Different Driver Depot, Route and Traction cards

[43066]

SE Hastings:

Traction: 375, 377.
Routes: Ore - Charing Cross via Hastings Line (via T Wells) then SEML via Sevenoaks and Orpington.

T Wells - London Bridge (lower) via Redhill and East Croydon.

 

[43066]

EMR Derby:

Traction:
HST, 222,
Routes:
London - Corby, Nottingham and Sheffield via Midland Mainline + Manton diversion
Nottingham - Sheffield via Erewash Valley
Nottingham - Lincoln
Sheffield - Leeds and Neville Hill depot.
(Link dependent)

Also EMR local routes (link dependent) - TBC

 

[rd749249]

Small correction On Elizabeth Line. Those that sign from Paddington to Hayes & Harlington actually sign to West Drayton for turn-back contingencies.

 

[train_lover]

WMR Snow Hill sign 172s only and sign Snow Hill to Great Malvern, Snow Hill to Stratford via Whitlocks End and Dorridge. Also sign Snow Hill to Leamington Spa

Correction to Leamington Spa
They sign Leamington to Stratford via Hatton south junction. Also sign Snow Hill to Stratford via Dorridge

There is a Conductor only depot for WMR at Stourbridge Junction that sign the same as Snow Hill with the addition of 170s and 153s.


Will you be adding in freight depots too?

 

[train_lover]

Additionally to Worcester Shrub Hill sign camp hill

 

[KT530]

To add to the GWR list..

Reading Depot

Traction
16X, 387, 80X*

Routes
Reading - Paddington
Reading - Didcot Parkway
Didcot Parkway - Oxford*
Didcot West End
Reading - Basingstoke
Reading - Newbury
Newbury - Bedwyn*
Reading - Gatwick Airport*
Twyford - Henley-on-Thames
Slough - Windsor & Eton Central
Maidenhead - Bourne End/Marlow

*Link Dependant

 

[43066]

Correction to my earlier post: SE Charing Cross do not sign 377s (apologies).

 

[class ep-09]

I have not seen GWR HSS Worcester Shrub Hill:
Traction 80x
Routes:
Hereford- Worcester Shrub Hill- Oxford - Reading ( via Didtcot avoider and via Didcot station) - Paddington
Worcester Shrub Hill - Gloucester ( via avoider and station ) - Swindon - Didcot ( including Foxal Junction and Didcot West Curve)
Gloucester - Bristol Parkway
Bristol Parkway - Swindon via Hullavington

Worcester Shrub Hill GWR Drivers ( in training) :
Traction 80x
Route:
Hereford - Worcester - Oxford only ( for now)

 

[class ep-09]

I have not seen GWR HSS Worcester Shrub Hill:
Traction 80x
Routes:
Hereford- Worcester Shrub Hill- Oxford - Reading ( via Didtcot avoider and via Didcot station) - Paddington
Worcester Shrub Hill - Gloucester ( via avoider and station ) - Swindon - Didcot ( including Foxal Junction and Didcot West Curve)
Gloucester - Bristol Parkway
Bristol Parkway - Swindon via Hullavington

Worcester Shrub Hill GWR Drivers ( in training) :
Traction 80x
Route:
Hereford - Worcester - Oxford only ( for now)

Also Worcester HSS signs :
Worcester Foregate Street - Tunnel Junction - Worcester Shrub Hill to turn sets around .

 

[Efini92]

99.99% sure Vic don't sign Blackburn to Preston or Farrington curve but happy to be corrected.

You’ll find a large number still sign it from when we had work over that way.

 

[dk1]

GA West Anglia depots (may be slightly out of date):

Bishops Stortford
317/379
Liverpool St - Cambridge North via Lea Valley and Southbury
Branches to Stansted Airport/Hertford East
Coppermill Jn - Stratford (all routes)
Liverpool St - Seven Kings for Ilford CS

Cambridge
317/379
Liverpool St - Kings Lynn via Lea Valley and Southbury
Branches to Stansted Airport/Hertford East
Coppermill Jn - Stratford (all routes)

Liverpool St
317/379
Liverpool St - Cambridge North via Lea Valley and Southbury
Branches to Stansted Airport/Hertford East
Coppermill Jn - Stratford (all routes)
Liverpool St - Seven Kings for Ilford CS

Will be adding 720/755 at some point. Not sure who works the Cl745s through between Cambridge and Stansted, though. I thought it might have been Norwich crews but I suppose it could be with a Cambridge driver. @dk1 will be able to confirm.

Its class 755s between Cambridge and Stansted most of which are an extension of the Norwich services. These are worked by West Anglia based drivers (Cambridge definitely but maybe Stortford too) but Norwich drivers are not permitted south of Cambridge.

 

[dk1]

Thanks, will change.


IIRC it's Cambridge who are working the 745s through to Stansted, but I too am hoping @dk1 will be along to clarify a few things about GA, I'm not 100% on the details I've put down for Norwich, Ipswich and Colchester.
.

They all look good to me. There is however an ex-Anglia Railways depot at Liverpool St who operate 321/745 traction to Colchester Town, Harwich and Norwich.

 

[district]

SE Ashford (non high speed) sign 375 and 377.
Ramsgate to Charing X via Dover or Canterbury West
Ashford to Victoria via Maidstone East
London Bridge to Cannon Street
Bromley South to Blackfriars

SE Tonbridge sign the above, but also sign 465/466 and sign via Redhill to London, the Medway Valley line and to Hastings via Tunbridge Wells

 

[Merle Haggard]

Firstly, thanks to O L Leigh for the explanation of my XC query.

On a point of principle, I've been puzzled for a long time...
Clearly, when the route knowledge of an LM driver is specific about platforms at Shrewsbury one might expect it to be track specific and therefore quite detailed. In BR Railfreight/TLF days the smaller sub-sectors required route knowledge over long stretches of route; for the biggest subsector, coal, there was a sufficient level of traffic to have drivers contained within comparatively small areas without sacrificing efficiency (and a lot of electricity coal was short distance flows as well), but, for the smaller subsectors there may have only been one train a day to each terminal, and those journeys may have been of some distance. It followed that the drivers in these subsectors signed for routes that, though limited in number, involved long distances. I should mention that the aim was to reduce the number of traincrew depots to the absolute minimum - a manager of one subsector, perhaps best not detailed, told the LDC at one particular depot to get very flexible (i.e. sign for all the routes through to terminals) or he'd close the depot and find one that would. The result was that depot then worked radially to distant terminals and was virtually the only depot the sub-sector used. Another subsector which I had more than a little involvement in, whilst not resorting to such tactics, did have drivers working to such a variety of distant destinations that they acquired the alliterative sobriquet the '----- Seagulls' as an un-complimentary description of apparently going ('seen') everywhere.
I think it's implausible that the drivers at these depots could remember every signal, goods loop and recess siding on several hundred miles of line, but what level of knowledge is required to legitimately 'sign' a route? (and I am aware of the practices alleged in some parts of the industry, but I did use the L word).

 

[godfreycomplex]

For anyone interested in ScotRail (current) route and traction knowledge on the non-DOO side, its;

Queen St (80ish drivers in two links, one link does electrics and the other does HSTs) -
Queen St to Perth, Edinburgh (via Croy and also via Cumbernauld), Anniesland, Alloa, and Oban.
156, 158, 170, HST, and 385. Link dependent.

Stirling (sub depot of Queen St, 20ish drivers) -
Stirling to Dunblane / Alloa / Edinburgh / Queen St (via Croy and also Cumbernauld), Queen St to Anniesland.
Traction wise, I think they only work 385s now since they don't work North of Dunblane anymore.

Perth (120ish drivers in two links) -
Perth to Aberdeen / Inverness / Queen St (via Croy only now) / Edinburgh (via Ladybank and also via Stirling), Ladybank to Dundee, and the Fife Circle.
Traction wise, 158 / 170 / HST

Dundee (25ish drivers) -
Dundee to Aberdeen / Edinburgh / Perth, Ladybank to Perth, and the Fife Circle.
Traction wise, 158 / 170 / HST.

Aberdeen (70ish drivers) -
Aberdeen to Queen St (via Croy only) / Edinburgh (via Leuchars only) / Inverness / Fife circle.
Traction wise, 158 / 170 / HST.

Inverness (50ish drivers) -
Inverness to Perth / Aberdeen / Kyle of Lochalsh / Wick.
Traction wise, 158 / 170 / HST.

Edinburgh (160ish drivers in various links with varying routes and traction) -
Edinburgh to Dundee / Fife Circle / Perth (via Ladybank only) / Dunblane / Queen St (via Croy and also Cumbernauld) / Glasgow Central (via Shotts only) / Tweedbank / North Berwick and Dunbar.
Traction wise, class 158 / 170 / 380 / 385 / HST.

Tweedbank (no idea of numbers, sub depot of Edinburgh) -
Edinburgh to Tweedbank / North Berwick / Fife circle.
Traction wise, 158 / 170 / 380 / 385.

Stating the obvious, but Fort William and Mallaig go as far as Crianlarich, Oban go all the way to Queen St, and all only sign 156s. All are sub depots of Queen St.
Wick and Kyle go to Inverness and only sign 158s. Both are sub depots of Inverness.

From another thread and by another poster ofc
In addition to the above
Stranraer sign 156 and Stranraer - Glasgow via Kilmarnock
Dumfries sign 156 and Carlisle - Glasgow via Kilmarnock (also East Kilbride I believe)
Also (sorry I keep getting bits wrong)
London Overground
New Cross Gate
378
Clapham Junction/West Croydon/Crystal Palace/Battersea Park/New Cross to Highbury & Islington
New Cross Gate depot and Silwood sidings.
Chingford
315/710
Liverpool Street to Chingford/Enfield Town/Cheshunt (only via Southbury)
Via South Tottenham
Ilford depot (I think up to Chadwell Heath as well)
As for the other 4 they all sign Richmond/Clapham Junction to Stratford. Euston, Watford and I think the higher links at Willesden sign Euston - Watford. I think it's only Willesden and possibly Stratford that sign Gospel Oak - Barking, although they all sign 710s (again, except possibly Stratford, which is v. small).
Hull Trains
802
Hull - Beverley
Hull - Kings Cross via pretty much every diversion you can think of (Goole, Sleaford, Cambridge, Hertford and others)
They did sign Crofton depot and various diversions thereabouts but not sure now
Bounds Green/Ferme Park depots
Grand Central
Bradford & Sunderland
180
Both sign York - Kings Cross via similar diversions to Hull Trains
Sunderland sign Heaton depot - York via Sunderland and Durham, via Stillington & Dinsdale too
Bradford sign Crofton depot, and Bradford - Doncaster by just about any route you can think of.
Northern
Skipton
150/153/158/331/333
Skipton/Leeds/Bradford FS/Ilkley triangle
Skipton Broughton Road CS
Link 2B do Skipton - Lancaster - Morecambe
Link 2A do Skipton - Carlisle
Link 1 do both

 

[Tomnick]

Firstly, thanks to O L Leigh for the explanation of my XC query.

On a point of principle, I've been puzzled for a long time...
Clearly, when the route knowledge of an LM driver is specific about platforms at Shrewsbury one might expect it to be track specific and therefore quite detailed. In BR Railfreight/TLF days the smaller sub-sectors required route knowledge over long stretches of route; for the biggest subsector, coal, there was a sufficient level of traffic to have drivers contained within comparatively small areas without sacrificing efficiency (and a lot of electricity coal was short distance flows as well), but, for the smaller subsectors there may have only been one train a day to each terminal, and those journeys may have been of some distance. It followed that the drivers in these subsectors signed for routes that, though limited in number, involved long distances. I should mention that the aim was to reduce the number of traincrew depots to the absolute minimum - a manager of one subsector, perhaps best not detailed, told the LDC at one particular depot to get very flexible (i.e. sign for all the routes through to terminals) or he'd close the depot and find one that would. The result was that depot then worked radially to distant terminals and was virtually the only depot the sub-sector used. Another subsector which I had more than a little involvement in, whilst not resorting to such tactics, did have drivers working to such a variety of distant destinations that they acquired the alliterative sobriquet the '----- Seagulls' as an un-complimentary description of apparently going ('seen') everywhere.
I think it's implausible that the drivers at these depots could remember every signal, goods loop and recess siding on several hundred miles of line, but what level of knowledge is required to legitimately 'sign' a route? (and I am aware of the practices alleged in some parts of the industry, but I did use the L word).

As far as I’m concerned, I can expect to be signalled over any running line, loop or siding on any route that I sign. I’ve been in some pretty obscure places during disruption or engineering work, without any drama. The only exception really is where you’ve got a larger depot or complex of sidings which warrants its own entry on the route card, and possibly some stations where there’s a clear division between two parts of a station (e.g. are there any depots who sign only the low level platforms at London Bridge, and not the through platforms?).

 

[43066]

Conversely, I've been told in Virgin days that drivers can be diverted via Northampton without route knowledge providing that they don't make a station call,

I’m not doubting you were told that, but I don’t believe it for one second!

 

[godfreycomplex]

Conversely, I've been told in Virgin days that drivers can be diverted via Northampton without route knowledge providing that they don't make a station call,

I think that might have been a crossed wire. Northampton is simply treated as the "slow lines" at Avanti IIRC so all drivers who sign to London (everyone apart from Edinburgh and Polmadie) sign it. I think the same is true of the West Midlands and via Alsager as well.

 

[Merle Haggard]

As far as I’m concerned, I can expect to be signalled over any running line, loop or siding on any route that I sign. I’ve been in some pretty obscure places during disruption or engineering work, without any drama. The only exception really is where you’ve got a larger depot or complex of sidings which warrants its own entry on the route card, and possibly some stations where there’s a clear division between two parts of a station (e.g. are there any depots who sign only the low level platforms at London Bridge, and not the through platforms?).

Thank you for that, and such conscientious-ness is excellent. However, an acquaintance works for one of the smaller FOCs and sometimes interviews prospective drivers. He mentioned one candidate who'd been driving for another FOC (not one of the infamous operators!) for a while and, when asked about Northampton on the Up answered 'you always get sent straight through the middle road'. But there are 5 loops North of the station, there's also a platform road, and some roads are signalled for use in both directions. Unsettling...

 

[notadriver]

SE High Speed (treated as a separate entity from SE’s “classic” services - HS drivers only do HS).

Depots at Faversham, Ashford and Ramsgate.

Traction: 395s.
Routes: St Pancras to St Pancras via HS1 to Ebbsfleet, North Kent, Chatham Mainline, Ashford - Ramsgate Line - HS1.

Also sign Ashford - Folkestone - Dover Priory via the sea wall.

Also sign the Medway valley line as far as Maidstone West

Perhaps @notadriver could confirm the above.

I’m honoured that you mentioned me - essentially correct but add Faversham to Dover via Canterbury East (Diversionary)

 

[Merle Haggard]

I’m not doubting you were told that, but I don’t believe it for one second!

Thanks for that. I was told it with an air of authority but I have heard and seen, even in print (if RAIL counts!), some unbelievable comments by Virgin spokespeople and I'll add that my list...

 

[PHILIPE]

GWR Amendment. Exeter GWR sign Class 143 Traction (for now)

 

[43066]

(e.g. are there any depots who sign only the low level platforms at London Bridge, and not the through platforms?).

All the Southern drivers who sign London Bridge only sign the low level platforms (not sure which depots - London Bridge will be one (!) Selhurst will be another, Caterham, Norwood, Epsom?).

SE drivers only sign the upper level.

Thameslink sign both AFAIK (all obviously sign the through platforms, not sure if the Kent TL depots sign the lower level).

 

[Merle Haggard]

I think that might have been a crossed wire. Northampton is simply treated as the "slow lines" at Avanti IIRC so all drivers who sign to London (everyone apart from Edinburgh and Polmadie) sign it. I think the same is true of the West Midlands and via Alsager as well.

Right, thanks, just seen your post after my reply above. Makes sense now - as you suggest, the person who told me was confused between 'not signed via Northampton' and 'route knowledge includes via Northampton but not specifically listed'.

 

[peakNed]

All the Southern drivers who sign London Bridge only sign the low level platforms (not sure which depots - London Bridge will be one (!) Selhurst will be another, Caterham, Norwood, Epsom?).

SE drivers only sign the upper level.

Thameslink sign both AFAIK (all obviously sign the through platforms, not sure if the Kent TL depots sign the lower level).

Not strictly true, Tonbridge and Hastings SE drivers sign London Bridge Low Level, as well as the through lines.

 

[43066]

Not strictly true, Tonbridge and Hastings SE drivers sign London Bridge Low Level, as well as the through lines.

Quite right. I even said as much myself earlier re. Hastings signing it!

 

[2L70]

EMR Derby:

Traction:
HST, 222,
Routes:
London - Corby, Nottingham and Sheffield via Midland Mainline + Manton diversion
Nottingham - Sheffield via Erewash Valley
Nottingham - Lincoln
Sheffield - Leeds and Neville Hill depot.
(Link dependent)

Also EMR local routes (link dependent) - TBC

Local link go Matlock and Crewe in addition to core Sheffield - Pancras route and diversions.

 

[Undiscovered]

Talking to an LM driver in the West Mids, he said that they didn't sign Soho N to Soho E, and only the bay platforms at Shrewsbury, and again this would suggest a predictable lack of flexibility.

Drivers should sign into Shrewsbury with Bays and Platform 4 at least. Before lockdown, there was a Saturday service from P4 and the Bay points are notorious for problems.
I'm sure Shrewsbury drivers sign Soho E to N too as I've been in an ECS move that way, recently.

They also sign to Tyseley depot.

 

[irish_rail]

Thanks everyone for all the helpful additions and corrections, this list is getting filled out an awful lot quicker then I expected it to! Is there any chance the admins might consider making this a sticky?



Thanks. I'm assuming traction is 80x, 57, 150 and 158. Do they sign HSTs still or 16x?



They do indeed, or at least 1 of the 3 links does. Typical Chester having their grubby fingers everywhere! I've added it in.


Thanks. Do they sign Stratford as well?

Re Exeter HSS. They sign 143 I think, but not 158 or 16x. They also do sign 2+4 HSTs.

 

[43066]

Local link go Matlock and Crewe in addition to core Sheffield - Pancras route and diversions.

I’ve formed the impression there are three links at Derby:

- intercity only
- mixed local and intercity
- local only
(+ depot driver link who sign Etches Park only).

Might be wrong of course - could you confirm?