Derailment at Wimbledon 6/11/17

[HarleyDavidson]

Why would you go the wrong way through platform 5 - surely you would go southbound through platform 7 - there is a route

Perfectly acceptable route from W375 to W197, especially if there's something already in platform 7 (DF), I suspect that the option is seldom used though, but it's a valid & viable one.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

On OTT it's showing from about East Putney through to platforms 3 & 4 at Wimbledon as -EO- would that mean that the juice has been turned off and the -EO- is the signaller's reminder to themself that the juice has been switched off?

 

[Jimini]

Why should it be a higher priority? It's not as if Wimbledon residents don't have enough choice when it comes to transport, they have car, bus, train, tram, cycle & usually tube and as they have Oyster cards they'll be valid on buses & trains, plus any supplementary TRBs that TfL lay on.

Let me get me violin out! How on earth do they cope.

What about all the people traveling to / from stations between Wimbledon Park and Parsons Green then?

 

[HarleyDavidson]

What about all the people traveling to / from stations between Wimbledon Park and Parsons Green then?

Plenty of buses and of course you have the 24x7x365 transportation service called Shank's Pony Express!

 

[bramling]

Plenty of buses and of course you have the 24x7x365 transportation service called Shank's Pony Express!

Oh dear, you do know this is London we're talking about?! It's near enough the end of the world when there's pre-advertised engineering work and someone finds their train unexpectedly terminates "in the middle of nowhere" at somewhere like Golders Green!

 

[Jimini]

Plenty of buses and of course you have the 24x7x365 transportation service called Shank's Pony Express!

Blimey.

 

[TEW]

Perfectly acceptable route from W375 to W197, especially if there's something already in platform 7 (DF), I suspect that the option is seldom used though, but it's a valid & viable one.

I've done it once. It was about 0030 mind, so not much other traffic around. Was certainly rather novel using Platform 5 in the 'wrong' direction.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

Oh dear, you do know this is London we're talking about?! It's near enough the end of the world when there's pre-advertised engineering work and someone finds their train unexpectedly terminates "in the middle of nowhere" at somewhere like Golders Green!

I know the precious little darlings will be exhausted walking a few hundred metres to the nearest bus stop or taxi, my heart bleeds, I mean how do they think people in other cities cope or those of us who live out in the sticks cope!

Just think they'll be helping the obesity crisis!

 

[Jimini]

I know the precious little darlings will be exhausted walking a few hundred metres to the nearest bus stop or taxi, my heart bleeds, I mean how do they think people in other cities cope or those of us who live out in the sticks cope!

Just think they'll be helping the obesity crisis!

Your opinion genuinely disappoints me, to be honest. I get the lack of public transport options outside of London, but this isn’t relevant in this instance, and this is one of the busiest branch lines that feeds into zone 1 that I know. I think you’re staff based on previous posts (please do correct me if I’m wrong of course)? Given the massive volumes of people that the Wimbledon branch moves each day, it should absolutely be a priority that the district line service be restored at the earliest opportunity, no? The fact that LUL prioritise the Wimbledon branch service over the other two speaks volumes. It ain’t quiet!

Yes, there are alternatives with buses, but they aren’t exactly quick, and become massively oversubscribed in situations like this.

Case in point: you commute from Southfields to High Street Ken. What was a 20-minute tube journey becomes a bus journey to Clapham Junction, then a train via the WLL to Olympia, then a bus. Extrapolate that across the network with displaced passengers, and you’ll see the bus network grind to a halt.

Aside from anything else, if you are a SWR member of staff, doesn’t dealing with the thousands of displaced district line passengers make your life more difficult?

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Your opinion genuinely disappoints me, to be honest. I get the lack of public transport options outside of London, but this isn’t relevant in this instance, and this is one of the busiest branch lines that feeds into zone 1 that I know. I think you’re staff based on previous posts (please do correct me if I’m wrong of course)? Given the massive volumes of people that the Wimbledon branch moves each day, it should absolutely be a priority that the district line service be restored at the earliest opportunity, no? The fact that LUL prioritise the Wimbledon branch service over the other two speaks volumes. It ain’t quiet!

Yes, there are alternatives with buses, but they aren’t exactly quick, and become massively oversubscribed in situations like this.

Case in point: you commute from Southfields to High Street Ken. What was a 20-minute tube journey becomes a bus journey to Clapham Junction, then a train via the WLL to Olympia, then a bus. Extrapolate that across the network with displaced passengers, and you’ll see the bus network grind to a halt.

Aside from anything else, if you are a SWR member of staff, doesn’t dealing with the thousands of displaced district line passengers make your life more difficult?

As an ex resident of the poor end of Wimbledon , this disruption is seriously bad news - top of the hill (and a long and steep walk from Southfields is the wonderful 93 route to East Putney - where due to the removal of he reversing bay , there is no service anyway - or a more level walk to the 156 towards Wandsworth ...where the trains would be packed solid in an case. (on a good day)

The station staff at Wimbledon have a hard enough job in any case , any day (and probably live in fear of yet another one uder - of which they have seen too many of late) - and I am sure that dwell times on main line services would have been very poor with all this churn of passengers trying to get to work , or school , or whatever.

 

[bramling]

Your opinion genuinely disappoints me, to be honest. I get the lack of public transport options outside of London, but this isn’t relevant in this instance, and this is one of the busiest branch lines that feeds into zone 1 that I know. I think you’re staff based on previous posts (please do correct me if I’m wrong of course)? Given the massive volumes of people that the Wimbledon branch moves each day, it should absolutely be a priority that the district line service be restored at the earliest opportunity, no? The fact that LUL prioritise the Wimbledon branch service over the other two speaks volumes. It ain’t quiet!

Yes, there are alternatives with buses, but they aren’t exactly quick, and become massively oversubscribed in situations like this.

Case in point: you commute from Southfields to High Street Ken. What was a 20-minute tube journey becomes a bus journey to Clapham Junction, then a train via the WLL to Olympia, then a bus. Extrapolate that across the network with displaced passengers, and you’ll see the bus network grind to a halt.

Aside from anything else, if you are a SWR member of staff, doesn’t dealing with the thousands of displaced district line passengers make your life more difficult?

I think the point is that everything possible will be being done to restore the District Line, I can assure you of that.

However, a derailed train has to be moved, and track, points and most likely signalling and cables will need to be repaired and tested. All this needs to happen safely next to a railway which is still functioning.

It really isn’t the world’s end that a small (though important) part of the District Line is out of action for a couple of days. There *are* plenty of alternative options. Wimbledon has many other services, Wimbledon Park, East Putney and Putney Bridge are within a few minutes walk of other stations. This really just leaves Southfields as being a little isolated, but even that is hardly isolated compared to most national rail stations. It’s a pain for sure, but it’s really not the end of the world.

A more pertinent question to ask is whether it was the right decision for LU to choose to remove reversing facilities at Putney Bridge and/or East Putney. There’s no right or wrong answer to that, just a value judgement based on cost versus benefit.

 

[infobleep]

That's the 21st century London peak.

I thought passenger numbers had fallen on the south west routes.

 

[Lockwood]

How long was the South West cut off from the rest of the network when Dawlish got rather soggy?
Wasn't that pretty much met with the stiff upper lip?

Wimbledon has had disruption for a day and a half and suddenly everyone loses their mind!

 

[Searle]

How long was the South West cut off from the rest of the network when Dawlish got rather soggy?
Wasn't that pretty much met with the stiff upper lip?

Nope, people lost their goddamn minds when dawlish went under. Considering Wimbledon is a hugely busy suburb, I'm not surprised people are annoyed.

 

[Sunset route]

On OTT it's showing from about East Putney through to platforms 3 & 4 at Wimbledon as -EO- would that mean that the juice has been turned off and the -EO- is the signaller's reminder to themself that the juice has been switched off?

-EO- shorthand for engineers occupation aka T3 possession of the line. Most but not all T3 will have the traction current switched off (we have some tunnel inspections that under rule book section T3 that don’t have the traction current isolated). But getting back to your question, the traction current would be off for the re-railing operation.

 

[bonzawe]

Back to the clearance. there may be progress


comparing this to what I posted at 17:00 2L10 has moved one block towards Wimbledon Park.

 

[Lockwood]

I'm guessing that "NOGO" is a reminder to the signaller not to route anything that way, rather than a redacted headcode a la RTT?

 

[dctraindriver]

I've done it once. It was about 0030 mind, so not much other traffic around. Was certainly rather novel using Platform 5 in the 'wrong' direction.

As have I, only once too.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

How long was the South West cut off from the rest of the network when Dawlish got rather soggy?
Wasn't that pretty much met with the stiff upper lip?

Wimbledon has had disruption for a day and a half and suddenly everyone loses their mind!

It just goes to prove a point that Londoners think that they're more important than anyone else. I get an hourly bus service which starts at 0700 & finishes at 1800, a train service that's useless and unreliable, so a car is vital, this lot are whinging about a walk of 15 mins, well it takes me 25 to get to the station an then I'll be lucky if GWR materialises on time, yet people in London whinge if they have to wait more than 3 mins. Oh deary, deary me. So hard done by.

Someone really does need to give them a kick where it hurts to remind them that they are lucky and they have too much, unlike those who live elsewhere have to make do with ½ hourly, hourly, bi-hourly or just a few a day, which is what I get.

 

[Sunset route]

I'm guessing that "NOGO" is a reminder to the signaller not to route anything that way, rather than a redacted headcode a la RTT?

View attachment 39278

Not a reminder “to the signaller” but a reminder set “by the signaller” to themselves and their reliefs.

 

[Lockwood]

I was thinking "to the signaller by the signaller" in my mind.

Also, I see it has moved another berth now.

 

[Dr_Paul]

Why would you go the wrong way through platform 5 - surely you would go southbound through platform 7 - there is a route

I don't know why it did it; indeed, I was rather surprised when I looked out of the window and saw that we had stopped at platform 5. We then moved off, going over to the down fast on the crossover. (When I next alighted at Wimbledon on platform 5, I noticed that there is a signal at the country end of the platform.) Another time I travelled on this service, we went straight across from the District to the down fast at the London end of Wimbledon. This map shows how both can be done.

 

[EAD]

Could we maybe all just calm down a bit? This thread is after all about the derailment and subsequent work to get the line back open. I grew up in mid-Bucks and had no bus service at all (well nearest bus stop was 5 miles away, which rather defeated the object). I have lived in a range of places from village in the Tirol to capital cities and as my alias shows live right near EAD.

I therefore happen to be right next to the affected area and have experience in the deficiencies of transport outside London as well. It is not going to help anyone turning this into a debate on policy decisions taken with deregulation, central v council funding and cities versus more rural areas, i.e. public policy stretching back at least to the mid 80s.

What I will say though is that while WIM has a number of transport options, those are essentially maxed out in the peak - it only takes one to have issues to cause problems. I can tell you first hand that this morning despite being in the pre-rush part of the morning at EAD as I am a daily user so time my journeys and aim for the lighter loaded Chessington trains if possible, the diversion of District line users was causing overcrowding issues not normally present at that time - indeed the crowd control measures were put in place at WIM as is usual when there are issues with one of the lines serving it. On top of that, with the Overground out in part as well at CLJ that caused further issues and demand there too.

My wife works near High Street Kensington so the usual 1 hop down to WIM and District has been replaced by using buses - of course it is great we have them, but essentially the whole area was very busy given may people are displaced from their normal commute so traffic was much heavier than usual, etc. That journey would normally take 45 mins but took almost double today.

Now back to the recovery - seems they are working through the night to see if they can get it back for the morning.

 

[abn444]

A more pertinent question to ask is whether it was the right decision for LU to choose to remove reversing facilities at Putney Bridge and/or East Putney. There’s no right or wrong answer to that, just a value judgement based on cost versus benefit.

I don't know about East Putney but removing the one at Putney Bridge was probably because it was too short. As far as I know, it was only long enough of C Stock when it was in use and D Stock was too long. Now that all the C Stock (and D Stock for that matter) is gone, I should think that the replacement S Stock is longer and therefore too long for it meaning that there isn't much point in it being there.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

Train is now in WPD.

 

[Domh245]

I don't know about East Putney but removing the one at Putney Bridge was probably because it was too short. As far as I know, it was only long enough of C Stock when it was in use and D Stock was too long. Now that all the C Stock (and D Stock for that matter) is gone, I should think that the replacement S Stock is longer and therefore too long for it meaning that there isn't much point in it being there.

You're thinking about the platform at Putney Bridge (which has since become a through platform and the existing one lifted) - there was however another on the bridge itself that could be used by all trains for reversing.

 

[bramling]

I don't know about East Putney but removing the one at Putney Bridge was probably because it was too short. As far as I know, it was only long enough of C Stock when it was in use and D Stock was too long. Now that all the C Stock (and D Stock for that matter) is gone, I should think that the replacement S Stock is longer and therefore too long for it meaning that there isn't much point in it being there.

True in the case of the bay road, however there was also a trailing crossover on the country side of the station, where westbound trains could reverse via a shunt move. This went along with the bay road.

A reversing facility at East Putney wouldn’t go amiss. They need to have interlocking there for the connection to the Windsor lines, so an extra crossover wouldn’t be too much of an extra expense. But it would be another asset to maintain and fail, such is today’s defeatist thinking.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

What they really need there is the bridge over the Windsor lines to be reinstated and the power supply to be upgraded, you could then have an extension of the London Overground service to Wimbledon interspersed with LUL services, best of both worlds.

 

[E_Reeves]

Unless there is a bogie or wheel fault, the it looks like the train either derailed as passed over 738 points or the following fixed diamond, I’m personally going with the fixed diamond.

View attachment 39235

What application is this screenshot from?

 

[Dstock7080]

District Line services restored at 05.15.
Temporary Speed Restriction 10mph Wimbledon Pk-Wimbledon BOTH