Comeuppance! (Passengers traveling in 1st without valid ticket caught)

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Deepgreen

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Just an observation, rather than a plea for advice. Yesterday evening I was on a Southern train from Victoria to Three Bridges, in first class. About five minutes before departure a woman entered and sat down and played with her 'phone, then a youth also entered and sat down opposite me, ominously carrying a fast food bag. As I feared, he proceeded to eat his unbelievably smelly food (chicken in some form, I think) noisily, while perched on the edge of his seat. He kept looking gormlessly around at the compartment while he ate. Within ten seconds of the train starting to move, a uniformed and a plain-clothes inspector entered and asked for tickets. Sure enough, neither had first class tickets - she tried to defend herself by saying there were no seats in standard (!), and followed this up with "you usually let me off" (whatever that meant), and he claimed not to have realised he was in first (despite the fact that he had been staring around the compartment for several minutes beforehand), and that he was only going to Clapham Junction anyway (oh, that's alright then!). Of course, he had no money or ID on him. He paid by card in the end. He also tried to protest that there wouldn't be time to complete the transaction before he needed to get off, but the pair of inspectors worked like a dream and completed it well before Clapham.

Both were charged £20, and both said they would challenge the penalties (on what grounds I have no idea!). Justice served very cold!
 
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Bletchleyite

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Pity it was only PFs. A RoRA prosecution would have been relevant, as there was clearly an intent to travel without paying the correct First Class fare.
 

FenMan

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Pity it was only PFs. A RoRA prosecution would have been relevant, as there was clearly an intent to travel without paying the correct First Class fare.

But both should now be "in the system", unless the woman paid cash.
 

DeeGee

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Remind me next time I travel first class, to buy fried chicken and play with my phone.

It'll do some people's heads in!
 

Deepgreen

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True, next time there will be the chance to prosecute, and I bet there will be a next time.

It would be interesting to know the degree of repeat offending from those who are not 'hard-core' - i.e. those who run a 'campaign' of evasion with anti-social behaviour and so on.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Remind me next time I travel first class, to buy fried chicken and play with my phone.

It'll do some people's heads in!

Buying fried chicken is one thing - eating the stinking grease nodules in a small compartment is another! The same applies in standard, BTW, except there is a greater volume of air to disperse the stench.
 

Bletchleyite

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Merseyrail used to have "please do not eat cooked food on trains" posters. Maybe these need to make a return. I agree eating hot smelly food on trains is antisocial - there is a wide range of quality cold food available without the same issue (egg butties excepted).
 

Deepgreen

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Merseyrail used to have "please do not eat cooked food on trains" posters. Maybe these need to make a return. I agree eating hot smelly food on trains is antisocial - there is a wide range of quality cold food available without the same issue (egg butties excepted).

Mind you - he was on a long journey - from Victoria to Clapham Junction!

LU has reminders about eating "smelly food" - thus incorporating anything hot or cold that fall into the category.
 

Howardh

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Those packs of tuna/mexican salad which come with a fork you get from Lidl smell disgusting.
Taste wonderful!!
Would this fall under a banned category, it's my meal of choice on the road!!
 

bb21

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Both were charged £20, and both said they would challenge the penalties (on what grounds I have no idea!). Justice served very cold!

Considering that she proclaimed "you usually let me off", I think £20 is getting off lightly for her. She had no ticket on at least another occasion so £40 would be justice served imo.
 

Deepgreen

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Considering that she proclaimed "you usually let me off", I think £20 is getting off lightly for her. She had no ticket on at least another occasion so £40 would be justice served imo.

Yes. I did wonder at the time what she meant by that - it's possible her prior incident was a check by the guard, rather than inspectors. Incidentally, she continued to sit there after the inspectors moved on, but met her boyfriend when he boarded at CJ and they both went to standard class. The grease-eating youth also stayed put and was so busy trying to work out how to appeal on his mobile phone that he nearly failed to get off at CJ!
 

matt_world2004

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If you really want to wind up the passengers sit in first class with a high visibility vest on. Its hilarious when they tell you in a condescending manner you are sitting in first class and then when the inspector/guard gets on its them with the ticketing irregularity
 

Phil.

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Whilst I agree with most of the foregoing the staff should also set an example. I travelled between Knebworth and Kings Cross on a Cambridge stopper last summer with two drivers - in uniform - sat in first. I did the same between Horsham and Barnham a while ago again, with a set of crew sat in first.
When I lived in Redhill about the only time that RPIs were seen were the ones on the FGW services. The only Southern ones were an occasional station block.
 

Llanigraham

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Whilst I agree with most of the foregoing the staff should also set an example. I travelled between Knebworth and Kings Cross on a Cambridge stopper last summer with two drivers - in uniform - sat in first. I did the same between Horsham and Barnham a while ago again, with a set of crew sat in first.
When I lived in Redhill about the only time that RPIs were seen were the ones on the FGW services. The only Southern ones were an occasional station block.

Is it a problem that staff were sat in First?
Do you know whether they had permission to sit in First?
 

scotsman

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Whilst I agree with most of the foregoing the staff should also set an example. I travelled between Knebworth and Kings Cross on a Cambridge stopper last summer with two drivers - in uniform - sat in first. I did the same between Horsham and Barnham a while ago again, with a set of crew sat in first.
When I lived in Redhill about the only time that RPIs were seen were the ones on the FGW services. The only Southern ones were an occasional station block.

A lot of train crew are entitled to first class duty travel, sometimes residential and leisure travel as well.
 

bb21

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Even when paying for it? Hot smoked bacon baguettes can be quite pungent. Some of the GWR Pullman dishes have robust flavours. Is eating these anti-social?

I guess one can hardly complain of smelly food in the dining car, not unless one is incredibly fussy.
 

Big Mac

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Merseyrail used to have "please do not eat cooked food on trains" posters. Maybe these need to make a return. I agree eating hot smelly food on trains is antisocial - there is a wide range of quality cold food available without the same issue (egg butties excepted).

I agree that is very antisocial to eat foul-smelling food on trains and I absolutely hate people who do so, especially on short journeys.

There is absolutely no need for it; you're not going to starve to death - wait until you get home and eat something properly, using a knife and fork, rather than stuffing your face with your paws whilst assaulting my nostrils.

I don't understand why the relevant bylaws prohibiting ...causing nuisance or annoyance to fellow passengers... are not invoked and the offender be de-trained at the first opportunity in the case of someone consuming stinking food on board.
 

nickw1

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Those packs of tuna/mexican salad which come with a fork you get from Lidl smell disgusting.
Taste wonderful!!
Would this fall under a banned category, it's my meal of choice on the road!!

(Sorry, I know this is going way away from the original subject of fare-dodging)

This increased intolerance of eating in public places seems to have come in just in the past 10 or 20 years or so. Didn't trains used to have buffets where you could buy hot snacks and take them back to their tables?

Why was there (or at least there appeared to be) more tolerance of eating on trains in the 1980s and 1990s than now?

I fully agree with the smoking ban because of the health effects of passive smoking.... but clamping down on eating certain types of food on the train is going a bit too far. Perhaps something very messy like fish and chips fair enough, but we can't let this go too far. Wasn't eating a bacon butty on a train a very mainstream thing to do in British Rail days?

At the risk of being controversial, maybe people should live and let live a bit more. Sometimes groups of people who have been out on the p*ss and talk loudly annoy me a bit on trains, but at the end of the day it's their right to do this as long as they are not being abusive, racist, violent etc.

And ejecting passengers for eating food, well that sounds like Singapore-style authoritarian extremism! ;)
 
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island

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Even when paying for it? Hot smoked bacon baguettes can be quite pungent. Some of the GWR Pullman dishes have robust flavours. Is eating these anti-social?

I am doubtful that the GWR "bacon" baguettes are suitable for human consumption.
 

gray1404

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I saw a similar think on a Brighton train last week. Southern are having a sweep of the RPIs getting on and just checking tickets in 1st. This was done on departure from Clapham Junction.
 
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ainsworth74

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I'm starting to think I'm the only person whose annoyance with people eating on the train is that it usually makes me hungry rather than leaving me feeling disgusted or outraged or similar!
 

Howardh

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(Sorry, I know this is going way away from the original subject of fare-dodging)

This increased intolerance of eating in public places seems to have come in just in the past 10 or 20 years or so. Didn't trains used to have buffets where you could buy hot snacks and take them back to their tables?

Why was there (or at least there appeared to be) more tolerance of eating on trains in the 1980s and 1990s than now?

I fully agree with the smoking ban because of the health effects of passive smoking.... but clamping down on eating certain types of food on the train is going a bit too far. Perhaps something very messy like fish and chips fair enough, but we can't let this go too far. Wasn't eating a bacon butty on a train a very mainstream thing to do in British Rail days?

At the risk of being controversial, maybe people should live and let live a bit more. Sometimes groups of people who have been out on the p*ss and talk loudly annoy me a bit on trains, but at the end of the day it's their right to do this as long as they are not being abusive, racist, violent etc.

And ejecting passengers for eating food, well that sounds like Singapore-style authoritarian extremism! ;)
Out of what seems the world's most horrendous crimes, eating or drinking hot stuff on trains, feet on seats, sitting on the aisle seat when the window one is free (or putting your bags down) and finally the marks left on windows from greasy hair.....it's the latter three I would make capital offences! The smell of food just makes me hungry, not annoyed!! In fact, if there is a buffet it might lead to pax getting up and spending some cash in it!
 

AndrewE

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When coming north from Euston I drop in to Gupta in Drummond St and get a couple of samosas and some mixed pakhora/bhaji. I'm full and happy soon after departure,while other passengers' tummies are rumbling and waiting either for tea/dinner/supper at home or a trolley to come round. Bad luck if they can smell it, I don't get offered any of their food just because I can smell it!
 

cav1975

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Is it a problem that staff were sat in First?
Do you know whether they had permission to sit in First?

It is a problem in that it brings the concept of paying extra for first class into disrepute. Ordinary "customers" have to pay extra, staff don't even seem to get their entitlement checked when inspectors come round.
 

Llanigraham

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I agree that is very antisocial to eat foul-smelling food on trains and I absolutely hate people who do so, especially on short journeys.

There is absolutely no need for it; you're not going to starve to death - wait until you get home and eat something properly, using a knife and fork, rather than stuffing your face with your paws whilst assaulting my nostrils.

I don't understand why the relevant bylaws prohibiting ...causing nuisance or annoyance to fellow passengers... are not invoked and the offender be de-trained at the first opportunity in the case of someone consuming stinking food on board.

If I leave London at 1630 (as I often do) I won't get home until after 2200, and the one connection I take is too short to find a restaurant.
Am I to be banned from eating?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
It is a problem in that it brings the concept of paying extra for first class into disrepute. Ordinary "customers" have to pay extra, staff don't even seem to get their entitlement checked when inspectors come round.

So you don't know whether they are allowed to be there, but are happy to criticise them?
 
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