Closed Stations Journey quiz

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Beaufort

 

[Calthrop]

Trevil

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Nantybwch

 

[Calthrop]

Rhymney Bridge

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

When I designed this leg of the journey, it was so that the final closed station could be reached by taking the required line from Rhymney Bridge

Dowlais Top

 

[DerekC]

We may have been misled by the Wikipedia entry for the MT&A Railway which has accidentally interchanged Dowlais Top and Dowlais High Street stations on the line map. Dowlais Top was on the Brecon & Merthyr line to Talybont via Torpantau. The next station after Rhymney Bridge should (I think) be

Dowlais High Street

 

[Calthrop]

With respect: my reading is -- after Rhymney Bridge: a spur leading to the right, off the LNWR east - west route, and into the Brecon & Merthyr Dowlais Top station. A B & M line continues north-westwards from Dowlais Top, not heading for Torpantau, but running in a wide loop north-east and north of Merthyr, and ultimately giving access to Merthyr (Plymouth Street). My version, thus: next station after Dowlais Top; and point where aforesaid loop, diverges: is

Pant (B & M -- as opposed to modern Brecon Mountain Railway's Pant station)

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Can I ask how Pontsarn Halt would fit on a line eventually leading to the final station of Merthyr (Plymouth Street).

 

[DerekC]

With respect: my reading is -- after Rhymney Bridge: a spur leading to the right, off the LNWR east - west route, and into the Brecon & Merthyr Dowlais Top station. A B & M line continues north-westwards from Dowlais Top, not heading for Torpantau, but running in a wide loop north-east and north of Merthyr, and ultimately giving access to Merthyr (Plymouth Street). My version, thus: next station after Dowlais Top; and point where aforesaid loop, diverges: is

Pant (B & M -- as opposed to modern Brecon Mountain Railway's Pant station)

We could go that way, but from the physical layout per the OS map, we would need to make a double reversal after Pant (B&M). Anyway I am sure our leader would have inserted another section of Brecon & Merthyr into the itinerary if that's what was intended. Much easier to carry on on the MT&A route that we were following.

Can I ask how Pontsarn Halt would fit on a line eventually leading to the final station of Merthyr (Plymouth Street).

It would fit nicely as it's on the MT&A route - more work needed because I think Pantyscallog Halt (Low Level) may come first - possibly also misplaced on the Wikipedia map. Sorry I have to go out now to visit 99 year old father in law. Will do more digging later.

 

[Calthrop]

Sources would seem to suggest to me, that there are "curves and chords" by which travelling via the mentioned B & M loop -- running via Pontsarn Halt et al -- would bring one ultimately into Merthyr (Plymouth St.) -- in fact, I don't see how else that end could be achieved -- but maybe I've got the wrong and confused end of the stick ?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I inadvertantly appear to have opened a hornet's nest with the various alternative possibilities that could work towards a conclusion on the final part of the final leg of this journey. Mine included Pontsarn Halt, Cefn Coed, Heolgerrig Halt, Merthyr (Plymouth Street).

Therefore, I declare this journey closed at Rhymney Bridge and I have amended the wording of the journey preamble accordingly.

I will set a new journey as soon as possible.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

We next move to England for the next journey.....

This is number 706 in the series so far.....

The journey starts at the closed station of Bolton Great Moor Street
It follows the line of the LNWR Bolton Great Moor Street to Eccles Line
It then follows the line of the Liverpool and Manchester Railway
It then follows the line of the Manchester and Leeds Railway
It then follows the line of the Ashton, Stalybridge and Liverpool Junction Railway
It then follows the line of the LNWR Droylsden to Stockport Line
It then follows the line of the LNWR/NSR Manchester to Stafford Line
It then follows the line of the Grand Junction Railway
It then follows the line of the LNWR Stour Valley Line
It then follows the line of the LNWR Birmingham to Coventry Line
It then follows the line of the LNWR Coventry to Leamington Spa Line
It then follows the line of the GWR Chiltern Main Line
It then follows the line of the GWR Bicester Cut-Off Line
It then follows the line of the Great Western and Great Central Joint Railway
The journey ends at the closed station of South Harefield Halt

The first closed station on this journey is Bolton Great Moor Street

 

[DerekC]

I think it would be very helpful to ask the editors of the Wikipedia Merthyr, Tredegar and Abergavenny page to review and correct the topology of their map. From the research I have done there are a number of things to fix viz:

• The Dowlais Top and Dowlais High Street titles should be transposed
• Pantysgallog Halt Low Level is between Dowlais High Street and Pontsarn Halt
• Dowlais Central was a terminus, not a through station as shown
• The connections into the B&M and MT&A north of Dowlais Central are incorrectly shown
• There wasn't ever a chord between the B&M/LNWR Joint line to Merthyr High Street and the TVR line into Merthyr Plymouth Street

The same area also needs looking at on the Brecon & Merthyr page, although I can't quite see what the problem is.

 

[DerekC]

The first closed station on this journey is Bolton Great Moor Street

Plodder Lane

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Little Hulton

 

[Ash Bridge]

Walkden Low Level

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Worsley

 

[DerekC]

Monton Green

 

[Whistler40145]

Weaste

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Seedley

 

[Whistler40145]

Cross Lane

 

[Calthrop]

Ordsall Lane

 

[Whistler40145]

Manchester Exchange

 

[Calthrop]

I think it would be very helpful to ask the editors of the Wikipedia Merthyr, Tredegar and Abergavenny page to review and correct the topology of their map. From the research I have done there are a number of things to fix viz:

• The Dowlais Top and Dowlais High Street titles should be transposed
• Pantysgallog Halt Low Level is between Dowlais High Street and Pontsarn Halt
• Dowlais Central was a terminus, not a through station as shown
• The connections into the B&M and MT&A north of Dowlais Central are incorrectly shown
• There wasn't ever a chord between the B&M/LNWR Joint line to Merthyr High Street and the TVR line into Merthyr Plymouth Street

The same area also needs looking at on the Brecon & Merthyr page, although I can't quite see what the problem is.

I'm basically a babe in arms, about the intricacies of this part of the railway map -- DerekC, you plainly have a much better grasp of it than I. It would appear to me, that the Ian Allan Pre-Grouping Atlas and Gazetteer; and Tony Dewick's work; basically don't disagree with the Wikipedia diagrammatic map, and all would seem essentially in accord on how to get to Merthyr Plymouth Street from points east of Merthyr; but it could be that I'm in a fog here, and missing sundry things. As a dear goofy friend of mine was wont to say, "It's aw' awf'ly com'-i-cay-id !"

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Manchester Exchange

Miles Platting

 

[Whistler40145]

Fingers crossed with Park?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Correct....

Clayton Bridge

 

[Whistler40145]

Droylsden

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

As we have taken the junction at Droylsden station to the LNWR Droylsden to Stockport line.....

Audenshaw (LNWR)....(1888 to 1905)

 

[Whistler40145]

This is where I might be wrong...Ashton Moss?