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Donald Trump and the aftermath of his presidency

birchesgreen

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Stuffing the court with his appointees hasn't worked for Trump then. I'm relieved to see that even the judges he appointed see their duty to the constitution as above any loyalty to the ex president.
I think that is something he never understood, he was banking on the SC helping him out with his election mischief. I guess he could not conceive of people he put in place not putting him above all.
 
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najaB

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I think that is something he never understood, he was banking on the SC helping him out with his election mischief. I guess he could not conceive of people he put in place not putting him above all.
It ties into his demonstrated one-dimensional, transactional way of thinking. He did something for them, so they obviously were going to do something for him.

It's exactly the same kind of thinking that got him impeached the first time.
 

ainsworth74

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It ties into his demonstrated one-dimensional, transactional way of thinking. He did something for them, so they obviously were going to do something for him.

Exactly, I think it also demonstrates a failure to understand just what he was doing when he elevated them to the Supreme Court. It's a lifetime appointment (only death, resignation or by impeachment and conviction in Congress can remove them) so your appointee has no ability to threaten you with removal if you don't vote along the lines they want plus it's the pinnacle of a legal career. If you're a judge in the US there is nowhere else to go once you're on the Supreme Court. If you're the judge, with a bit of ambition, at any other level of the US legal system there is another rung on the ladder for you to strive for. Once your on the Supreme Court, that's it you're at the top. The only way left is down into retirement. So do you trash your reputation and legacy by making a decision that's favourable to the person who put you there (and has no more leverage over you)? Or do you stick to your view of the law and the constitution? I know which I'd pick in that situation...

So he struggled not only to understand that all people aren't as one-dimensional and transactional as he is and failed to appreciate that by elevating them he was also removing any influence he could possibly exert on them as well as any reason for them to bend to his will.
 

najaB

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So he struggled not only to understand that all people aren't as one-dimensional and transactional as he is and failed to appreciate that by elevating them he was also removing any influence he could possibly exert on them as well as any reason for them to bend to his will.
It also explains his relative failure as a hard-nosed New York businessman - he understands the mechanics of putting the squeeze on people and grifting, and is reasonably good at it when dealing with small fry (e.g. not paying contractors the full amount they're due), but is completely out-classed by the big guys who know what they're doing.

Hence why Putin is able to play him like a fiddle and make Trump think that he's picking the tunes.
 

DelW

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One of the problems for people like Trump is that they assume that others behave as badly as they themselves do. So because Trump routinely lies about things - even trivial, pointless things where it's obvious to everyone that he's lying - he assumes that everyone else does it as well.

In this case, because he's corrupt and entirely self-interested, he assumed the judges he appointed would be as well. Fortunately it seems that although some of them have some pretty far-out views, in this case at least they're taking their judicial obligations seriously, as indeed they did in refusing to countenance Trump's blatant attempt to misuse the law and the courts to overturn the election result.
 

najaB

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One of the problems for people like Trump is that they assume that others behave as badly as they themselves do. So because Trump routinely lies about things - even trivial, pointless things where it's obvious to everyone that he's lying - he assumes that everyone else does it as well.
I think it goes deeper than that. DJT has repeatedly demonstrated a level of psychopathy than leads to the conclusion that he's not assuming that others act like he does but is simply incapable of understanding that others could act in any other way.
 

Peter Sarf

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One of the problems for people like Trump is that they assume that others behave as badly as they themselves do. So because Trump routinely lies about things - even trivial, pointless things where it's obvious to everyone that he's lying - he assumes that everyone else does it as well.

In this case, because he's corrupt and entirely self-interested, he assumed the judges he appointed would be as well. Fortunately it seems that although some of them have some pretty far-out views, in this case at least they're taking their judicial obligations seriously, as indeed they did in refusing to countenance Trump's blatant attempt to misuse the law and the courts to overturn the election result.
The trouble is plenty of people tend not to imagine someone could lie as much as he does. So he gets away with it for long enough to do damage. And I do believe that he believes what he says so that makes it all the more convincing.

I think it goes deeper than that. DJT has repeatedly demonstrated a level of psychopathy than leads to the conclusion that he's not assuming that others act like he does but is simply incapable of understanding that others could act in any other way.
I think you are right about that. That is, of course, assuming he does not think that deeply. I think the way DJTs mind works is that he thinks of many permutations and combinations but loses sight of what is based on the most fact.

Furthermore I very much doubt he has any moral judgement. Environmental issues were simply an unnecessary cost that need not be incurred in his profit driven world.
 
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nlogax

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Looks like DT's tax returns have finally been shared. Can't imagine it'll be too long before leaked tidbits start to appear.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...61b6b4-7779-11eb-8115-9ad5e9c02117_story.html

NEW YORK — The Manhattan District Attorney's Office has taken possession of former president Donald Trump's tax returns and a wealth of other financial data deemed central to prosecutors' ongoing criminal case, officials confirmed Thursday.

The transfer, involving millions of pages of records, occurred Monday after the U.S. Supreme Court rejected the former president’s last-ditch bid to shield his financial records from the district attorney, Democrat Cyrus R. Vance Jr.
In a statement, a spokesman for Vance’s office, Danny Frost, confirmed that Trump’s longtime accounting firm, Mazars, had complied with the subpoena after 18 months of delay while the former president’s lawyers fought tooth and nail to keep the information private. The transfer occurred Monday, within hours of the Supreme Court’s one-line order, Frost said.
 

najaB

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I think you are right about that. That is, of course, assuming he does not think that deeply.
The clue is in his saying "nobody knew that" when he finds out something new.

I was going to say when he learns something new, but there's little evidence of any learning since the early 1980s.
 

Strathclyder

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The clue is in his saying "nobody knew that" when he finds out something new.

I was going to say when he learns something new, but there's little evidence of any learning since the early 1980s.
Apart from learning new and creative ways to grift, swindle and bamboozle, nope. Whether or not he's any good at doing so is irrelevent. He hasn't learned a thing since the early 80s.
 

najaB

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So, DJT loss them the House, the Senate and the White House yet he's still being invited to address CPAC. I guess the GOP really doesn't know how to quit him.
 

Gloster

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The GOP does seem to be splitting into two factions: one that will support and flatter Trump whatever he does or says, and one that sees him as a liability who is best kept at a distance (and who hope that he won’t be able to run in 2024). If, or more likely when, war breaks out between them it will not be an edifying sight, although probably quite entertaining for those outside the ring. However, even if Donald J. were to be unable to run in 2024, the support seems to be sufficiently fanatical (or bonkers) to follow either Donald Junior or Eric (or Ivanka or Tiffany or Barron (eventually)), which is just a tad worrying.
 

najaB

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However, even if Donald J. were to be unable to run in 2024, the support seems to be sufficiently fanatical (or bonkers) to follow either Donald Junior or Eric (or Ivanka or Tiffany or Barron (eventually)), which is just a tad worrying.
Nah, not Tiffany. Nobody likes Tiffany. And I expect Melania will get custody of Barron in the divorce...
 

Ediswan

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Tiffany? Somehow the idea of the Trump clan all chanting "I think we're alone now", has a certain attraction. (Don't take that comparison too far.)
 

birchesgreen

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I saw some footage of Donald Jr at a MAGA rally, he somehow managed to make his Dad look like Socrates in comparison.
 

jon0844

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I think that might be more important than the second impeachment. If there is dirt to be found, and no stone will be left unturned, it would be interesting to see how many GOP members of Congress are prepared to support someone who appears to not be paying their full wack in taxes, particularly when the average American is struggling.

They all know who and what Trump is. A grifter who will help people who help him, up to a point (you know it's game over when he doesn't pay you...). Plenty of people have sold their souls to profit along the way, and no doubt get tied in because once they're involved, they can be manipulated and threatened.

An awful lot of people will be going to jail in the coming years, most likely Trump included. Of course he'll be attempting to throw as many people under the bus as possible.. but even he has to be careful what he says. If he tries to get off by revealing information about sources of money or deals he's done behind the scenes - jail will seem like heaven compared to the alternative punishment he can look forward to.
 

birchesgreen

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I've always thought, when people have mentioned the truly nutty ones in the US with guns, that Trump has more to fear from them than most.
 

Strathclyder

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So, DJT loss them the House, the Senate and the White House yet he's still being invited to address CPAC. I guess the GOP really doesn't know how to quit him.
They're either delusional, moronic or sycophantic worshippers who see him as their Messiah and someone who can't put a foot wrong. Heck, wouldn't surprise me if a mix of all 3 applied here.

I saw some footage of Donald Jr at a MAGA rally, he somehow managed to make his Dad look like Socrates in comparison.
Urrgh, Jr. Somehow even more insufferable, ignorant & obnoxious than his father; that in itself is noteworthy. Plus, it's been noted more than once that he always looks and sounds like he's strung out on something. Given you mention them, his MAGA rally performances do nothing but fuel those rumours. But I digress, a DTJ presidential campaign in 2024 would no doubt make his father's campaigns look like FDR's by comparison.
 

JohnMcL7

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So, DJT loss them the House, the Senate and the White House yet he's still being invited to address CPAC. I guess the GOP really doesn't know how to quit him.
I was surprised they stood by him as well but the attack on Biden's confirmation shows how successful the stolen election lie has been and how dedicated Trump's supporters are to him. If the GOP dropped Trump then they'll fracture the party and likely have no chance in the future but by standing by Trump they get his dedicated core of supporters and it wouldn't take that many votes to win back enough states especially if they continue to push forward with trying to restrict voters. I think Biden's presidency is going to be a very difficult one anyway but in addition to that they're not going to prolifically lie about it the way Trump did to cover his awful performance so they can present a very wrong view of Biden and get away with it.
 

backontrack

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Furthermore I very much doubt he has any moral judgement. Environmental issues were simply an unnecessary cost that need not be incurred in his profit driven world.
You could say the same thing about most Western leaders. Nobody wants to take that first economic hit because, even though they know it'll get steeper the longer they leave things, it's simply something they ignore in their world (very well put). It's compartmentalised completely.

Which is a bad thing indeed.

Urrgh, Jr. Somehow even more insufferable, ignorant & obnoxious than his father; that in itself is noteworthy.
Yeah...he somehow manages to win the title of the most stupid man in the world called Donald Trump.
 

najaB

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So, it's March 5th and Joe Biden is still president. Is anyone surprised? Oh yeah, these guys:

 

37424

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So, it's March 5th and Joe Biden is still president. Is anyone surprised? Oh yeah, these guys:

Well USA has to have more nut jobs per head than any other country. in fact I wouldn't describe the US as a developed country, more a developing country with some developed bits.

It always strikes me that parts of the US could fall into Lawlessness very easily. It always makes me laugh where you have these tin pot towns with there own little police force and they only cover the area of the town and after that its probably state police. Its still like the wild west in many ways.
 

birchesgreen

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A fascinating thing about police forces in the US is how many of them there are, even the US Postal Service has it's own law enforcement agency!
 

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