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Creation of class 230 DEMUs from ex-LU D78s by Vivarail

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Bletchleyite

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The 230's are disgustingly hot inside at present. Awful. This needs sorting out.

Oddly I found the one I was on the other day wasn't bad - while they do have insufficient opening windows (because of the door pockets) there was a decent breeze on the move. I can't remember if the "thou shalt not open the window" window on the gangway was open, it probably was, those windows are very effective on the Tube.
 

causton

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The 230's are disgustingly hot inside at present. Awful. This needs sorting out.

They are also really struggling on the heat with overheating engines/gensets.

When I travelled on one the other day, I had to open the gangway doors and stand next to the gangway to get some fresh air in!

Agreed they are pretty well sealed which isn't good in weather like this!
 

DarloRich

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Considering its the hottest day EVER, that is not a surprise!

actually this morning wasn't that bad! They are hot trains in even the most normal of conditions. The last few weeks have been pretty uncomfortable. People are waiting on the platform until the last second before boarding because they have been so uncomfortable.
 

Bletchleyite

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Agreed they are pretty well sealed which isn't good in weather like this!

They're not really sealed but they do have half the windows without openers due to the door pockets. I reckon it would be viable to fit a further 4 openers per coach on the windows replacing the doors, though; these aren't structural.

They do have forced air circulation which is an improvement on 14x or 15x[x<7]. That said, Chiltern-style air cooling would be a good addition and there would be plenty of space for the box.
 

DarloRich

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They're not really sealed but they do have half the windows without openers due to the door pockets. I reckon it would be viable to fit a further 4 openers per coach on the windows replacing the doors, though.

They do have forced air circulation which is an improvement on 14x or 15x[x<7]. That said, Chiltern-style air cooling would be a good addition and there would be plenty of space for the box.

if it is forced air cooling then the air is being forced through a straw by an asthmatic ant and cooled over a furnace!
 

Bletchleyite

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if it is forced air cooling then the air is being forced through a straw by an asthmatic ant and cooled over a furnace!

It's forced air ventilation like older road coaches have (and I think some non-aircon Mk2s), it isn't aircon, it doesn't cool it, it just circulates it. Same sort of thing[1] as on most London buses, which is noisy but avoids that musty smell of wee (not actually wee, just rotting upholstery and damp) you get on most provincial buses that don't have it.

Same system they had in Tube use so far as I know.

[1] Though on London buses it's extractor fans, whereas on 230s I think it's pressure ventilation, so it's sort of the opposite way round. The effect is the same, though - air forced in from outside at outside temperature.
 

causton

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At this rate I'd prefer they just took out the outer pane of glass from one of the original hinged windows and then opened the hinge so we had a nice big hole in the side of the carriage for the air to come through!!!
 

krus_aragon

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Have Vivarail ever put information on the Class 230 air-conditioning in the public domain?
Not much more than its existence, in a press release:

Adrian Shooter, CEO of Vivarail, said “This is a very exciting day for us and we are proud to be supplying the first of the new trains for Wales.

“We know that KeolisAmey want to bring the best new trains to their passengers so our interior layout has been designed to do exactly that. As well as the wide and spacious carriages the trains will have a Universal Access Toilet, WiFi, air conditioning, USB ports and 3-pin sockets. There will be a range of seating layouts and plenty of space for bikes and luggage. With KeolisAmey we have been determined to give passengers the very best travelling experience and the trains they deserve: modern, comfortable, reliable and environmentally-friendly.

Though in the same press release, KeolisAmey are on a slightly different hymn sheet:
Colin Lea, Mobilisation Director, KeolisAmey Wales Cymru, said: “We are proud to announce that KeolisAmey and Vivarail will provide a step-change in passenger comfort and service quality on three North Wales routes (Wrexham-Bidston, Conwy Valley, Chester-Crewe) by introducing these units, fitted with the latest passenger comfort appliances such as power supply at all seats, high-speed Wi-Fi, air-cooling, bike spaces, and a brand new seating layout reflecting the needs of the passengers on these routes.

:rolleyes:
 

jimm

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Have Vivarail ever put information on the Class 230 air-conditioning in the public domain?

Not much more than its existence, in a press release

As has been said many times on this thread already, Vivarail said from day one that customers could specify whatever interior fittings and ventilation systems they wanted on 230s.

LMR chose not to ask for air conditioning or air cooling. Transport for Wales chose to have a system fitted in its sets.
 

samuelmorris

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My daughters are returning home on a replacement bus today. This is the 4th time out of 5 trips in the past fortnight.
I ran some punctuality stats on weekday peak services on the route from the day the 230s were introduced until now. May make for some interesting reading.

A right-time performance of 0% for a full month isn't exactly great, though the rest of the stats suggest your daughters may have been rather unlucky. The 1740 heading east and 1832 back west seem to be the worst offenders.

1640W
RTP: 13% (4% July)
DR15: 17% (21% July)
DR30: 13% (17% July)
DR60: 11% (13% July)

1740W
RTP: 19% (0% July)
DR15: 24% (46% July)
DR30: 14% (25% July)
DR60: 13% (21% July)

1826W
RTP: 44% (25% July)
DR15: 17% (17% July)
DR30: 11% (13% July)
DR60: 11% (13% July)

1929/1930W
RTP: 35% (25% July)
DR15: 17% (33% July)
DR30: 14% (29% July)
DR60: 13% (25% July)


1653E
RTP: 15%
DR15: 20%
DR30: 13%
DR60: 13%

1732/1736E
RTP: 33% (9% July)
DR15: 17% (15% July)
DR30: 13% (9% July)
DR60: 13% (9% July)

1831/1832E
RTP: 42% (9% July)
DR15: 24% (43% July)
DR30: 13% (26% July)
DR60: 11% (22% July)

1922E
RTP: 43% (35% July)
DR15: 6% (9% July)
DR30: 4% (9% July)
DR60: 4% (9% July)

Average across all peak services:
RTP: 30%
DR15: 18%
DR30: 12%
DR60: 11%
 
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andythebrave

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I ran some punctuality stats on weekday peak services on the route from the day the 230s were introduced until now. May make for some interesting reading.

A right-time performance of 0% for a full month isn't exactly great, though the rest of the stats suggest your daughters may have been rather unlucky. The 1740 heading east and 1832 back west seem to be the worst offenders.
Swap West and East!
Yes, interesting, although it should be pointed out that the 1740 ex Bedford is the most popular service year round (with obvious exceptions when schools are in session).
Also timekeeping is poor, from direct observation this is due to painfully slow door operation and overall actual performance in terms of time between stations.
If these items are not addressed then longer scheduled end to end times are inevitable.
It'll take a lot to take this enthusiast off the rails but right now I cannot rely on the service for local journeys let alone as part of a longer one.
 
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