Western Sunset
Established Member
This coming Monday is the 45th anniversary of the introduction of 125mph running in Britain. Do any HSTs still regularly run at 125mph in everyday service?
I thought it might be XC, but where exactly? Seems to be Voyagers north of Leeds, so is it south of Derby, Bristol?
The HSTs have two daily return trips to Edinburgh. These operate morning southbound, afternoon/evening northbound.I thought it might be XC, but where exactly? Seems to be Voyagers north of Leeds, so is it south of Derby, Bristol?
Thanks Dan, so between York and Darlington is one stretch. Trying to think if anywhere south of Derby is 125mph rated.
XC are the only TOC to run HSTs at 125.This coming Monday is the 45th anniversary of the introduction of 125mph running in Britain. Do any HSTs still regularly run at 125mph in everyday service?
CrossCountry do between York and Darlington and on the odd section of the ECML in Northumberland, but the majority of the XC route has linespeeds lower than 125mph. The NMT still runs at 125mph too.
Derby-Birmingham is 90/HST 125Thanks Dan, so between York and Darlington is one stretch. Trying to think if anywhere south of Derby is 125mph rated.
110 max, one 7mi section Bristol/Cogload. South of Cogload there is nothing higher than 100 and past Exeter it's mostly lower than that.Thanks Hex. Wondering what Bristol to Cogload Jn is? Can't think much beyond there (if any) is 125mph.
It depends. A small part of the section described as Northumberland is actually in Scotland. There are also still other places where they can work but only occasionally, for example between York and Doncaster or between Bristol Parkway and Swindon.Thanks again.
So basically, HST 125 running is a bit in Northumberland, Darlington to York and Derby to Birmingham (except for the island platform at Burton and the curve at Water Orton). Is that it?
The layout isn't even necessarily the most important factor. What's underneath the track, the types of fixtures, and the general maintenance regime are all pretty important. Depending on the signalling you have also going faster does not necessarily even save time.What is there to stop Bristol-Cogload being 125? Looks as well laid out as Padd-Didcot.
The NMT does.This coming Monday is the 45th anniversary of the introduction of 125mph running in Britain. Do any HSTs still regularly run at 125mph in everyday service?
Yeah i guess the Somerset Levels play a part.. But regards those other issues, how would it be any different to the clearing of other routes for higher speeds? Just the factor it is more out of the way geographically (linking less large population centres etc), so considered not as worth it? Perhaps if it was the only route to Exeter more would be spent on it, maybe resulting in higher line speeds if possible?The layout isn't even necessarily the most important factor. What's underneath the track, the types of fixtures, and the general maintenance regime are all pretty important. Depending on the signalling you have also going faster does not necessarily even save time.
Increasing the linespeed often means compromising the headway (and hence capacity) of the line. Don't get me wrong, you're not going to have a train every 2 mins along the Somerset Levels but it'd certainly not be a straightforward job resignalling the whole lot... for the sake of 15mph on a few fast trains for a few miles.Yeah i guess the Somerset Levels play a part.. But regards those other issues, how would it be any different to the clearing of other routes for higher speeds? Just the factor it is more out of the way geographically (linking less large population centres etc), so considered not as worth it? Perhaps if it was the only route to Exeter more would be spent on it, maybe resulting in higher line speeds if possible?
Apparently XC wanted the line speed increasing around the Barnt Green area, curve radii would take it but the embankment and substrate would not. I guess piles and a concrete slab track bed would work but at what cost.The layout isn't even necessarily the most important factor. What's underneath the track, the types of fixtures, and the general maintenance regime are all pretty important. Depending on the signalling you have also going faster does not necessarily even save time.
It would probably be more useful to focus on clearing the stopping service out of the way than increasing the speed of the fast trains.Yeah i guess the Somerset Levels play a part.. But regards those other issues, how would it be any different to the clearing of other routes for higher speeds? Just the factor it is more out of the way geographically (linking less large population centres etc), so considered not as worth it? Perhaps if it was the only route to Exeter more would be spent on it, maybe resulting in higher line speeds if possible?
Exactly. Just about anything is doable with enough concrete, but is it value for money?Apparently XC wanted the line speed increasing around the Barnt Green area, curve radii would take it but the embankment and substrate would not. I guess piles and a concrete slab track bed would work but at what cost.
Exactly. Just about anything is doable with enough concrete, but is it value for money?
Depends what you count I suppose. Do you count October 1976 as that's when the Western Region commenced with 125mph HST operation or do you count from when HSTs started working NE-SW services, as CrossCountry will be the last 125mph passenger operator.Thanks for all the responses. Good to see they're still in everyday use in passenger service doing what they were designed to do. Wonder if they'll make it to 50 years of 125 running - I'm excluding the NMT in this.
What is there to stop Bristol-Cogload being 125? Looks as well laid out as Padd-Didcot.
I think level crossings also play a part here. From personal experiences of driving that route in Train Simulator 201x at 125mph for fun, between Bristol and Taunton saved around 5 minutes from the normal 30-31 minute journey non-stop, which may not be fully justifiable for investment yet. Also even if 125 were possible now, the only HST operations that are not XC on that route are calling at all the stops, so will either not have time to reach 125mph or only for a brief moment.Yeah i guess the Somerset Levels play a part.. But regards those other issues, how would it be any different to the clearing of other routes for higher speeds? Just the factor it is more out of the way geographically (linking less large population centres etc), so considered not as worth it? Perhaps if it was the only route to Exeter more would be spent on it, maybe resulting in higher line speeds if possible?
Ignoring Train Sim for a moment....I think level crossings also play a part here. From personal experiences of driving that route in Train Simulator 201x at 125mph for fun, between Bristol and Taunton saved around 5 minutes, which may not be fully justifiable for investment yet. Also even if 125 were possible now, the only HST operations that are not XC on that route are calling at all the stops, so will either not have time to reach 125mph or only for a brief moment.
GWR HSTs are restricted to 100 anyway, so that won't make a difference there.I think level crossings also play a part here. From personal experiences of driving that route in Train Simulator 201x at 125mph for fun, between Bristol and Taunton saved around 5 minutes from the normal 30-31 minute journey non-stop, which may not be fully justifiable for investment yet. Also even if 125 were possible now, the only HST operations that are not XC on that route are calling at all the stops, so will either not have time to reach 125mph or only for a brief moment.
Surely the much better acceleration of the 2+4 sets would cancel out the lost top speed over such a relatively short distance?GWRs HSTs are, in 4car formation, restricted to 100mph due to braking force. As a result, its almost impossible to arrive at Highbridge on time, as they use the old 2+8timings so expect you to hit 110, but you can't.
It's hard to see Crosscountry not being tempted to replace them with the 222s when they become available.Thanks for all the responses. Good to see they're still in everyday use in passenger service doing what they were designed to do. Wonder if they'll make it to 50 years of 125 running - I'm excluding the NMT in this.