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Derailment near Nottingham

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High Dyke

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Services between Nottingham and Newark disrupted after a freight derails.

A freight train has derailed near Carlton.

Because of this, buses are replacing trains between Nottingham and Newark Castle. Journey times may be extended by up to 60 minutes. There is no current estimate for when a normal service will resume.
Source: http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/service_disruptions/today.aspx

Early indications suggest a track fault as the cause. The affected train is 6M35 - 02:02 Humber Oil Refinery - Kingsbury. Two loaded oil tank wagons derailed. (66150 loco involved)
 
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IanXC

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Services between Nottingham and Grantham, and between Nottingham and Lincoln Central are replaced by buses. Tickets are being accepted on East Coast.
 

High Dyke

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Just services between Nottingham and Newark Castle affected. Services to/from Grantham unnaffected apart from possible crew displacement.
 

trentside

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The Planner

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Interesting to know how they would re-rail a loaded 100t oil tank, not the lightest of things or containing the nicest of fluids!
 

IanXC

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Just services between Nottingham and Newark Castle affected. Services to/from Grantham unnaffected apart from possible crew displacement.

Ah, just going on what Look North (Hull) had as their top story(!)
 

CalderRail

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East Midlands Trains have provided the same estimate, via Twitter.

I think that's where the post have got it from.

Interesting to know how they would re-rail a loaded 100t oil tank, not the lightest of things or containing the nicest of fluids!

Think that's definitely a case of pump the contents out first. Probably to a road tanker.

Wonder what the cause is if it's managed to damage a mile of track though.
 

Jordeh

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Hardly an ideal start to Nottingham's reopening after all the disruption and new track laid followed by promises of less delays and improved reliability :lol:
 

BestWestern

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It's quite easy so I'm told to drive a derailed freight train quite some distance witthout noticing. A Driver I know once went for several miles through the night and was only made aware when he was stopped at a signal because he was knocking out all the track circuits as he went. Apparently when he found the offending wagon it was pretty much hanging in mid air on the couplings, the wheels having been destroyed!

I would imagine something similar has happened in this case if it's only two wagons off.
 

AlexS

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As a platform Bert in an area with a lot of freight traffic I was always told in training to pay particular attention to passing freight trains as its quite possible for something to be catastrophically wrong with them without the driving having any idea of it. I always check the wheels are all turning and that there's no funny smells or shed loads etc, and that the train has it's tail lamp.
 

CallySleeper

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I've watched many oil trains thunder past Carlton, never thought this would happen though.

Reports from a few minutes ago that the train is now clear of Carlton LC.
 

trentside

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East Midlands Trains have now published a temporary timetable, expected to be in place until Friday.

Trains will between Lincoln and Newark North Gate, with direct buses running between Lincoln, Newark and Nottingham - plus additional stopping buses between Newark North Gate and Nottingham.
 

anthony263

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The driver is pretty shook up at least from reading his comments on facebook. Luckily he has some very good freinds among his fellow drivers.

As myself and others said to him it could have been a lot worse.

Seems a water main in the area is also damaged.
 
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DarloRich

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Interesting to know how they would re-rail a loaded 100t oil tank, not the lightest of things or containing the nicest of fluids!

surely decant the liquid into a suitable vessel and remove from the scene. I think this was done recently somewhere like Barking after a derailment.

It is then much easier to right the naughty wagon!
 

GazK

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Thanks very much.

sent from my Samsung Galaxy S3 using Tapatalk
 

edwin_m

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I'm arriving Northgate in 5min for a connection to Nottingham. Time to see if the bus timetable is really operating...
 

High Dyke

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East Midlands Trains have now published a temporary timetable, expected to be in place until Friday.

Trains will between Lincoln and Newark North Gate, with direct buses running between Lincoln, Newark and Nottingham - plus additional stopping buses between Newark North Gate and Nottingham.
Nice to see joined up thinking by EMT... Fair enough i can understand that they can't get through to Nottingham using the Midland route, but why cut the service back so drastically? Why aren't they running Lincoln - Newark Castle shuttles (buses from there)? They managed to do it for most of the last 6 weeks, with a viable operating plan! Having the xx.50 bus also call at Newark Northgate just wastes time...especially as the normal train service doesn't call there throughout the day when running from Lincoln - Nottingham etc.
 

David Burrows

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Nice to see joined up thinking by EMT... Fair enough i can understand that they can't get through to Nottingham using the Midland route, but why cut the service back so drastically? Why aren't they running Lincoln - Newark Castle shuttles (buses from there)? They managed to do it for most of the last 6 weeks, with a viable operating plan! Having the xx.50 bus also call at Newark Northgate just wastes time...especially as the normal train service doesn't call there throughout the day when running from Lincoln - Nottingham etc.

Looks an very good service arranged at very short notice. At least it gives an excellent train service from Lincoln to Newark Northgate for once!
 

Kneedown

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Why aren't they running Lincoln - Newark Castle shuttles (buses from there)? They managed to do it for most of the last 6 weeks, with a viable operating plan!

A train from Lincoln can be directly signalled in and out of Newark Northgate. It's a much more complicated operation at Newark Castle that involves clipping and scotching the crossover, with 2 car trains making an additional shunt forward very close to a danger signal in order to clear the crossover. Maybe the mandate/method of working for this move has expired and would take too long to renew it. Maybe Network Rail need the man who did the clipping and scotching elsewhere. It was a planned move for the duration of the blockade with the associated time it took factored in. A lot quicker to have a train in and out of Northgate as it could pick up the opposite direction working without too much delay as trains normally pass one another at Newark anyway.

Hope you understand that waffle but i can't phrase it any better this early in the morning unless i've had my third cuppa!
 

Tomnick

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I can see some of the sense in turning back at Northgate - but some of the connections look awful for journeys between intermediate stations...
 

edwin_m

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As the bus runs through to Northgate I can leave Nottingham at the planned time tomorrow for my journey to Glasgow. Although the bus takes longer there is no need to walk across Newark.

Last night the man in the office at Northgate directed me to Castle as there were no buses running to Northgate. I just caught a bus and I'm not sure what timetable it was running to but I ended up back in Nottingham 15min earlier than if the train had been running.
 

High Dyke

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A train from Lincoln can be directly signalled in and out of Newark Northgate. It's a much more complicated operation at Newark Castle that involves clipping and scotching the crossover, with 2 car trains making an additional shunt forward very close to a danger signal in order to clear the crossover. Maybe the mandate/method of working for this move has expired and would take too long to renew it. Maybe Network Rail need the man who did the clipping and scotching elsewhere. It was a planned move for the duration of the blockade with the associated time it took factored in. A lot quicker to have a train in and out of Northgate as it could pick up the opposite direction working without too much delay as trains normally pass one another at Newark anyway.

Hope you understand that waffle but i can't phrase it any better this early in the morning unless i've had my third cuppa!
Thank you for the response... I am fully conversant with the situation regarding Newark castle, especially during the recent blockade and the method of working that was introduced.

As you should be aware an ECS movement over the crossover at Newark Castle does not need clipping and scotching; however the signalling staff there are quite competent in carrying out such a task, should it be required. The method of working implemented during the 'blockade' worked satisfactorily, apart from the time the TOC were insistent a 3-car unit was used (the clearance only being large enough for a 2-car unit). It should be noted that the 'additional shunt' was only done to afford some protection for the Network Rail staff responsible for clipping and scotching the points for a passenger train movement over the crossover. Normally should a driver stop at the correct part of the platform (i.e. with the front of the train level with the top of the ramp) then a 2-car unit does indeed clear the points, thus allowing them to be reversed. The only issue is if they then need to be clipped and scotched the responsible person is in the dangerous position under the cowling of the unit.

Numerous suggestions were made in the planning of the blockade, with regards to the crossing of trains at Newark Castle... though many of which were deemed unsuitable to either Network Rail, or more so EMT.

Whilst i agree it can be easier to operate in / out of Newark Northgate, subject to the constraints of platform arrangements it was more an observation that once again passengers from Lincoln are treated with contempt by the TOC as regards any journey beyond Newark. There would be no conflict with passing trains, they could operate on the same basis as they did during the blockade. What does beg the question though is the lack of foresight by some...admittedly at short notice...reagrding utilisation of traincrew. For example why put a driver and guard in a taxi from Nottingham to Newark for them to work a train (terminated at Newark Castle) back to Lincoln when the inward crew that brought the train from Lincoln were more than capable of working the revised service back to Lincoln? Better planning and initiative by some may have prevented numerous cancellations caused by crew displacement!
 

Whistler40145

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I don't know if this question has been answered before, so here goes!

In the case of a derailment where a freight train has caused several miles of track and infrastructure damage, does Network Rail claim from the freight operators Insurers for the cost of repairs?

Also, does the local passenger TOC get any recompense towards having to hire in replacement buses?
 

edwin_m

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Whilst i agree it can be easier to operate in / out of Newark Northgate, subject to the constraints of platform arrangements it was more an observation that once again passengers from Lincoln are treated with contempt by the TOC as regards any journey beyond Newark.

While I note your other points, I don't think this conclusion necessarily follows from them. The buses are running through to Northgate, which is a staffed station with better facilities than Castle*. It also caters for those (like me tomorrow) who have onward connections at Northgate but with the extra journey time on the bus wouldn't leave long enough to walk across Newark. I don't think EMT would reimburse a taxi in that situation even if one was available at Castle. I think the only people losing out are those from the Lincoln direction going to Newark itself, who will either have to walk from Northgate or get on the bus for the closer station at Castle.

*let's face it, anything is probably better than the facilities at Castle!
 

WestCountry

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I don't know if this question has been answered before, so here goes!

In the case of a derailment where a freight train has caused several miles of track and infrastructure damage, does Network Rail claim from the freight operators Insurers for the cost of repairs?

Derailment is almost certainly not the operator's fault, so the issue doesn't arise.
Utility workers supposedly created a big hole under the crossing, which unsurprisingly didn't hold 100t wagons up properly... :roll:

[not my picture]
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