Could TOCs make more use of charter trains?

[Jan Mayen]

Are there any reasons other than cost why TOCS don't hire trains (and crews) from charter operators?
Some of the reasons I can think they might want to do so would be:
Publicity - as an extreme example, hiring the Belmont British Pullman (other takes are available) to do a round trip between X and Y as it's the lines 150th birthday or whatever.

Short spike in demand - so needing extra capacity for the local weekend Airshow

Longer term - where capacity is tight for whatever reason (North Wales Coast this summer, for example).

Or do they do that and I've just missed it?

 

[alistairlees]

It was done between Oxenholme and Windermere a couple of years ago.

 

[Haywain]

It was done between Oxenholme and Windermere a couple of years ago.

That wasn't a hire, it was an operation that was completely separate from Northern.

 

[43096]

Are there any reasons other than cost why TOCS don't hire trains (and crews) from charter operators?
Some of the reasons I can think they might want to do so would be:
Publicity - as an extreme example, hiring the Belmont British Pullman (other takes are available) to do a round trip between X and Y as it's the lines 150th birthday or whatever.

Short spike in demand - so needing extra capacity for the local weekend Airshow

Longer term - where capacity is tight for whatever reason (North Wales Coast this summer, for example).

Or do they do that and I've just missed it?

PRM compliance, or rather lack of, for a start.

 

[zwk500]

Or do they do that and I've just missed it?

It's been done on very limited basis.

Primary issue is Staffing - Charter sets require stewards on every door to prevent window-hanging. There's also issues with the availability of stock, most charter operators don't have more than 3 sets in operation at any one time. On a short term basis, the charter operator is likely to make more money running an actual railtour to the airshow or whatever than operating a relief for the general public. On a long term basis, most Charter operators would struggle to guarantee the diagrams being fulfilled day in, day out with their staff and loco options.

Then there's the issues of the cost of hiring in the sets and the clearance for loco + train. If there's not suitable infrastructure and capacity at either end for runrounds then the train will also need to be top and tailed. Finally, there's the issue of where you stable and service a Class 47 + Mk1s, if they're not reasonably close to the charter depots.