Could there be an future use for GA Class 317/321s? Suggestions and predictions welcome

[class379]

I really like the 317s but as they are soon to be replaced, can there be any more work for them?

 

[MatthewRead]

I really like the 317s but as they are soon to be replaced, can there be any more work for them?

The best we can hope for is they are sent to Scotland to work with the 318's.

 

[ash39]

Better EMUs than the 317s are soon to be homeless too. So no.

 

[MrPIC]

The really are completely life expired these days, I hope they go direct to scrap

 

[F Great Eastern]

I really like the 317s but as they are soon to be replaced, can there be any more work for them?

The scrapyard and a new life as razor blades.

 

[ExRes]

The scrapyard and a new life as razor blades.

Please don't say that, look what happened when razor blades were suggested for the future of 442s .......

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Given the sclerotic progress with the 710/720 units i suggest they've got a while left yet!

 

[Bald Rick]

The oldest examples are now approaching their 40th birthday, and deserve retirement.

 

[Mikey C]

While we have spare 319s and soon will have spare 321s, let alone newer stock like the 379s, 458s and 707s that will soon be spare, the 317s really shouldn't be needed!

 

[Prestige15]

The 317's will have a new life....as white goods

 

[Panupreset]

Some of them will be around for a while longer yet, mark my words!

 

[Wivenswold]

I doubt they will, they're 33-37 years old. Even the PMI compliant 317s will be gone in 14-15 months. Renatus 321s on the East Side and 379s on the West side will be the last of the old guard and recent murmurings in GA interviews suggest the 379s are staying.

 

[Terry Tait]

I would like to see a working 317 preserved because they are great trains, non of the Mk1 AC EMUS were saved and that was a terrible mistake.

 

[Wivenswold]

I would like to see a working 317 preserved because they are great trains, non of the Mk1 AC EMUS were saved and that was a terrible mistake.

I totally agree. It's a shame National Railway Museum passed on 302 200 but it hadn't had its asbestos removed. One of the MK3-based AC EMUs should be saved or it will be another generation of commuter travel that is lost. I think one of the 317/1s would be best.

 

[dk1]

I cannot imagine why anyone would want them. Theyve done their job but awful units now.

 

[chubs]

As said, razor blades.

 

[306024]

Would have thought there’s better EMUs to have properly preserved than a 317, such as the 303 at Bo’ness or 309 at wherever they’ve ended up for example. But unless someone with loads of money and a big garage comes along, dog food tins is the best to hope for.

 

[XCTurbostar]

I totally agree. It's a shame National Railway Museum passed on 302 200 but it hadn't had its asbestos removed. One of the MK3-based AC EMUs should be saved or it will be another generation of commuter travel that is lost. I think one of the 317/1s would be best.

Its unlikely that a complete set will be retained, based on the history of Multiple Unit preservation, its more likely that just a driving end will be kept.

 

[47421]

Under the franchise agreement they committed to PRM mods on 27 units. I think 3 have been sent away so far. No doubt there will be a derogation as the delay to getting 745s and 720s into service means GA need to keep almost all their existing EMUs in service into 2020. Even when all the 720s are in service (will be well into 2021 now) it is likely GA will need some 4 car units to operate Manningtree - Harwich, Wickford - Southminster and Hertford East, as the infra enhancements to accommodate 5/10car 720s on these routes has not happened. Not clear what they will be, on West Anglia decent chance will be 379s but no one knows for sure, perhaps they will keep PRM modded 317s.

 

[F Great Eastern]

Under the franchise agreement they committed to PRM mods on 27 units. I think 3 have been sent away so far. No doubt there will be a derogation as the delay to getting 745s and 720s into service means GA need to keep almost all their existing EMUs in service into 2020. Even when all the 720s are in service (will be well into 2021 now) it is likely GA will need some 4 car units to operate Manningtree - Harwich, Wickford - Southminster and Hertford East, as the infra enhancements to accommodate 5/10car 720s on these routes has not happened. Not clear what they will be, on West Anglia decent chance will be 379s but no one knows for sure, perhaps they will keep PRM modded 317s.

If they keep the 317s their marketing team is going to have to eat a few massive doses of humble pie, but I can't see it happening.

Although saying that it seems they may have already ate a few crumbs of it, as following the previous PR of replacing every single train with brand new longer ones being dropped in favour of saying they were changing every single train for a new one, now the new trains page on the GA page simply says as a title that they are changing every single train.

I guess they may be hoping to slowly tweak their PR rather than having to make a big climb down in the months ahead since their change in wording seemingly indicates the direction of travel that many of us here and in the industry are predicting.

 

[Failed Unit]

That is the problem with EMUs. Never going to be demand on a preserved railway to electrify them. Although some local interest i suspect like many trains before non of them are exceptionally exciting when you consider other stock with the same body shells.

we maybe will regret it in the future. But history shows us the run of the mills EMUs will probably not be done.

 

[yorkie]

It appears we had two near identical threads on this subject.

Rather than merge them, I've designated this one for suggestions/ideas/predictions or anything else of a speculative nature, and the other one (at https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/has-the-future-of-gas-class-317-321s-been-decided.193611/ ) for what is actually happening (if/when the details are known)
.

 

[F Great Eastern]

I assume the title is supposed to read about the 321s?

The 312s were seen off by <<<< about 15 years ago.

 

[Ayman Ilham]

Maybe more electric stock for Northern? Most likely for the ECML locals that run fully under wires (i.e. Newcastle to Morpeth/Chathill/Alnmouth) but currently use diesels, as it would be a great way to increase capacity for Newcastle commuters plus free up the diesels to further increase capacity elsewhere where they're more needed! 317 is reaching retirement age, but the 321 still got life in it like the 319, so I'd say 321 would be perfect for that! Also, transfer the 321/322s Northern currently have from WY to NE as well! Maybe a full Newcastle to Berwick stopper could become of this?

 

[NoMorePacers]

Maybe more electric stock for Northern? Most likely for the ECML locals that run fully under wires (i.e. Newcastle to Morpeth/Chathill/Alnmouth) but currently use diesels, as it would be a great way to increase capacity for Newcastle commuters plus free up the diesels to further increase capacity elsewhere where they're more needed! 317 is reaching retirement age, but the 321 still got life in it like the 319, so I'd say 321 would be perfect for that! Also, transfer the 321/322s Northern currently have from WY to NE as well! Maybe a full Newcastle to Berwick stopper could become of this?

I'd be supportive of the idea in general (plus if the government actually bothered to electrify some actual lines in Yorkshire/Teesside/Tyneside having 321s or something along those lines), but I don't think 321s accelerate fast enough in order to get out of the way of the intercity services on that line.

 

[Ayman Ilham]

I'd be supportive of the idea in general (plus if the government actually bothered to electrify some actual lines in Yorkshire/Teesside/Tyneside having 321s or something along those lines), but I don't think 321s accelerate fast enough in order to get out of the way of the intercity services on that line.

They still accelerate faster than Pacers and Sprinters, surely!