Crossrail opening delayed until sometime in 2021

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ijmad

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Im wondering if it would be possible to run the existing tfl rail service into liverpool street low level, terminate and turn them there this would allow the liverpool street platform works to be completed and nine cars on the great eastern branch.
I recall reading this was examined as a potential option during the lead up to the original opening date when it became clear the core wasn't ready, and was dismissed for a bunch of reasons, including where the CBTC boundaries are, issues with passenger flow and volumes (it's not expected everyone will continue to get off Shenfield trains at Liverpool Street), location and capacity of crossovers that could be used to reverse the trains, interference with completing work at Whitechapel and testing other services and the Abbey Wood branch, emergency evacuation problems, etc. etc.

Basically a nice idea on the surface but impractical once you scratch it.
 
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hwl

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That would make sense as they could run them to T5 (in addition to T4) and get more income. The recent test ran a 345 test train to T5.
The Heathrow stock depot at OOC is due to close in December for HS2 demolition hence a bit of deadline to meet if possible, it can be mitigated with a lot of effort but far easier to replace both 360s and 332s (or as much as possible if not in total) with 345/ 387 before the end of the year.
WIth TPWS+ HEx 387s just need interiors stuff sorting (many have already been stripped of old seat cover /padding and had the seats moved etc. ETCS on the387s will take longer, but TPWS+ in the Heatrow tunnels is key to getting 345s and 387s working in there sooner rather than later.
 

matt_world2004

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The Heathrow stock depot at OOC is due to close in December for HS2 demolition hence a bit of deadline to meet if possible, it can be mitigated with a lot of effort but far easier to replace both 360s and 332s (or as much as possible if not in total) with 345/ 387 before the end of the year.
WIth TPWS+ HEx 387s just need interiors stuff sorting (many have already been stripped of old seat cover /padding and had the seats moved etc. ETCS on the387s will take longer, but TPWS+ in the Heatrow tunnels is key to getting 345s and 387s working in there sooner rather than later.
The december timetable change still shows 2tph terminating at Hayes. If they are planning 345s to Heathrow I would have thought they would have been extended to terminal 4 in the december timetable change. Especially as TfL are making no direct revenue from the T4 shuttle.
 

kevin_roche

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The december timetable change still shows 2tph terminating at Hayes. If they are planning 345s to Heathrow I would have thought they would have been extended to terminal 4 in the december timetable change. Especially as TfL are making no direct revenue from the T4 shuttle.
As I understand it the running of 345s to Heathrow will not take place in December. The current plan is to make the change around March to Jun 2020, 3 to 6 months after phase 5a is running. At least this is what I saw in the unredacted parts of the plan that was published.
 

4-SUB 4732

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One thing that is obviously intensely frustrating is the fact that this doesn't appear to have an end in sight. Yes, don't promise (again) and then not deliver, but goodness me. What a debacle.
 

kevin_roche

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I wonder if there will be any more information on the Inside Out program tonight? I can't watch it live so will have to hope iPlayer has it later.
There wasn't really anything new. A bit of video showing almost complete Tottenham Court Road Station and a far from complete Bond Street Station.
 

kevin_roche

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I saw this interesting article called "Take a look at the Crossrail station under Bond Street" on the Ian Visits Blog.

So why is Bond Street now famously so late that it might not open with the rest of the line?

Although not announced at the time, a lot of the delay was known about back in 2014 due to a long delay with the initial station box construction and tunnelling. They had expected to catch up the lost time, but that failed to deliver, so a problem back in 2014 cascaded along the timeline to the point where they have barely recovered any of the lost time.
The issue with the tunnelling lays in part with how the station was designed to be built — as a top-down construction from the surface down to the train tunnels. The intention was for the train tunnels to be there when the station box reached deep enough, then they would break out the tunnel linings to create the new platforms.

Not only were there delays in the tunnelling and redesigns required as they found unexpected issues, but they also had to dig more access tunnels — to a higher specification than expected for access tunnels in order to do some additional unexpected works.

Why this wasn’t made clear at the time the delays occurred is what a lot of Crossrail post-mortem reports will be looking at.

In addition to the tunnelling delays in 2014, the Grenfell tower disaster of June 2017 has added to the delays, as new fire safety standards were introduced, and a lot of the final fittings that had been installed at Bond Street (and other stations) had to be removed to install additional layers of fire protection behind them.

It’s not that the cladding used inside Crossrail stations was a problem – as it’s made of concrete — but that the air gap behind the cladding needed additional heat barriers added to stop any potential fire migrating further than had already been designed into the system.
 

gc1982

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Just noticed an Elizabeth line roundel has been installed on the platforms at Chadwell Heath. Just a one off or are they likely to be installed everywhere in the next few months? With opening not until 2021 in the east , seems a bit premature....
 

samuelmorris

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Just noticed an Elizabeth line roundel has been installed on the platforms at Chadwell Heath. Just a one off or are they likely to be installed everywhere in the next few months? With opening not until 2021 in the east , seems a bit premature....
Yeah as per my post last week, they're at several of the eastern stations, along with large 'A' markers at a few locations on each platform. Anyone know what these are for?
 

Bald Rick

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I thought we had a 6-month expected opening window of sometime between Oct 2020 and Mar 2021. Has that recently changed?
TfL Board was today, the papers are available on the TfL website. Theres an update on Crossrail from Mark Wild. I believe that was the source of the BBC story.
 

samuelmorris

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TfL Board was today, the papers are available on the TfL website. Theres an update on Crossrail from Mark Wild. I believe that was the source of the BBC story.
As far as I know though, the only change is just a reminder telling people that it is entirely possible they will miss the deadline. Not that they're expecting to, but that, as you might expect, it isn't an absolute guarantee, which I think is fair enough. That then turns into press sensationalism about it being delayed 'even further' because of the possibility it could be delayed. I suspect in practice it probably will be, but don't the press make a big song and dance about it (I know, it's their job).
 

Bald Rick

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As far as I know though, the only change is just a reminder telling people that it is entirely possible they will miss the deadline. Not that they're expecting to, but that, as you might expect, it isn't an absolute guarantee, which I think is fair enough. That then turns into press sensationalism about it being delayed 'even further' because of the possibility it could be delayed. I suspect in practice it probably will be, but don't the press make a big song and dance about it (I know, it's their job).
Agreed.
 

700007

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Just noticed an Elizabeth line roundel has been installed on the platforms at Chadwell Heath. Just a one off or are they likely to be installed everywhere in the next few months? With opening not until 2021 in the east , seems a bit premature....
These were installed last week including a purple roundel outside the station with a TfL Rail sticker over it, and purple backed signage in the ticket hall. These indeed will be rolling out over the next several months - I would look at Gidea Park next for this treatment...
 

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Mikey C

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Just noticed an Elizabeth line roundel has been installed on the platforms at Chadwell Heath. Just a one off or are they likely to be installed everywhere in the next few months? With opening not until 2021 in the east , seems a bit premature....
Well at least the roundels will be delivered to the new agreed timetable, so I suppose we should be grateful for something... :s
 

357

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along with large 'A' markers at a few locations on each platform. Anyone know what these are for?
These are markers used in the event of a person being hit by a train. They expect staff to establish where the main body parts are, and if it's mainly between the two A's then they will continue running trains on the other two lines.

This plan was met with concern from BTP, staff, and unions. I don't know if it's gone ahead formally or not but they have been trying to implement it for at least 3 or 4 years.
 

samuelmorris

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These are markers used in the event of a person being hit by a train. They expect staff to establish where the main body parts are, and if it's mainly between the two A's then they will continue running trains on the other two lines.

This plan was met with concern from BTP, staff, and unions. I don't know if it's gone ahead formally or not but they have been trying to implement it for at least 3 or 4 years.
Well, that's certainly not the reply I expected... Not saying I don't believe it, but I'm curious to know more, are there any articles about this plan?
 

kevin_roche

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At yesterday's TfL Board Meeting there was an update on Crossrail Costs you can read about it on IanVisits, but the important bits are below.
To reflect the ongoing uncertainty about the opening date, Crossrail’s cost forecasts now contain additional risk contingencies.

In a statement, Crossrail said that current projections show a central cost forecast (including risk contingency) of £15,005m, which is £42m more than the funding committed under the December 2018 financing package. Additional possible scenarios also include a significantly higher level of risk contingency, up to £394 million more than the committed funding, and opening later in 2021, if the potential problems cannot be mitigated away. Crossrail says that it has further work to do to fully develop its cost forecasts and risk mitigation actions including quantifying the potential savings that could arise from their implementation.
 
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