Commuting Bracknell to City of London - double my salary...

[billybob22]

Hi,

I've been in the Police now for 11 years, and I'm in a specialist role dealing with Cyber Crime and Cyber attacks, helping big companies deal with attacks, etc... I have 30 more years till retirement - aged 65 and I know there's not much more left for me in the Police. So for a while now I've been looking to leave.

About me

I am 33
No children but plans to in about 2-3 years

Current Situation

Pay is £40k ... this will never go up at my current rank and I have no interest in promotion
Pension which is 12% employer matched

Really easy hours, I currently do 7am-3pm
No stress or pressure
Really nice team that I get on with really well
Good working conditions
I get a work car
Very flexible, I can come in a bit later if I have a Doctor's appointment or something
100% job security
Able to work from home sometimes

Although I am happy, I can't do this for 30 years... people leave, police make changes, things move about, etc...

Also I'm not really progressing much or learning. I've done some qualifications in my own time and with my own money to develop my skills.


New Job Situations

Salary offered is £75'000
Annual bonus of 10% (£7500)
Private health insurance
25 days holiday
Agreement that I can work from home 1 day a week... in time, once the new team is more developed it's possible I can do 2 days sometimes at home.
4% employer matched pension

The job does sound good. I'm first person joining this new team and they want my ideas on training courses we can do, on equipment, software, procedures, etc...


Why I am hesitating.... THE COMMUTE and out of my comfort zone

Everyone I've spoken to says it's a great opportunity and it is. But it's also very scary leaving the Police. A bit like the military I'd imagine, you get so used to being part of the organisation, that leaving is huge.

The commute will be:

Bracknell -> London Waterloo (60 minutes)
Tube on Waterloo and City line to Bank (4 minutes but big queues I think)

I can get a seat going into London but coming back I'd probably have to stand for 25 minutes before train empties.

I'm concerned about the working day. I would get the 7am train in and probably would get home around 7pm, or maybe 8pm on a bad day. That is obviously not taking into account delays or cancellations. I'm worried about the winter months, being stuck on a train, depressed, exhausted and fed up with the daily commute.

Does anyone have experience with this line? Or this commute? Maybe I am making it a bigger deal than it actually is?

 

[billybob22]

Oh and my plan was to do this job for around 12 months and probably look to use my new experience and skills to get a job nearer to home. This job is a great opportunity mainly as it's a chance for private sector experience which I lack, and it's why I've struggled with being offered any jobs until now

 

[Muzer]

I do have experience with a reasonably long commute. Not quite as long a journey as from Bracknell, but I commute from Basingstoke to Bank, which is about 10-20 minutes faster than the journey you're looking at. I can answer a few of your points:

At 8am-ish the Waterloo and City Line will usually be OK. It's not the busiest time for the line (though it's certainly not the quietest) — that would be closer to 9 — and it's been a little while since I travelled at precisely that time but I seem to recall that I'd tend to be able to get on the second train if not the first, with a bit of practice to make sure you stand in the right place for the doors. In general the Waterloo and City line part of the commute is quite reasonable, I tend to find. Getting out at Bank is a pain if you've got some jobsworth on the ticket gates who refuses to let people through the wide gate meaning everyone's queuing up to operate the barriers (though there's a new entrance opening soon directly from the W&C platforms which should alleviate this), but it's otherwise not too bad.

My alternative route for Waterloo & City disruption is probably not the quickest but it's a very easy route; it's to get the Bakerloo line to Elephant & Castle (VERY quiet) and the Northern Line from there (busy but enough people changing that it's possible to get on the first train usually). I've been meaning to try out the mainline route from Waterloo East changing at London Bridge and getting into Cannon Street but the trouble is I tend to be underground already when I find out that the Waterloo & City is disrupted, so I haven't yet had the chance to do that!

In Bracknell you're beyond the junction at Wokingham, so just bear in mind that you might not have many options in case of disruption on the mainline portion of your journey. At Basingstoke I have the option of going via Reading and London Paddington with the ticket I bought. If you can put up with the *occasional* evening more-or-less written off due to serious disruption on the railway then you'll probably be OK, but for some people this wouldn't be good for them.

As for whether you'll be able to put up with commuting that far, I think it really depends on the person I'm afraid. I'm OK with my commute from Basingstoke but I think I'd struggle if it were any longer than it is. Other people though commute from places like Winchester (which is roughly as far as Bracknell in journey time), and I've even got friends who live all the way up in Coventry (much longer when you consider the longer tube journey as well). So Bracknell is definitely on the longer end of commutes, but some people do manage fine. But bear in mind I don't regularly work from home; that one (and later possibly two) day a week working from home might be enough to make it work for you.

I feel you should give the commute a test run (if you can, around the times you would actually do it; but if not, maybe do it at a weekend and just bear in mind that it'll be busier than that in reality), see what it's like, and take a long hard look at yourself to determine whether or not you'll be able to bear it for four days a week.

 

[SaveECRewards]

Another option is to get an annual membership of Santander Cycles (Boris Bikes) and cycle the last bit from Waterloo to wherever in the city your nearest docking station is. It's worth a look at and means you can also save money on your season ticket if you no longer need the travelcard bit on it. This would appeal to me as it's a short cycle and most times would be more pleasant than getting the tube.

 

[Muzer]

Another option is to get an annual membership of Santander Cycles (Boris Bikes) and cycle the last bit from Waterloo to wherever in the city your nearest docking station is. It's worth a look at and means you can also save money on your season ticket if you no longer need the travelcard bit on it. This would appeal to me as it's a short cycle and most times would be more pleasant than getting the tube.

I actually considered this myself, but I decided that I'm not enough of a morning person to want to do this! Also, there were no docking stations near my office that had free spaces around the time when I would usually arrive into work (quite late). I also considered buying a Brompton folding bike and bringing that with me, but I imagine it'll be a pain to lug it around when I'm not using it (eg if it suddenly rains).

If you wanted to save money, as mentioned previously, you could try the Waterloo East-London Bridge-Cannon Street route, but I imagine it'll be slower and less pleasant than the Waterloo & City Line.

 

[CatfordCat]

I have been doing the commute on this line (one of the stations between Reading and Wokingham) for a few years. Bracknell gets 3 or 4 trains an hour during the peak (only 2 an hour stop between Reading and Wokingham)

There have been bad weeks but it's generally fairly dependable give or take a few minutes' delay. If things go really badly wrong, then they allow travel via Reading - Paddington. If this happens and all else fails there is a bus route Reading - Bracknell via Wokingham (so depending on where a problem happens, there may be the GWR Reading - Wokingham - Guildford service running.)

I tend to be a train or so later than 0700 ex Bracknell, but on the trains I get, there's usually as many if not more getting off at Bracknell than getting on, so getting a seat towards London shouldn't be a problem.

I change at Clapham Junction for a south London destination, so can't offer thoughts on the Waterloo and City line.

Coming back, getting on at Clapham Junction can be difficult (not quite so bad now it's 10 car trains) but I tend to allow plenty of time to get to Clapham Junction then get the first train going to Twickenham or Staines and then change there. If you're getting on at Waterloo, if you get to the platform in reasonable time you might even get a seat from Waterloo - some people must do!

On peak hour trains towards Reading, the front carriage or two tend to lose a lot of passengers at Twickenham and Egham, carriages 6 and 7 tend to lose a lot of passengers at Feltham, so it's usually possible to get a seat that far out.

One added pain is royal ascot week - won't make any difference to the mornings, but you'll get hundreds of people in fancy dress in varying stages of inebriation getting on at ascot on the way back, and most will be going to Reading for connections there.

 

[Ianno87]

I don't know what the culture in your new company will be like, but definitely take advantage of the working from home opportunity, and working flexibly.

Remember you've got a decent long train ride - turn up in plenty of time at Waterloo and a seat won't be a problem - and I think SWR have on-train wi-fi now. So, when you can and feel like it, leave the office an hour earlier and do an hour's work on the train instead. Gets you home earlier *and* avoids some of the commute tedium/busy-ness too.

Similarly, the days you don't need to be in at 9am, get up slightly later and start your working day on the train, station coffee assisted.

Any decent boss nowadays realises that no good worker needs to be in 9-5 for the sake of it - often its even counter-prodictive. I've got a laptop, and I'm basically free to work wherever I see fit, the only proviso being the work is done, and done on time to the expectation of the client.

 

[CatfordCat]

Yes, the SWR trains on the Reading line do have wi-fi. It's not entirely reliable - probably about one journey in 10 it doesn't work at all, and on peak hour trains it tends to be so overloaded at the London end of the line that it's not useable.

Not sure how much work you'd get done on the train - the standard class seats don't have proper tables. Most of the 'airline' style seats have small fold down tables. Having a read of something might work (although if it's something highly confidential, the trains might be too full for this to be a good idea) I do see people faffing about with laptops but it really doesn't look comfortable. And isn't great for the person sat next to them either.

One other thought - on the sort of pay on offer, it might be worth thinking about paying the extra and going first class. The seats are a bit more comfy and have tables.

The season tickets from stations like Bracknell are offered either as 'London terminals via Staines' (in this context, 'London Terminals' are Victoria, Waterloo, Charing Cross, London Bridge and Cannon Street) or 'London Terminals via any permitted' (which means you can also go to Paddington via Reading) - or as a London Travelcard (either option) which will include all TFL buses, National Rail, Underground, Overground, DLR and Croydon trams once you're in London.

Having a 'via Reading' ticket costs more but gives you a bit more flexibility (I tend to do it during royal ascot week) - depending on where in the City the job will be, underground (or in the nearish future) Crossrail to Farringdon might be an option - Farringdon is not as far north as the Underground 'map' makes it look.

And if it's not stating the already obvious, if you have a season ticket, you can use it (within the route it's valid for) for shorter journeys evenings and weekends as well.

Or if you're already going to have to drive to Bracknell Station, alternatives might be driving to Twyford or Maidenhead then getting to Paddington / crossrail from there. Or driving south to Brookwood and getting a faster train to Waterloo.

 

[SaveECRewards]

I actually considered this myself, but I decided that I'm not enough of a morning person to want to do this! Also, there were no docking stations near my office that had free spaces around the time when I would usually arrive into work (quite late). I also considered buying a Brompton folding bike and bringing that with me, but I imagine it'll be a pain to lug it around when I'm not using it (eg if it suddenly rains).

If you wanted to save money, as mentioned previously, you could try the Waterloo East-London Bridge-Cannon Street route, but I imagine it'll be slower and less pleasant than the Waterloo & City Line.

My reason was I'd find cycling in the morning less stressful than the tube, the rest is just a bonus. I forgot about the possible issue with full docking stations at your destination. I don't work in the city and the two docking stations nearest where I usually work aren't too busy, but I do remember when I had to be at Bart's hospital for 9am finding a space was very difficult. So much so that someone else had abandoned their bike next to a docking station which means worst case paying TFL for a new bike or best case a few hours hire charges until someone returns it.

 

[TTA]

I don't have experience with this particular commute, but my current one is;

40min train > 6 min train > 15min bus
or
30min train > 30min bus

I don't mind it really, I tend to get in around 8.45 and leave around 4.45. I get to watch a bit of netflix on the journey, or listen to music, or catch up on emails (most days all 3!)

You'll have bad days, but they'll be equalled out by days when everything runs absolutely perfectly and you breeze through it! But having those 2 hours to yourself every day to fill with whatever you want is actually quite nice.

Treat yourself to some nice headphones, and see if your new workplace offers travelcard loans.

 

[billybob22]

I do have experience with a reasonably long commute. Not quite as long a journey as from Bracknell, but I commute from Basingstoke to Bank, which is about 10-20 minutes faster than the journey you're looking at. I can answer a few of your points:
...
I feel you should give the commute a test run (if you can, around the times you would actually do it; but if not, maybe do it at a weekend and just bear in mind that it'll be busier than that in reality), see what it's like, and take a long hard look at yourself to determine whether or not you'll be able to bear it for four days a week.

Thanks for your response. I did the commute actually on Friday but as someone pointed out to me - it was a Friday and so it was quieter and also it was just before a BH, so possibly even more quieter than normal. I could do it again on Tuesday morning if I take the morning off work, but the recruiter needs an answer that day so I need to firmly make that decision.

Another option is to get an annual membership of Santander Cycles (Boris Bikes) and cycle the last bit from Waterloo to wherever in the city your nearest docking station is. It's worth a look at and means you can also save money on your season ticket if you no longer need the travelcard bit on it. This would appeal to me as it's a short cycle and most times would be more pleasant than getting the tube.

Hi, someone else mentioned that too, I'd definitely be interested but my only reservation is getting hot and sweaty. The new workplace doesn't have showers - however they are moving building in August, to a new place about 3-4 minutes walk away. That's because they're are massively running out of space due to increasing the staff. I'll have to see if the new place has showers.

I don't know what the culture in your new company will be like, but definitely take advantage of the working from home opportunity, and working flexibly.

Remember you've got a decent long train ride - turn up in plenty of time at Waterloo and a seat won't be a problem - and I think SWR have on-train wi-fi now. So, when you can and feel like it, leave the office an hour earlier and do an hour's work on the train instead. Gets you home earlier *and* avoids some of the commute tedium/busy-ness too.

Similarly, the days you don't need to be in at 9am, get up slightly later and start your working day on the train, station coffee assisted.

Any decent boss nowadays realises that no good worker needs to be in 9-5 for the sake of it - often its even counter-prodictive. I've got a laptop, and I'm basically free to work wherever I see fit, the only proviso being the work is done, and done on time to the expectation of the client.

Yes that all makes sense. One of the directors who interviewed me states that office hours operate between 7-7 and so if you want to come in at 11 and work till 7 you can, or earlier. However, someone else I spoke to in the company who is on another team said that some work from about 8 and don't leave till about 6ish.

I don't want to be the person that is always out the door like a whippet as they've done their 8 hours. I'd rather be at my desk for 8am and out the door around 5pm... although that's subject to any immediate work, like an incident happening or a meeting that's arranged for that time.

The person that will be my boss seems a genuinely nice guy. He said they're very flexible and the only non-flexible part is if there's something big happening or a job in progress and they need people in.

I'd also like to think that as it's in London, they must be used to train issues, so maybe if there's severe weather they just have an agreement that for 2-3 days staff just work remotely.

Yes, the SWR trains on the Reading line do have wi-fi. It's not entirely reliable - probably about one journey in 10 it doesn't work at all, and on peak hour trains it tends to be so overloaded at the London end of the line that it's not useable.

Not sure how much work you'd get done on the train - the standard class seats don't have proper tables. Most of the 'airline' style seats have small fold down tables. Having a read of something might work (although if it's something highly confidential, the trains might be too full for this to be a good idea) I do see people faffing about with laptops but it really doesn't look comfortable. And isn't great for the person sat next to them either.

One other thought - on the sort of pay on offer, it might be worth thinking about paying the extra and going first class. The seats are a bit more comfy and have tables.

The season tickets from stations like Bracknell are offered either as 'London terminals via Staines' (in this context, 'London Terminals' are Victoria, Waterloo, Charing Cross, London Bridge and Cannon Street) or 'London Terminals via any permitted' (which means you can also go to Paddington via Reading) - or as a London Travelcard (either option) which will include all TFL buses, National Rail, Underground, Overground, DLR and Croydon trams once you're in London.

Having a 'via Reading' ticket costs more but gives you a bit more flexibility (I tend to do it during royal ascot week) - depending on where in the City the job will be, underground (or in the nearish future) Crossrail to Farringdon might be an option - Farringdon is not as far north as the Underground 'map' makes it look.

And if it's not stating the already obvious, if you have a season ticket, you can use it (within the route it's valid for) for shorter journeys evenings and weekends as well.

Or if you're already going to have to drive to Bracknell Station, alternatives might be driving to Twyford or Maidenhead then getting to Paddington / crossrail from there. Or driving south to Brookwood and getting a faster train to Waterloo.

I'll actually be getting on at Martins Heron - that's one stop further from Bracknell and I can walk there in about 8-10 minutes.

In terms of First Class vs Standard Class with underground:

Standard Class via Staines = £4520
Standard Class any route = £5300

First Class via Staines = £7688
First Class any route = £10128

I'd probably just get via Staines, and any major issues I would just pay for a ticket on the day via Reading.

You're right about the seats too, most do have the pull down trays but they're very narrow. I did see quite a few which are single seats - good if I could get one of those.

I don't have experience with this particular commute, but my current one is;

40min train > 6 min train > 15min bus
or
30min train > 30min bus

I don't mind it really, I tend to get in around 8.45 and leave around 4.45. I get to watch a bit of netflix on the journey, or listen to music, or catch up on emails (most days all 3!)

You'll have bad days, but they'll be equalled out by days when everything runs absolutely perfectly and you breeze through it! But having those 2 hours to yourself every day to fill with whatever you want is actually quite nice.

Treat yourself to some nice headphones, and see if your new workplace offers travelcard loans.

Thanks for your post. They do offer a loan, not sure how it works. I guess you tell them what you need, e.g. £5000 and they give you the money, you buy the card and they take the amount out of your pay? I've read that this actually saves money as you get a discount for the yearly ticket. I think that's right anyway.

 

[billybob22]

I have been doing the commute on this line (one of the stations between Reading and Wokingham) for a few years. Bracknell gets 3 or 4 trains an hour during the peak (only 2 an hour stop between Reading and Wokingham)

There have been bad weeks but it's generally fairly dependable give or take a few minutes' delay. If things go really badly wrong, then they allow travel via Reading - Paddington. If this happens and all else fails there is a bus route Reading - Bracknell via Wokingham (so depending on where a problem happens, there may be the GWR Reading - Wokingham - Guildford service running.)

I tend to be a train or so later than 0700 ex Bracknell, but on the trains I get, there's usually as many if not more getting off at Bracknell than getting on, so getting a seat towards London shouldn't be a problem.

I change at Clapham Junction for a south London destination, so can't offer thoughts on the Waterloo and City line.

Coming back, getting on at Clapham Junction can be difficult (not quite so bad now it's 10 car trains) but I tend to allow plenty of time to get to Clapham Junction then get the first train going to Twickenham or Staines and then change there. If you're getting on at Waterloo, if you get to the platform in reasonable time you might even get a seat from Waterloo - some people must do!

On peak hour trains towards Reading, the front carriage or two tend to lose a lot of passengers at Twickenham and Egham, carriages 6 and 7 tend to lose a lot of passengers at Feltham, so it's usually possible to get a seat that far out.

One added pain is royal ascot week - won't make any difference to the mornings, but you'll get hundreds of people in fancy dress in varying stages of inebriation getting on at ascot on the way back, and most will be going to Reading for connections there.

Thought I'd reply separately to you as you actually use the line I am. Yes you're right, a train every 15 minutes from Martins Heron which is where I'd get on. The same coming back at peak times. If I turn up at Waterloo and a train has just left, then I am obviously likely to get a seat as I will be first on the new train as it arrives. If I arrive and the train is about to leave, then it will probably be full up and I'd stand for about 20-25 minutes until it gets to Twickenham and Feltham.

Catford - do you work in the private sector? If so, what sort of hours do you do, do you find the culture is generally flexible, and understanding of delays?

 

[Ianno87]

What is the price difference between 'London Terminals' and 'Zones 1-6 Travelcard' Season Tickets on your flow?

On mine, I found that paying extra for the Travelcard was poor value for money, compared to getting a London Terminals season then paying an Oyster single each way for the tube part, especially if you're not going to the 'home' office every day.

 

[billybob22]

What is the price difference between 'London Terminals' and 'Zones 1-6 Travelcard' Season Tickets on your flow?

Martins Heron -> London Terminals = £3652 (via Staines)
... WITH a travelcard = £4520

I was thinking that I could go

Martins Heron -> Waterloo
Waterloo East -> London Bridge on overground
That is a 15 minute walk then to Bank ... not too bad and good exercise. Probably the same as waiting for the tube, going up escalators, etc...

 

[CatfordCat]

Thought I'd reply separately to you as you actually use the line I am. Yes you're right, a train every 15 minutes from Martins Heron which is where I'd get on. The same coming back at peak times. If I turn up at Waterloo and a train has just left, then I am obviously likely to get a seat as I will be first on the new train as it arrives. If I arrive and the train is about to leave, then it will probably be full up and I'd stand for about 20-25 minutes until it gets to Twickenham and Feltham.

Catford - do you work in the private sector? If so, what sort of hours do you do, do you find the culture is generally flexible, and understanding of delays?

yes, private sector - flexible in so much as you can start any time you like before 9, leave whenever you have done your hours for the day, so working 0700 - 1500 is fine, working 0915 to 1730 isn't. management stubborn-ness rather than any practical reason (not as if what i do is public facing) and working from home isn't really an option. i tend to do 0900 start, which occasionally goes wrong - what I do is a bit specialised and people are commuting from all round the south east, so there's an acceptance it will go wrong sometimes.

different organisations (or even different bits of the same one) have different outlooks on this - can depend (although not always) on whether the job is public facing / whether there's an expectation that people will be there to answer the phone between X and Y time, whether it's the sort of job where you're expected to be available for sudden meetings, and so on.

there are plenty of people who travel from the Berkshire stations to London on the Reading line, so by today's standards it's not an extreme commute.

on the odd occasions I've travelled from Waterloo in the evening peak, you get a crowd forming on the platform round where each door will be when the train stops, but you'll get the hang of it.

There was a suggestion in the consultation for the December 2018 timetable changes that Martins Heron would be reduced to 2 trains per hour in the peak hours but this seems to have blown over.

Martins Heron -> London Terminals = £3652 (via Staines)
... WITH a travelcard = £4520

I was thinking that I could go

Martins Heron -> Waterloo
Waterloo East -> London Bridge on overground
That is a 15 minute walk then to Bank ... not too bad and good exercise. Probably the same as waiting for the tube, going up escalators, etc...

Sounds reasonable - and worth having a 'pay as you go' oyster card for days you don't feel like walking and either want to get the waterloo and city or a bus from London Bridge (if you're not aware, London buses don't take cash payments any more)

although especially since the London Bridge station rebuilding, it's a fair walk from platform to street at London Bridge...

 

[billybob22]

Sounds reasonable - and worth having a 'pay as you go' oyster card for days you don't feel like walking and either want to get the waterloo and city or a bus from London Bridge (if you're not aware, London buses don't take cash payments any more)

although especially since the London Bridge station rebuilding, it's a fair walk from platform to street at London Bridge...

It's a cyber incident response role, dealing with public sector companies, international governments and some big businesses. I don't believe it's the sort of job where you're suddenly in front of a client. It's more technical stuff to help them with a cyber attack. There will be a bit of oncall stuff, so will presumably get a phone and have to be available just in case.

With it being an IT role it does appear fairly flexible.

My idea of going to London Bridge was on the overground railway... was the bit about a long walk in relation to the underground?

 

[Muzer]

The walk from Waterloo to Waterloo east is definitely further than the walk from Waterloo to the Waterloo & City Line - make no mistake there! Going via London Bridge will save you money, but won't save you time (there's a reason they built the Waterloo & City Line after all!).

Wi-Fi rarely works well on busy trains. I too was under the impression that I could work on a train but I can't even get the VPN to connect most of the time. If I had a company-provided phone I might have more luck using mobile data, but I don't, so I won't.

For me a travelcard is worth it, but your mileage may vary on this depending on how lazy you are

 

[CatfordCat]

My idea of going to London Bridge was on the overground railway... was the bit about a long walk in relation to the underground?

not really - SE Trains platform to street at London Bridge is longer than you'd think now. And SE trains platform to Underground platform an even longer walk.

And (as Muzer has said) is the walk from SWR platform at Waterloo (main station) to SE Trains platform at Waterloo East is a fair distance as well.