Diesel passenger comfort going backwards

[yorksrob]

Is this just a result of increasingly thinner seats to pack more in?

I remember when I got on that Hull Trains loco hauled Mark 3 formation from aaages ago, the seats were ridiculously comfortable (haven't felt seats like that since the Mallard upgrade, brought back memories of the IC Swallow era).

I don't think you can put it all down to that. The 158's, for example pack 'em in fairly tightly, yet the ex TPE ones have some very comfortable cushioning.

 

[Oswyntail]

Slightly off topic but the best ride quality of ANY stock I have travelled on was the 313s circa 1979. Next best - MkIII sleepers mid 80s.

 

[route:oxford]

Was on near 40 year old US stock between Seattle & Vancouver on Friday. The (airline) seats had a quite remarkable pitch - we estimated about 125-130cm.

You'd only manage to get around 36-40 seats in a UK coach like that though.

 

[RobShipway]

Slightly off topic but the best ride quality of ANY stock I have travelled on was the 313s circa 1979. Next best - MkIII sleepers mid 80s.

The class 313's must have changed a lot then as when I went on one through the North London Line prior to them being replaced by 378's, it was the most bumpy ride I had ever experienced on a train and would say that it was worse than being on the 1940's tube trains used in the Isle of Wight.

 

[Schnellzug]

Oh no, I'd concur wuith the 313s. The 70s design of multiple unit has still never been touched for ride quality by anything built since the 90s.

 

[Telcontar]

I've not been on a 313 in a few years, but I found WAGN's 313s to be spacious and comfortable.

 

[LE Greys]

I've not been on a 313 in a few years, but I found WAGN's 313s to be spacious and comfortable.

Surprisingly so, in fact, although the ride does sometimes get a bit hairy at full speed. That's probably a combination of worn running gear and bad track in places. I'd imagine that would apply to NLL units most of all.

 

[Dunderhead]

The 313s certainly aren't spacious now - the gaps between the rows of seats which face each other are only wide enough for one person's legs!

 

[Chrisgr31]

As it's almost all electrified in Kent, it serves quite a surprise when you travel on a 171 from Ashford to Brighton. The seats are comfortable (I don't know why Turbostar seats are better than Electrostar seats but they definitely seem to be) but the vibrating is noticeable and gets a bit annoying after a while.

Well the Turbostar 171s also benefit from only having 4 seats across whereas in parts of the Electrostar they squeeze in 5 seats across.

As a commuter on the Uckfield Line I want to keep our diesel units, dont want it electrified. All we really want is Southern to get rid of the 2 car units they have ansd get 4 car units instead.

 

[supervc-10]

SWT's 159s aren't bad- yes you have the irritating diesel engine shaking the whole coach, but the seats are great*. I miss the Adelentes on FGW too, the refurbished HST seats aren't great.

The best ride I've had on a train is definitely on an ICE3, which was as smooth as an airliner in cruise. Absolutely superb. The TGV Duplex wasn't bad either. I think the trackwork quality makes a huge difference. I've not tried HS1 yet.

I have to say though that in terms of ride quality the Mk.3 is superb. Nothing better than the pre-refurbishment 1st class Cargo-D Mk.3 that Wrexham & Shropshire were using as a standard class coach, complete with the IC70 seating. Smooth and some of the most comfortable seats ever made by man!

*NB if you're over 6'2 then go for a table seat. The seat pitch isn't great in the airline style bits.

 

[Rhydgaled]

Adalante/Coradias are excellent trains, the 175's with ATW are nearly a modernised MK3 carriage inside, seats that line up with windows, hard but well shaped seats, plenty of tables and the same goes for Adalantes.

I don't agree that 175s are excellent trains. The internal layout is nice but the seats backs are too hard. Externally, the ends of the unit are dreadful, who thought such a boring front-end was a good idea, and more importantly who thought building 2/3-car units without corridor connections on the end to permit portion working was a good plan? That is the biggest flaw of the 175 I think, if you don't have corridor connections to permit portion working then the units should have at least 4 coaches, and ideally every unit that doesn't have to go above 110mph should have corridor connections on the ends.

Adalantes (not that I've been on them), Voyagers and Meridians (haven't been on the latter either) are a huge mistake. Underfloor diesel engines for Intercity trains? No thanks.

 

[387star]

I was on a really quiet voyager last summer so it can depend on where you sit I can only presume my coach wasn't powered
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I don't agree that 175s are excellent trains. The internal layout is nice but the seats backs are too hard. Externally, the ends of the unit are dreadful, who thought such a boring front-end was a good idea, and more importantly who thought building 2/3-car units without corridor connections on the end to permit portion working was a good plan? That is the biggest flaw of the 175 I think, if you don't have corridor connections to permit portion working then the units should have at least 4 coaches, and ideally every unit that doesn't have to go above 110mph should have corridor connections on the ends.

Adalantes (not that I've been on them), Voyagers and Meridians (haven't been on the latter either) are a huge mistake. Underfloor diesel engines for Intercity trains? No thanks.

I'm guessing it would be pretty hard to lengthen 175s? All began with the sprinters being 2 cars but at least most had corridor connections!

I assume you would not mind an electric voyager then. Really look forward to this plan to utilise the wires and add a coach and see how the perception of the class might be changed

 

[Rhydgaled]

I assume you would not mind an electric voyager then. Really look forward to this plan to utilise the wires and add a coach and see how the perception of the class might be changed

I would perfer an electric Voyager to a diesel one in many ways, but they would still be too claustrophobic and be uncomfortablly cramped (not enough legroom). An EMU which looks like a Voyager externally but has an interior like a class 175's (but with softer seats) should be great. I think it must be the seats that make Voyagers seem claustrophobic, mark 4 coaches (which I've only been on in NXEC days I think) are tilt-profiled but I wasn't hit by claustrophobic thoughts like I am on Voyagers.

 

[matchmaker]

Slightly off topic but the best ride quality of ANY stock I have travelled on was the 313s circa 1979. Next best - MkIII sleepers mid 80s.

Worst I have experienced was a 303 - in the motor coach. By contrast the trailers had a very good ride - Gresley double bolster bogies.

 

[supervc-10]

Adalantes (not that I've been on them), Voyagers and Meridians (haven't been on the latter either) are a huge mistake. Underfloor diesel engines for Intercity trains? No thanks.

Adalentes are best when the engine under your coach is dead... but they're not bad when operating normally. No Mk.3, but far superior to a Voyager.