DB now run a lot of the UK rail network

Discussion in 'UK Railway Discussion' started by All Line Rover, 31 Oct 2011.

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  1. All Line Rover

    All Line Rover Established Member

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    It does strike me how much of the UK rail network DB control. An awful lot! :|

    I can understand why they didn't pre-qualify for the ICWC franchise. That would have been a case for the Competition Commission (in terms of controlling both Birmingham to Scotland flows and two Birmingham to London flows, plus a few more).


    Good news for DBUK staff nonetheless! :D
     
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  3. WestCoast

    WestCoast Established Member

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    It's less than First though, isn't it?
     
  4. Minilad

    Minilad Established Member

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    They didn't seem to have a problem with Virgin owning both though
     
  5. Pumbaa

    Pumbaa Established Member

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    Err, says who?
     
  6. All Line Rover

    All Line Rover Established Member

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    The only flow where Virgin controlled both routes was Birmingham to Scotland. They didn't really know what they were doing at first, did they? ;)
    --- old post above --- --- new post below ---
    Mmm, I know. The railways are fast becoming a monopoly! :| Even if First won ICWC, though, I can't think of any competition problems they would have.
     
    Last edited: 31 Oct 2011
  7. Minilad

    Minilad Established Member

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    Virgin have never controlled both London to Scotland routes. But they did control both Birmingham to Scotland routes
     
  8. All Line Rover

    All Line Rover Established Member

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    See edit. ;)
     
  9. WestCoast

    WestCoast Established Member

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    You could just as easily say that Virgin dominated at one time with ICWC and XC, those were two long-distance operators as well.
     
  10. Michael.Y

    Michael.Y Established Member

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    Ah so it's January we get Chiltern. Cool; means us ATW staff can now go to London (admittedly via a ten minute walk interchange at Brum) for free. :lol:
     
  11. Eagle

    Eagle Established Member

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    Don't see why you're complaining about DB when other companies have owned and do own more franchises.

    Quick question: what do the following twelve TOCs all have in common?
    • Central
    • Gatwick Express
    • LTS/c2c
    • Midland Mainline
    • NXEC
    • One/NXEA
    • Silverlink
    • ScotRail
    • Valley Lines
    • WAGN
    • Wales and West/Wales and Borders
    • Wessex
     
  12. MidnightFlyer

    MidnightFlyer Veteran Member

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    Owned by Nat Ex?
     
  13. jon0844

    jon0844 Veteran Member

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    All run by National Express at one time or another?
     
  14. Eagle

    Eagle Established Member

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    Yep. By my reckoning in 2005 they held eight franchises simultaneously (c2c, Central, GX, MML, One, Silverlink, WAGN and Wessex).

    DB hold three and a bit.
     
  15. tbtc

    tbtc Veteran Member

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    Agreed.

    Or various other examples of companies owning two franchises that could have "competed" (National Express owning both London - Southend operators etc).

    The "one company cannot own two franchises near each other" should really be added to the "myths" thread.
     
  16. Eagle

    Eagle Established Member

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    SCT and Thameslink?
    Southern and Southeastern? (And ditto for Connex days?)
    NXEA and c2c?
    WAGN and One?
    VWC and VXC (obviously)?
    W&W and Valley Lines?
    CT and MML?
    CT and Silverlink?
    Northern and Merseyrail?
    Anglia and FGE? (Both were, shortly before the Greater Anglia franchise started, owned by First).
     
  17. tbtc

    tbtc Veteran Member

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    Yup - yet people still cling to the idea that you can't own more than one in an area...
     
  18. Pumbaa

    Pumbaa Established Member

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    All Line Rover - could you please answer my earlier question. With regard to this statement:

    I asked "says who"? The Comp. Commission (to the best of my knowledge) have only investigated First group when they were to be award the Scotrail franchise, purely because they ran most of the buses too.

    Competition for rail is not seen as other operators, it is usually other modes of transport. So I ask again, and would appreciate if you answered, why would it have been a case for the Comp Comm and why are you sure that that was the reason they didn't qualify? There could be plenty of other reasons including not offering each first class passenger their own carriage, or even their own table of 4.

    You either possess information we don't (in which case please share) or you are bandying about empty statements (in which case please stop).
     
  19. sprinterguy

    sprinterguy Established Member

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    The various franchises operated by a single company function as subsidiaries of the parent company, so I don't think that the UK rail network needs to feel threatened by an unexpected incursion from a single company. Though I would like to see more players in the industry, rather than just a few big, predictable names.
     
  20. Eagle

    Eagle Established Member

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    Not quite. Both DB and First own three franchises outright and have a part stake in one other. (First also have a majority stake in an open-access operator, but then again so did DB... :roll:)
     
  21. Nym

    Nym Established Member

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    I'd quite like to see some new names bid for franchises...

    Stobart Group primeraly..

    But I'm supprised we're not seeing the likes of...
    Inital, Mitie, OCS etc. bidding for franchises...
     
  22. Skoodle

    Skoodle Member

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    Don't forget to include LOROL in that too!
     
  23. Pumbaa

    Pumbaa Established Member

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    All Line Rover - as you didn't reply, I'll take it as a given you were talking out of your arse.

    On a side note, the IIP is heavy on the persuasion that DfT should let franchisees be more creative, so maybe we will see some re-entrants (now that Elaine Holt has gone to NX) and some new entrants as well.
     
  24. anthony263

    anthony263 Established Member

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    Seems that DB have purchased Grand Central, if the rumours/reports on WNXX are to be believed

    I guess we will have to wait and see what happens in the next couple of days
     
  25. ajax103

    ajax103 Established Member

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    Hang on a second, how do you know she's gone to National Express?

    She could have gone to any of the Transport Groups, Google doesn't show which group she's now with anyway.
     
  26. Pumbaa

    Pumbaa Established Member

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    A reliable source informs that she has moved to NX to head up their rail bids. AFAIK no official announcement has been made yet, so I remain sceptical. However it is also confirmed on Twitter by various others so the corroboration value of the claim stands up at least to current scrutiny.
     
  27. Minilad

    Minilad Established Member

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    And if that does turn out to be true then hopefully GC will be added to our ever expanding free pass !!8-)
     
  28. HH

    HH Established Member

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    Definitely true. I spoke to a TOC director that knows her well yesterday.
     
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