E-Tickets v Print at Home Tickets?

[Wallsendmag]

We don't need anything involving integration with TVMs. They are expensive enough as it is.

Get rid of ToD and the case for TVMs weakens dramatically leading to even more cost saving.

 

[Hadders]

Get rid of ToD and the case for TVMs weakens dramatically leading to even more cost saving.

You'll always need some form of ticket machine at stations, or is the industry expecting all tickets to be purchased online or at ticket offices?

 

[Wallsendmag]

You'll always need some form of ticket machine at stations, or is the industry expecting all tickets to be purchased online or at ticket offices?

Obviously there'll still be something but nowhere near as many as currently and probably a lot simpler without the need to issue CCST.

 

[Hadders]

CCST is a really convenient sized ticket. Perfect for putting into wallets, purses and so much more user friendly than paper till roll tickets. I really don't get why e-tickets can't be dispensed from ticket offices (and in future) TVMs on credit card sized tickets, obviously sans magstripe.

 

[mattdickinson]

CCST is a really convenient sized ticket. Perfect for putting into wallets, purses and so much more user friendly than paper till roll tickets. I really don't get why e-tickets can't be dispensed from ticket offices (and in future) TVMs on credit card sized tickets, obviously sans magstripe.

I think the issue is that it's hard to fit a full Aztec barcode on a CCST ticket as well as all the text needed. Maybe double sided CCST is the answer...

 

[Hadders]

I think the issue is that it's hard to fit a full Aztec barcode on a CCST ticket as well as all the text needed. Maybe double sided CCST is the answer...

LNER managed to fit an Aztec code onto their CCST a couple of years ago, assume this was a failure for some reason? If necessary resign the layout of the ticket, I'd have thought it could be done if the will was there.

 

[alistairlees]

LNER managed to fit an Aztec code onto their CCST a couple of years ago, assume this was a failure for some reason? If necessary resign the layout of the ticket, I'd have thought it could be done if the will was there.

That barcode was too small to contain the required data. It needs to be a type 6 barcode, which is too big to fit on a CCST ticket.

 

[Skie]

Delivered properly (as a pdf and phone wallatable ticket) e-tickets have been great, but you have Merseyrail buggering up flows that touch their network by refusing them.

I do hope this s-ticket is a universally accepted one. And if it is then it’s clearly the Sauron-Ticket: One ticket to rule them all.

 

[johncrossley]

To give some clue what the s-ticket is, what other kind of formats do they offer in other countries that doesn't currently exist in the UK? The only other system I can think of is the Swiss EasyRide where you simply use your phone to check in and out, meaning no ticket buying is necessary:

www.sbb.ch/en/timetable/mobile-apps/sbb-mobile/easyride.html

Travel freely and flexibly throughout Switzerland – EasyRide does the rest for you! All you need is the SBB Mobileapp, one swipe to the right and one to the left.
Would you like to travel by public transport without having to worry about tickets – just get on and go? Without even having to decide where you are going beforehand? That is all quite simple with EasyRide. Because you check in with a swipe before your journey and check out again with a swipe afterwards. And at the end of the day, EasyRide calculates the lowest price.

 

[Wallsendmag]

LNER managed to fit an Aztec code onto their CCST a couple of years ago, assume this was a failure for some reason? If necessary resign the layout of the ticket, I'd have thought it could be done if the will was there.

It was never used as intended and when we moved to newer TIS it was discintinued.

 

[mmh]

I think the issue is that it's hard to fit a full Aztec barcode on a CCST ticket as well as all the text needed. Maybe double sided CCST is the answer...

Anyone who has bought a National Lottery ticket knows it's perfectly possible to do this.

 

[XAM2175]

Anyone who has bought a National Lottery ticket knows it's perfectly possible to do this.

How much data is encoded in the barcode on the lottery ticket?

 

[alistairlees]

Anyone who has bought a National Lottery ticket knows it's perfectly possible to do this.

National Lottery tickets use QR codes. Aztec is a better format for transport because it's more forgiving when scanned (higher throughput at gatelines than typical QR code use cases) and can contain much more info. For the info that's required for rail ticketing a larger format Aztec barcode is required. This would not fit on a CCST ticket without leaving almost no room for anything else.

 

[plugwash]

The thing is if you want a secure ticketing system that can be checked offline, then you need the code to contain all of the ticket data along with a digital signature, that adds up to a fair bit of data.

If you are happy having tickets that can only be checked online (as I suspect the national lottery are) then the codes can be much smaller because they only need to store a number that is too big to guess which can then be looked up in a central database.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The thing is if you want a secure ticketing system that can be checked offline, then you need the code to contain all of the ticket data along with a digital signature, that adds up to a fair bit of data.

If you are happy having tickets that can only be checked online (as I suspect the national lottery are) then the codes can be much smaller because they only need to store a number that is too big to guess which can then be looked up in a central database.

It won't be long before the latter will be possible, to be fair. Mobile coverage across the UK is pretty good now, another 10 years and it'll easily be blanket covered, certainly the railway lines. And yes, that will have considerable advantages in ticketing terms.

Wouldn't even need the number to be too big to guess. Something like a ToD CTR* would be fine provided you also had to show something associated to it e.g. the card you booked it with, or tickets had names on.

* Ticket on Departure...Sorry, don't know what CTR stands for.

 

[Haywain]

Ticket on Departure...Sorry, don't know what CTR stands for.

Customer transaction reference.

 

[infobleep]

It was never used as intended and when we moved to newer TIS it was discintinued.

That's a shame. In that, it wasn't used as intended.

It won't be long before the latter will be possible, to be fair. Mobile coverage across the UK is pretty good now, another 10 years and it'll easily be blanket-covered, certainly the railway lines. And yes, that will have considerable advantages in ticketing terms.

With regards to mobile coverage, I do know that O2 are patchy between Guildford and Waterloo and south of Guildford to Portsmouth there are parts where it isn't great.

I'm sure I could switch to one with better coverage but even then parts of the rail network will be black spots.

 

[Bletchleyite]

With regards to mobile coverage, I do know that O2 are patchy between Guildford and Waterloo and south of Guildford to Portsmouth there are parts where it isn't great.

I'm sure I could switch to one with better coverage but even then parts of the rail network will be black spots.

I would be extremely surprised if, other than in tunnels, the railway network (yes, including the Far North and the likes) didn't have blanket mobile phone coverage within 10 years. It's got to be pretty close now, to be honest - certainly close enough for traincrew to be carrying around card machines that require an Internet connection to authorise the payment.

 

[Mag_seven]

A reminder that the topic of the thread is "E-Tickets v Print at Home Tickets?"

If anyone wants to discuss anything else they are welcome to start a new thread.

Thanks.

 

[westv]

I've just noticed that the seat reservation details don't appear anywhere when you view the e-ticket via the Hull Trains app.

 

[_toommm_]

I've just noticed that the seat reservation details don't appear anywhere when you view the e-ticket via the Hull Trains app.

If it’s anything like the other FirstGroup apps, press the little ‘i’ and it’ll load up the booking info including reservation:

 

[westv]

On thanks.