• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Confiscated ticket and How to deal with GTR Prosecutions

Status
Not open for further replies.

tony_mac

Established Member
Joined
25 Feb 2009
Messages
3,626
Location
Liverpool
Terms and conditions are not always enforceable, and not everybody always agrees with their actual meaning.
I don't know what the chances of getting the ticket returned are, but if they won't talk to him, then I think it may be worth the relatively minor cost of at least forcing them to address the issue.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
30,692
Location
Scotland
Terms and conditions are not always enforceable, and not everybody always agrees with their actual meaning.
True, though I suspect there have been sufficient challenges to the season ticket T&C's that any flaws would already have been discovered.
I don't know what the chances of getting the ticket returned are, but if they won't talk to him, then I think it may be worth the relatively minor cost of at least forcing them to address the issue.
As they say, nothing ventured nothing gained.
 

Starmill

Veteran Member
Fares Advisor
Joined
18 May 2012
Messages
23,224
Location
Bolton
I can predict the response to this, but these are my views and I'm entiled to them regardless. This condition is too excessively weighted against the passenger. There might be nothing they have really done wrong but still they lose thousands and thousands of pounds and this is completely within the rules for the TOCs to keep it all.

Even if the OP had comitted some terrible indesrection, this would be a disproportionate punishment, and much more than a simple Penalty Fare or smaller Out of Court Settlement.

The fact it's allowed appears to me to be down only to the archaic and severely anti-customer nature of the law regarding the railway.
 

PermitToTravel

Established Member
Joined
21 Dec 2011
Messages
3,044
Location
Groningen
Even if the OP had comitted some terrible indesrection, this would be a disproportionate punishment, and much more than a simple Penalty Fare or smaller Out of Court Settlement.

Or indeed much more than the maximum fine that would be imposed by a court in any such case!
 

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
30,692
Location
Scotland
I can predict the response to this, but these are my views and I'm entiled to them regardless. This condition is too excessively weighted against the passenger. There might be nothing they have really done wrong but still they lose thousands and thousands of pounds and this is completely within the rules for the TOCs to keep it all.
Most TOCs will return a season ticket if they are satisfied that the holder is not complicit in its misuse. It is up to the OP to decide which is more important to him - keeping his son out of trouble or the money spent on the ticket.
 

PermitToTravel

Established Member
Joined
21 Dec 2011
Messages
3,044
Location
Groningen
If the holder of the ticket hasn't permitted the illicit use then it's merely a civil dispute, albeit a very high value one.
 

Bletchleyite

Veteran Member
Joined
20 Oct 2014
Messages
97,539
Location
"Marston Vale mafia"
If the holder of the ticket hasn't permitted the illicit use then it's merely a civil dispute, albeit a very high value one.

Or a RoRA prosecution against the misuser of the ticket (rather than its holder)?

One thing that's interesting is that the railway can also refuse to issue another season, even if paid for - do they ever do this?
 

najaB

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Aug 2011
Messages
30,692
Location
Scotland
I agree with this. It seems likely to me, that were the confiscation of high-value season tickets without refund to be pursued through the courts, it would ultimately be found to be an unfair contract term.
I absolutely agree, provided the holder isn't complicit in the misuse of the ticket. I think you'll also find that the TOC will rarely (if ever) permanently confiscate a ticket if that is the case - for example if the ticket was lost and then used by another person.

However if the holder allows the misuse then I think that a court would find the TOC is acting within their rights - high value or not. As I said above, if the father is willing to make a statement to the effect that the son used the ticket without his permission then I would expect most TOCs to proceed with a prosecution, etc. against the son and return the ticket to the father.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top