Apr 2016
  23. 221129

    221129 Established Member

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    So where is it going then? Some are saying UK some are saying for testing elsewhere..
     
  24. Sunbird24

    Sunbird24 Member

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    Velim for a period of testing on their test circuit. The results of these initial tests will determine what happens next, anything between having to go back to the factory for more work to being handed over to its new owners as it is. Just like any new prototype. It may be just a 68 with a pantograph in appearance but there are a lot of changes and new technology in it. There may be a planned timescale but it will only be released when it is ready. The factory tests are done at low speed without a load. At Velim it will run at high speeds with various loads and a lot of data will be gathered which will be used for analysis and perhaps fine tuning of software and sorting out anything else.
     
  25. Peter Sarf

    Peter Sarf Established Member

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    No way is it going to the UK !. Otherwise it would have been unloaded at Workington along with the three 68s that were in the same ship at the same time.
    --- old post above --- --- new post below ---
    Very likely to be Velim, not least because that is where 68001 went. Thanks Sunbird24 for the inciteful insightful description of the tests/requirements of a prototype.
     
    Last edited: 17 Apr 2016
  26. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    it hasn't been tested so cant really come to the UK yet. Will it not be of to the test facility in the Czech Republic? Will this not be treated as prototype which will then define what happens with the other locos?
     
  27. Sunbird24

    Sunbird24 Member

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    There is no doubt that it is going to Velim for testing, it was officially announced long ago that the testing would take place at Velim if it was not possible at Old Dalby. There would be no other reason for it to be headed in that direction. How long it stays there is another story. Just as happened with the 68s, a second class 88 has appeared at Albuixech, almost certainly 88002. That one will likely be used for an official launching in the near future and will also be the one likely to appear in the UK mid-year, hopefully in time to be at the DRS Crewe Open Day on 23rd July.

    PS I would not be surprised if one locomotive is sent to Innotrans in September.

    More photographs here showing 88001 travelling through Germany today on its journey to Velim. http://www.railcolor.net/index.php?nav=1409453&lang=1#.VxDiOzB96Uk
    Earlier this month a second locomotive (presumably 88002) was seen at Albuixech.
     
    Last edited: 15 Apr 2016
  28. Peter Sarf

    Peter Sarf Established Member

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    Apparently 88001 has now arrived at Velim.

    EDIT :- It was via Antwerp I now learn.
     
    Last edited: 17 Apr 2016
  29. LNW-GW Joint

    LNW-GW Joint Established Member

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    "insightful" I think. Inciteful has an altogether more threatening meaning! ;)
     
  30. Sunbird24

    Sunbird24 Member

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    ...and the next one, I assume 88002, is looking almost complete at Albuixech, still minus handrails, wipers and probably a few other ancillaries.

    Wonder if there will be an 'unveiling' ceremony to coincide with the testing, as there was with the first 68s
     
    Last edited: 17 Apr 2016

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