Do I Have A Seat Reservation Stalker?

Discussion in 'Fares Advice & Policy' started by westv, 7 Feb 2020.

  1. AndrewE

    AndrewE Established Member

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    Unfortunately you never know when a ticket inspector has that sort of personality...
    And if you knew what my ticket had cost me over the last 40 years, and how emphatically the rules have repeatedly been brought to our attention in the recent past, you too would make absolutely sure you complied with every single rule (or even hint, if it seemed fair and accurate) to make sure you didn't get into trouble.
    I was challenged (unfairly) about 30 years ago, luckily my absolutely accurate and justifiable story was eventually accepted and nothing unpleasant followed... other than the initial hauling up before the boss, but it put letters on my staff file and unfairly brought me to the attention of quite senior managers well above and away from my location.
    If a cheap ticket is only valid on the specified train, how is it that being in the specified seat doesn't matter?
     
  2. najaB

    najaB Veteran Member

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    Strange how that post makes following the rules seem like a bad thing.
     
  3. route101

    route101 Established Member

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    Was a bit tongue in cheek.
     
  4. AndrewE

    AndrewE Established Member

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    But how do you know which ticket conditions don't matter and which are unchallengeable?
    Have you ever witnessed the distress of someone who has made a genuine mistake and finds themselves liable for a full walk-up fare? (not even an excess, note.) I have seen lots of people trying to game it, and happily paying up when challenged, but it is a catastrophe for some genuine people and will put them off travelling by train for a long time... Hence the public demand for a simpler and more understandable fare structure.
     
  5. sheff1

    sheff1 Established Member

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    I am not sure what the occupation, or otherwise, of a specific seat has to do with that.
     
  6. trainophile

    trainophile Established Member

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    So if your allocated seat was in a half empty coach but next to a 20 stone smelly unwashed rough looking person you would still sit there?
     
  7. AndrewE

    AndrewE Established Member

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    Aren't advance tickets only valid with/in the reserved seat?
    In that case I would sit elsewhere, but if challenged I would appeal the the guard's better nature!
    As I said, how do you know which rule/condition is rigidly enforced and which one just doesn't matter? No-one seems prepared to answer this.
    My brother-in-law worked in Rome for a few years and couldn't wait to get away: He said there were thousands of rules and laws which were ignored by most people most of the time. You almost settled in to the mentality eventually, except that you never knew which obscure (or obvious) one was going to be implemented without mercy on any particular day, and I think it might have cost him too.
    I suspect that people on the inside (or paying off an enforcement person) might have had advance knowledge of what not to do on any particular day!
     
  8. 47271

    47271 Established Member

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    How else would they find anyone to sit in Coach G of a Pendolino unless it was all people who don't fancy their allocated seat in H or J?

    Or now a I make a beeline to M in an Azuma for the same reason.

    I must sit in the wrong seat as often as three or four times a week.

    If a guard ever asked me why I was in the wrong, but unreserved, seat I would just say 'sorry, I must be confused. Would you like me to move?' They're going to say don't bother. Are they really going to dish a penalty for that?

    This really isn't something that any of us need to worry about.
     
  9. trainophile

    trainophile Established Member

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    I doubt a guard even looks at the seat number on your ticket, they are only interested in you being on the right train with an Advance ticket. The only time it might be an issue is if another passenger is trying to claim it.

    They certainly aren’t going to argue with “the sun was in my eyes” or “going backwards makes me feel ill”.

    Also, at the risk of starting sexist wars, if you’re a man and allocated a seat next to a lone lady when there’s empty pairs all over the coach, it would be a bit disrespectful to sit beside her. As a female I wouldn’t sit next to a man either if it was obvious there were plenty of other vacant seats. For one thing if someone is working on a laptop it can make them uncomfortable.
     
  10. HSP 2

    HSP 2 On Moderation

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    I have been on journeys and hear the tickets and passes please and been ask to see my ticket not a problem and then been asked to show my reservation ticket, I will always do so, but I normally ask if there's a problem? Answer, just checking sir.
    I've just had a look at some of my old tickets and some have the coach
    letter
    and seat number printed on the front.
    So sometimes it's two tickets and some times it one. Why?
    I normally do sit in the correct seat , but if all I can see is the back of a grey pillar I will move.
     
  11. sheff1

    sheff1 Established Member

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    What a strange statement. On many occasions over the years I have been joined by a 'lone lady' taking her allocated seat and the thought that she was being disrespectful never entered my head. Sometimes the chance encounter has resulted in interesting conversations to pass the journey away and, on others, we have not exchanged a word.
     
  12. MikeWh

    MikeWh Established Member Senior Fares Advisor

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    Different systems. The old one printed reservation details on a separate coupon, the new one combines both ticket and reservations on one coupon.
     
  13. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    It is, sort of, etiquette, that one shouldn't sit next to (or directly opposite in the case of facing seats) *anyone* if there are other seats available that avoid this - especially on lightly loaded services.

    People generally expect it to happen on busy services and this isn't an issue, but at other times I think most people would certainly regard it as a bit odd.

    I'd certainly avoid doing it, even if it meant choosing a less preferable seat.

    Some people seem completely oblivious to this basic courtesy though.
     
  14. najaB

    najaB Veteran Member

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    It's more a cultural thing than anything. In many cultures people wouldn't think anything of it at all.
     
  15. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    These cultures would do well to learn it. Respecting the personal space of others is a pretty civilised thing to be doing, one of those little things which ultimately makes life more pleasant for *everyone*.
     
  16. trainophile

    trainophile Established Member

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    I'm surprised anyone would choose to sit next to a stranger when there are plenty of spare seats. It's different if the train is packed, but where it isn't then why would you, unless you are socially inept?
     
  17. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    Railway staff don’t understand many of the things people do on the railway, but do them they do!
     
  18. trainophile

    trainophile Established Member

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    Don't railway staff ever travel on trains for leisure then?
     
  19. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    Staff have a rather more grandstand view of the things some people do. Most will give up asking “why” pretty quickly...
     
  20. najaB

    najaB Veteran Member

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    Some of those cultures were 'civilised' while Europeans still were walking around wearing animal pelts. There's more than one concept of civilisation. Anyway, I'm going to leave it at that.
     
  21. Ianno87

    Ianno87 Established Member

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    Our (UK) culture would do well to stop telling other cultures they're wrong all the time. We ain't an Empire any more.
     
  22. sheff1

    sheff1 Established Member

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    Some people (including posters in this thread) want to sit in their reserved seat at all times.

    You may consider it socially inept to put yourself in a position where a stranger might talk to you, but that probably says more about you than the various women who have sat next to me on trains and with whom I have had interesting conversations (some started by them, some by me). I could relate stories of overnight train journeys in Germany and Austria back in the 70s but, apparently, those foreigners lacked basic courtesy as well as being socially inept, so I won't.
     
  23. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    What on earth does respecting the personal space of someone else, which is simply a decent and sensible thing to do, got to do with an Empire which is irrelevant to everyone now alive in this country?

    I get sick of this constantly being brought up when it’s something which existed before my lifetime, so is completely irrelevant to all of us. Does someone have a hang-up about it?

    Just to clarify, are you seriously saying that because of the existence of an empire, many years ago, that it’s unreasonable for me to criticise cultures which (apparently) fail to show respect to others?

    To be honest I don’t really see what culture has to do with it (I wasn’t the one who raised the notion). If person A can’t show a level of respect towards the comfort of person B then I don’t see why it matters what “culture” they’re claimed to be from.
     
    Last edited: 15 Feb 2020 at 00:43
  24. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    Not everyone wants random conversation, either all or some of the time, people should respect that.
     
  25. sheff1

    sheff1 Established Member

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    Indeed, and not respecting that wish is where social ineptness comes in.
     
    Last edited: 14 Feb 2020 at 23:14
  26. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    Quite so.

    If I’ve had a long and busy day at work and go home with numbers and times spinning round in the head then the absolute last thing I want is someone sitting next to me and starting a conversation, no matter how enriching that conversation might be in different circumstances.

    Let’s face it, few actively *want* to be on a train at all, especially going to or from work. For most people it’s a means to an end. Even for those of us who have railways in the blood it’s still a chore at times. Why does it seem so hard for some to grasp that everyone should do their little bit to make the activity as painless as possible for everyone?
     
  27. najaB

    najaB Veteran Member

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    I know I said I was out of this thread, but...

    Familiar does not equate to correct and different does not equate to wrong.
     
  28. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    I think your premise there is totally flawed, as you’re straight away biasing things towards one outcome.

    I could happily go with “Familiar may not equate to correct and different may not equate to wrong”.

    However the fact you’re seemingly going down the road of familiar always being wrong is, IMHO, rather telling.

    There’s cultures which do some pretty awful things, like burning alive or beheading. In that sphere I think I’d rather stick with what happens to be familiar, thanks very much!
     
  29. Belperpete

    Belperpete Member

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    Agreed that it says the ticket is only valid with a reservation. What it does NOT say is that the ticket is only valid for the reserved seat. Where does it say that if you have a reservation, you are obliged to sit in that seat? As far as I am aware, you are free to sit in any unreserved seat.
     
  30. bramling

    bramling Established Member

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    I seem to remember GNER had a policy which said advance tickets were only valid in the reserved seat. Seems to have faded into history now though.

    A lot of this would be avoided if reservations weren’t given out like confetti.
     

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