Cricket

[Xenophon PCDGS]

[QUOTE="Old Yard Dog, post: 31]

And I'm strongly against four-day tests because the 5th day provides a goodly bit of insurance against the vagaries of the English weather.

Never a truer word was spoken.

 

[Busaholic]

Middlesex - it's their own fault for not getting their overs in. What's to say the bolt wasn't a bolt of lightning and they went off for rain? Own fault, no excuses.

I've no issue with counties getting docked points for slow over rates, because each county is treated equally in this respect. When it comes to docking points because of the wicket the host county has provided, then it's much more subjective and it never seems to be a county playing on a Test ground that gets penalised, or even considered for penalising. Middlesex were whingeing about the wicket at Taunton in their last match before play had even commenced, which struck me as getting their excuses in early. Leach and Dom Bess showed how the Middlesex batsmen, a few of whom have played for England despite their inadequacies, couldn't play spin, and then Craig Overton outbowled Stephen Finn according to the many accounts I read of the play. I'm entirely neutral between the two counties, by the way: I wanted Hants relegated!

 

[Howardh]

I've no issue with counties getting docked points for slow over rates, because each county is treated equally in this respect. When it comes to docking points because of the wicket the host county has provided, then it's much more subjective and it never seems to be a county playing on a Test ground that gets penalised, or even considered for penalising. Middlesex were whingeing about the wicket at Taunton in their last match before play had even commenced, which struck me as getting their excuses in early. Leach and Dom Bess showed how the Middlesex batsmen, a few of whom have played for England despite their inadequacies, couldn't play spin, and then Craig Overton outbowled Stephen Finn according to the many accounts I read of the play. I'm entirely neutral between the two counties, by the way: I wanted Hants relegated!

Now away counties can choose to bowl, then the state of the pitch becomes less of a problem. We could remove points deductions unless it is genuinely dangerous; and maybe offer incentives to quicken up over rates, we give points for runs and wickets, maybe an extra bowling point if the bowlers manage 18 overs every hour (and not just an average where you can fly through 6 or 7 to improve) when the innings has completed. Allowances for wickets, drinks breaks and such of course.

 

[Busaholic]

Now away counties can choose to bowl, then the state of the pitch becomes less of a problem. We could remove points deductions unless it is genuinely dangerous; and maybe offer incentives to quicken up over rates, we give points for runs and wickets, maybe an extra bowling point if the bowlers manage 18 overs every hour (and not just an average where you can fly through 6 or 7 to improve) when the innings has completed. Allowances for wickets, drinks breaks and such of course.

Like with any new initiative, cricketers/counties get wise to the new procedures and find ways to get round them or exploit them. In the Somerset v Middlesex case, with a 'spinning' pitch forecast and, probably, produced both sides would wish to bat first so that (logically) they would not be batting last. In that case Middlesex would not wish to exercise their prerogative and put Somerset in, so a toss would have to take place. In the event, Somerset won the toss and elected to bat: it's a moot point whether the result might have been different if Middlesex had batted first.

On the general point of points deductions, I'm against them as being artificial and able to be subjected to manipulation.

I believe you're a Lancashire supporter, and I'd just like to say how pleased I was that you beat Surrey and consigned them to third place. A team that has only won one match does not deserve second place (or third, come to that!) which, to me, is an indictment of the bonus point system which allows a team to rack up 5 points for scoring 400 runs in the first innings and then just play for a draw with those extra bonus points. The old protocol of 4 points each for batting and bowling needs urgent re-introduction imo, rather than the imbalance of 5/3.

One final thing, in case anyone interested has missed it. Alex Hales has been exonerated from the Bristol business, apparently without ever being interviewed by the police, but Michael Vaughan in one of his newspaper columns prior to this news ventured the opinion that there was no cricketer in England he'd less like to see out with Ben Stokes in the early hours than Hales, so there must be a lot of background to this story! Kevin Pietersen (I know! I know!) has also written that, having viewed all the video evidence, he is convinced that Hales is as culpable as Stokes. Interesting!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I wonder if the move to Lancashire under a different coaching regime will be of assistance to Keaton Jennings?

 

[Pakenhamtrain]

In the best news of the Ashes so for.....The pool deck is back at the GABBA!!!!!!

Gabba Pool Deck set for Ashes debut

After whetting the appetite last season, the Pool Deck is set to feature at the Gabba again this summer

Every cricket fan's dream of simultaneously taking a dip and having a front-row seat to an Ashes Test can now be realised after Cricket Australia confirmed the return of the Pool Deck at the Gabba this summer.

A popular initiative from last year's day-night Test against Pakistan, the Pool Deck will be reinstalled at the Gabba to give patrons the chance to cool off while watching Australia take on England in the Magellan Ashes series-opener on November 23.

http://www.cricket.com.au/news/gabb...and-brisbane-swimming-odi-bbl-test/2017-10-05

 

[EbbwJunction1]

In the best news of the Ashes so for.....The pool deck is back at the GABBA!!!!!!

http://www.cricket.com.au/news/gabb...and-brisbane-swimming-odi-bbl-test/2017-10-05

That's quite remarkable ... I've seen hot tubs at rugby grounds, but never something like this!

Does a player get extra runs if he hits the ball straight into the pool??

 

[Busaholic]

That's quite remarkable ... I've seen hot tubs at rugby grounds, but never something like this!

Does a player get extra runs if he hits the ball straight into the pool??

Stonegate Eggs used to place three or four giant polystyrene eggs just beyond the boundary at Sussex CC one day matches back about thirty years ago, the deal being that any batsman who smacked the ball into one of them would receive a prize (£1,000 from memory which, if so, represented more than a month's wages for many county pros) but I don't believe they ever had to pay out.

 

[EbbwJunction1]

Yes, I remember hearing about that; here's what the Surrey CCC web site says about it:

Stonegate Eggs

"Long before shirt sponsorship and ground naming rights, Sussex came up with an inventive marketing idea in the 1980s.

You may remember seeing rather large eggs in egg cups peppered around the ground at that time. Don’t worry, you weren’t hallucinating, it was Hailsham-based egg producers, Stonegate who placed 4, 6ft-high plastic eggs on the boundaries either side of the wicket which were moved to whatever ground Sussex were playing at.

A cash prize was given to any batsman who could hit one of the eggs on the full during a Sunday League match! This innovative sponsorship deal gave both Stonegate Eggs and Sussex some great publicity, particularly during televised games when they were clearly visible on the boundary.

No one is entirely sure if any of the eggs were ever hit, although former Sussex captain Paul Parker is believed to have scored a bulls-eye at Eastbourne during a Sunday League match in the 1980s. Where you there to witness it? Let us know.

When Sussex installed permanent floodlights at Hove 13 years ago Stonegate again sponsored the eggs which this time were placed about 14 foot up the floodlight pylons. Again, there was a cash prize for any batsmen who hit one!

Unfortunately, local residents reacted angrily when they went up claiming they had a negative impact on the landscape. One resident called them ‘a nasty, vulgar fairground attraction.’ Ever seen an egg in an egg cup at a fairground? No, neither have we!

Animal-rights protesters also complained, claiming Stonegate used battery farming techniques. Halfway through a four-year sponsorship deal Stonegate pulled out in 2000 and the eggs came down for the last time. Sussex had forgotten to apply for planning permission so they were saved further embarrassment!"

 

[Busaholic]

Yes, I remember hearing about that; here's what the Surrey CCC web site says about it:

Stonegate Eggs

"Long before shirt sponsorship and ground naming rights, Sussex came up with an inventive marketing idea in the 1980s.

You may remember seeing rather large eggs in egg cups peppered around the ground at that time. Don’t worry, you weren’t hallucinating, it was Hailsham-based egg producers, Stonegate who placed 4, 6ft-high plastic eggs on the boundaries either side of the wicket which were moved to whatever ground Sussex were playing at.

A cash prize was given to any batsman who could hit one of the eggs on the full during a Sunday League match! This innovative sponsorship deal gave both Stonegate Eggs and Sussex some great publicity, particularly during televised games when they were clearly visible on the boundary.

No one is entirely sure if any of the eggs were ever hit, although former Sussex captain Paul Parker is believed to have scored a bulls-eye at Eastbourne during a Sunday League match in the 1980s. Where you there to witness it? Let us know.

When Sussex installed permanent floodlights at Hove 13 years ago Stonegate again sponsored the eggs which this time were placed about 14 foot up the floodlight pylons. Again, there was a cash prize for any batsmen who hit one!

Unfortunately, local residents reacted angrily when they went up claiming they had a negative impact on the landscape. One resident called them ‘a nasty, vulgar fairground attraction.’ Ever seen an egg in an egg cup at a fairground? No, neither have we!

Animal-rights protesters also complained, claiming Stonegate used battery farming techniques. Halfway through a four-year sponsorship deal Stonegate pulled out in 2000 and the eggs came down for the last time. Sussex had forgotten to apply for planning permission so they were saved further embarrassment!"

Thanks for that. I'd forgotten they'd move the eggs to Derby, or wherever Sussex were playing. Parker was a superb cover fielder - when Sussex had him and Javed Miandad it was as though they had thirteen players on the field!

 

[EbbwJunction1]

I'm not sure that they moved the eggs to away grounds, just to the home grounds?

 

[Busaholic]

I'm not sure that they moved the eggs to away grounds, just to the home grounds?

Probably my misreading of that Surrey website blog - home grounds would make more economic sense.

 

[EbbwJunction1]

Yes, I can just see the reaction of another club when they turned up with a 6ft plastic egg .... "You want to put it where? I'll tell you where you can put that .... !"

 

[Pakenhamtrain]

Stonegate Eggs used to place three or four giant polystyrene eggs just beyond the boundary at Sussex CC one day matches back about thirty years ago, the deal being that any batsman who smacked the ball into one of them would receive a prize (£1,000 from memory which, if so, represented more than a month's wages for many county pros) but I don't believe they ever had to pay out.

We've had a few in our domestic One day comp. Back when it as the Mercantile Mutual cup they had signs next to the sightscreens and you got prize money for that.

Steve Waugh won 140k with this.
It kept going when it changed to the ING cup with batsman getting 50k if they hit it.

 

[Busaholic]

We've had a few in our domestic One day comp. Back when it as the Mercantile Mutual cup they had signs next to the sightscreens and you got prize money for that.

Steve Waugh won 140k with this.
It kept going when it changed to the ING cup with batsman getting 50k if they hit it.

I was a big Steve Waugh fan (not only because he played a few games for Kent) - great he shared the prize money with his team mates.
Is Brad Hodge still playing? I think he was a few months ago, aged 42 or 43?

 

[Harbouring]

Probably my misreading of that Surrey website blog - home grounds would make more economic sense.

Sussex have a number of out grounds so that would make sense.

These days the players would be hitting these too easily, was at the rose bowl the other week when Chris Gayle hit one onto the roof of the pavilion 80 feet from the crease and 40-50 feet high.

 

[Busaholic]

Sussex have a number of out grounds so that would make sense.

These days the players would be hitting these too easily, was at the rose bowl the other week when Chris Gayle hit one onto the roof of the pavilion 80 feet from the crease and 40-50 feet high.

It might seem so, but Albert Trott is still the only person to have hit the ball over the pavilion at Lord's, and that was in the 1800s!

 

[EbbwJunction1]

It might seem so, but Albert Trott is still the only person to have hit the ball over the pavilion at Lord's, and that was in the 1800s!

On the 31st July 1899, in fact - here's a link to an article from ESPN Cricinfo with the full (and, in the end, a sad) story - http://www.espncricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/463786.html

 

[Howardh]

It might seem so, but Albert Trott is still the only person to have hit the ball over the pavilion at Lord's, and that was in the 1800s!

Didn't Maynard achieve that feat also?

NB about hitting the eggs, I understand those prizes would be disallowed for first-class cricket as it would be deemed an artificial way of influencing the score/game (my words) - in other words it could influence a batsman to play a shot he otherwise wouldn't...sort of thing.

 

[EbbwJunction1]

Didn't Maynard achieve that feat also?

It's the kind of thing that Matt would have enjoyed doing, but it's not the case.

The Glamorgan player who nearly did it was Mike Llewellyn in the 1977 Gillette Cup Final; his shot ended up in the top tier of the Pavilion, but didn't go over it.

 

[Howardh]

It's the kind of thing that Matt would have enjoyed doing, but it's not the case.

The Glamorgan player who nearly did it was Mike Llewellyn in the 1977 Gillette Cup Final; his shot ended up in the top tier of the Pavilion, but didn't go over it.

That was it, Llewellyn. So he nearly mad it but didn't. Mind you, in those days they didn't have bats thicker than the Thames.

 

[Busaholic]

That was it, Llewellyn. So he nearly mad it but didn't. Mind you, in those days they didn't have bats thicker than the Thames.

I think similar has been done a couple of times since but, as you say, it's somewhat less of a feat with those cudgels: incidentally, new laws will slightly reduce the scope of bats shortly, but doubtless technology will find ways past it.

 

[Cletus]

Random NZ news.

In reply to Auckland's 62 all out, Wellington put on 432 for the 1st wicket in their current game. The next batsman in got a duck
Woodcock 151, Papps 315 not out.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/scorecard/ECKO42381

 

[Pakenhamtrain]

I was a big Steve Waugh fan (not only because he played a few games for Kent) - great he shared the prize money with his team mates.
Is Brad Hodge still playing? I think he was a few months ago, aged 42 or 43?

The Strikers did give him the flick last season. Might be still doing overseas stuff though.

 

[Monarch010]

There was an interesting article by Matthew Engel in the Guardian last week.
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/b...is-rotting-destroyed-icc-ecb-t20-test-matches
I hadn't realised until reading it that next summer there are no test matches between 5 June and 1 August. What's going on?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Tour Match...WACA XI v England

Day 1 ended with England 349-6. Cook dismissed by Coulter-Nile for a second ball duck. Stoneman (85) and Vince (82) returned good scores before dismissal. Malan (56) and Balance (51) both "retired out".

 

[Howardh]

The cricket schedule is now such a complete mess I'm surprised anyone can follow it. I'm more interested in the county scene rather than Tests, and of course Lancashire in particular. What to do with the county season? I'd like to see the whole County Championship played, uninterrupted and decided between April and the first week of July. No interference form 20/20 or one-day games, and the season would be quick and have it's own momentum. To get it done I'd go for a first division of 8 teams playing 14 4-day games with two days rest between, and the second division 3 longer-day games (18 games) with two days between, then for the rest of the season you can have the circuses. I would miss the climax to the season being the sinking-sun September games, but I think it would be for the better.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Cricket Australia XI came out to bat in their second innings needing 268 to beat England in a match where they could have given the England team a decent game, but they must have really collapsed in a big way, finding themselves 25-7 at one stage, before being dismissed for a paltry 75 all out.

 

[Pakenhamtrain]

Australia have announced thier squad for The Ashes.
Steve Smith (c), David Warner (vc), Cameron Bancroft, Usman Khawaja, Peter Handscomb, Shaun Marsh, Tim Paine (wk), Mitchell Starc, Pat Cummins, Nathan Lyon, Josh Hazlewood, Jackson Bird, Chadd Sayers.

Why Shaun Marsh is getting another go is beyond me. A fly screen door on a submarine is more useful.

 

[Busaholic]

Australia have announced thier squad for The Ashes.
Steve Smith (c), David Warner (vc), Cameron Bancroft, Usman Khawaja, Peter Handscomb, Shaun Marsh, Tim Paine (wk), Mitchell Starc, Pat Cummins, Nathan Lyon, Josh Hazlewood, Jackson Bird, Chadd Sayers.

Why Shaun Marsh is getting another go is beyond me. A fly screen door on a submarine is more useful.

That bowling line-up looks fairly lethal if they all keep fit. I saw some stats recently on fast bowlers in tests since 2006 and their average speeds and Starc not only came top but did so by being than 2 mph on average quicker than any other. The second on that list was James Pattinson, so England can at least be grateful for his absence from the series.

The respective batting line-ups are much more comparable with each other imo, though home advantage will count for a lot, as will playing 'proper' cricket in recent weeks. A shame that Mooen Ali will probably only have had one short innings before the first Test, though, and Stokes will certainly be missed. I just hope Broad manages to summon something for the first time in a long time!