Easing of COVID measures in Europe outside the UK

[island]

Ireland announced abruptly yesterday that with effect from this morning, most remaining COVID legal measures were dropped, including:

• Limits on gatherings
• 5,000 person attendance at outdoor events and 1,000 indoors
• 100 person attendance at weddings
• 8pm closure of hospitality venues
• Vaccine pass requirement at hospitality venues
• "pods of 6" and 1m distancing at certain venues
• Taking of contact details at certain venues

A wind-down of enhanced unemployment benefit began today and by 5 April everyone remaining on it will return to normal unemployment benefit terms.

They have retained:

• Face coverings in public transport, shops, and some public venues for ages 13+
  • Face coverings were never required de jure for customers at hospitality venues (they are for staff) but they were enforced de facto while walking around them
  • Face coverings were never required de jure in schools but they are still being enforced with an iron rod at 90%+ of schools. Ditto churches.
  • Eating and drinking remains banned on all public transport
  • The Taoiseach (prime minister) indicated masks will probably be gone by end of February
• Passenger locator forms for those entering from off island
• PCR test for unvaccinated travellers from off island
  • From 1 February in line with EU rules a booster would be required for anyone whose last vaccination was over 9 months prior

Things that were announced as changing but didn't actually:

• Legal requirements to self-isolate after a positive test
• Legal requirements to work from home – guidance is that office attendance should resume on a phased basis from Monday and return to normal by 1 March
• Legal requirements around social-distancing in general – guidance has been dropped effective immediately

Ireland has been amongst the stricter countries in its reaction to COVID-19 and this change has caught a lot of people on the hop – but it's encouraging to see.

 

[danm14]

Legal requirements to self-isolate after a positive test

To the best of my knowledge, Ireland doesn't have and never has had a legal requirement to self isolate after a positive test or as a close contact - it is guidance that is misrepresented as law.

 

[brad465]

I wonder if Ireland can see trouble ahead for themselves if they didn't do any of this, particularly with England dropping almost everything?

 

[island]

To the best of my knowledge, Ireland doesn't have and never has had a legal requirement to self isolate after a positive test or as a close contact - it is guidance that is misrepresented as law.

Indeed. It was not law and still is not law, hence why it appeared under the heading it did

I wonder if Ireland can see trouble ahead for themselves if they didn't do any of this, particularly with England dropping almost everything?

What sort of trouble did you have in mind?

 

[danm14]

I wonder if Ireland can see trouble ahead for themselves if they didn't do any of this, particularly with England dropping almost everything?

When England lifted all restrictions in July, leaving Ireland was punishable by a €2,000 fine and indoor dining was prohibited.

By the point Ireland and England both reintroduced restrictions in November/December, Ireland had barely opened any further than England did in May.

There was no trouble then, there wouldn't be any now.

 

[philosopher]

Indeed. It was not law and still is not law, hence why it appeared under the heading it did


What sort of trouble did you have in mind?

Longer term I think there was risk those in Ireland who struggled with the restrictions would move to England, which is relatively easy for the Irish to do.

Plus, who is going to go on holiday to a country where pubs and restaurants have to close at eight.

 

[island]

There was no trouble then, there wouldn't be any now.

Well there's a protest march in Dublin today against the restrictions that were abolished this morning

 

[Lampshade]

Is it the Six Nations soon?

 

[MikeWM]

I do wonder what actually happened to Ireland over the past couple of years (it was one of those 'countries I thought were fairly well-adjusted but it turns out they weren't at all' - see also Canada and Germany) - and for that matter what has triggered such a quick and unexpected switch in position.

Reassuring to see though, particularly the removal of domestic vaccine passports. The record for those being removed once introduced wasn't looking good at all, anywhere in the world, so this is promising.

 

[Mainline421]

France is removing all restrictions except masks indoors and vaccines passes from 16 February. Although I'd say masks are the biggest restriction!

Also Germany is still on track to remove all restrictions in March for now.

 

[berneyarms]

Well there's a protest march in Dublin today against the restrictions that were abolished this morning

That was a gang of far right lunatics - I wouldn't be taking too much notice of them.

I wonder if Ireland can see trouble ahead for themselves if they didn't do any of this, particularly with England dropping almost everything?

Believe it or not, Ireland is an independent country and we are able to think for ourselves. Irish people do, in my opinion, have a much more benevolent view of looking after society as a whole rather than putting themselves first thankfully.

I do wonder what actually happened to Ireland over the past couple of years (it was one of those 'countries I thought were fairly well-adjusted but it turns out they weren't at all' - see also Canada and Germany) - and for that matter what has triggered such a quick and unexpected switch in position.

Reassuring to see though, particularly the removal of domestic vaccine passports. The record for those being removed once introduced wasn't looking good at all, anywhere in the world, so this is promising.

I think that you will find that Ireland is a very well adjusted country, with a society that is nowhere near as polarised as England, and one that, as I said, where we tend to take a far more collective view than just looking at our individual situations.

In fact I would counter that in general Irish society's reaction to this pandemic demonstrates that Ireland remains a compassionate and tolerant society and that our fundamental characteristics remain intact.

At the same time the Irish health service came under massive pressures during the two major Covid waves, and in particular our ICU facilities came close to breaking point, and most people here certainly felt that the restrictions were necessary to keep the health service from collapsing.

The changes this week came on foot of advice from the public health officials as the Omicron wave appears to be easing - the numbers of hospitalisations are dropping, and severe pressures on ICU didn't materialise mercifully.

The view that the public health team took is that Ireland is now over the worst of this wave, and that it is right to relax measures. The speed of lifting them is of course a political judgement, but with falling case numbers and hospitalisations the government took the decision to open society up again.

 

[brad465]

Believe it or not, Ireland is an independent country and we are able to think for ourselves. Irish people do, in my opinion, have a much more benevolent view of looking after society as a whole rather than putting themselves first thankfully.

That's because Ireland has not been subject to neoliberalism (the system that promotes individualism in order to profit) as much as the UK has and/or has a political class subject to much better scrutiny and responsibility, unlike the UKs, for a long list of reasons.

 

[berneyarms]

That's because Ireland has not been subject to neoliberalism (the system that promotes individualism in order to profit) as much as the UK has and/or has a political class subject to much better scrutiny and responsibility, unlike the UKs, for a long list of reasons.

Indeed - I think that in many ways that we do still have a society that does promote looking after each other thankfully.

Unlike in the UK, you also have to remember that Ireland has kept the pandemic unemployment payment in place throughout for those staff who lost their jobs due to the Covid restrictions. and has kept a wide range of business supports in place throughout the period for companies whose turnover has been decimated by Covid,

 

[danm14]

In fact I would counter that in general Irish society's reaction to this pandemic demonstrates that Ireland remains a compassionate and tolerant society and that our fundamental characteristics remain intact.

I would argue that it has in ways and hasn't in other ways, with the latter massively outweighing the former.

I would agree that the supports provided in Ireland to businesses and especially individuals were exemplary. I would agree that supports to brighten the lives of those elderly and vulnerable who were shielding, especially those offered by An Post (free mail collection, free post to nursing homes, check-ins with people living alone) went well beyond those offered in the UK.

I would disagree that the willingness of Gardaí to enforce laws that didn't exist or to intentionally misinterpret them showed compassion, some examples that I am personally aware of include:

• A 70 year old was threatened with imprisonment for not shielding, despite this not being legally required. She was going for a walk.
• A friend was threatened with arrest for bringing their child to the other parent for the weekend as directed by the courts, despite the law permitting travel and household visits to fulfil custody arrangements, and then had this failure to visit used against them.
• A friend who was emigrating was fined €2,000 for "non-essential foreign travel" despite a one way ferry ticket, a car packed to the gills with personal belongings and proof of their new job in England, because it was "too convenient" that they were emigrating the day before restrictions in England lifted.
• Several people I know were threatened with fines for travelling to Northern Ireland at a time when no restrictions applied to travel to Northern Ireland - one of these was a person walking to their nearest shop, which happened to be in Northern Ireland.

I would also disagree that the willingness of Irish society to inform on their neighbours for very minor transgressions, such as having one too many people attend a funeral, or having a friend visit the day before restrictions on household visits were lifted showed compassion and tolerance.

And I would definitely disagree that the iron-fisted enforcement of restrictions, often going above and beyond what was legally required, showed compassion and tolerance. A coffee shop in a town near my parents' home refused to accept vaccine passports unless they were displayed on a smartphone, for no apparent reason and for the entire period they were required, leaving several elderly customers to eat outside. A family with an autistic child were thrown out of the local supermarket as the child could not wear a mask, despite the child's condition being abundantly clear and the law permitting such exemptions.

 

[island]

I would argue that it has in ways and hasn't in other ways, with the latter massively outweighing the former.

I would agree that the supports provided in Ireland to businesses and especially individuals were exemplary. I would agree that supports to brighten the lives of those elderly and vulnerable who were shielding, especially those offered by An Post (free mail collection, free post to nursing homes, check-ins with people living alone) went well beyond those offered in the UK.

I would disagree that the willingness of Gardaí to enforce laws that didn't exist or to intentionally misinterpret them showed compassion, some examples that I am personally aware of include:

• A 70 year old was threatened with imprisonment for not shielding, despite this not being legally required. She was going for a walk.
• A friend was threatened with arrest for bringing their child to the other parent for the weekend as directed by the courts, despite the law permitting travel and household visits to fulfil custody arrangements, and then had this failure to visit used against them.
• A friend who was emigrating was fined €2,000 for "non-essential foreign travel" despite a one way ferry ticket, a car packed to the gills with personal belongings and proof of their new job in England, because it was "too convenient" that they were emigrating the day before restrictions in England lifted.
• Several people I know were threatened with fines for travelling to Northern Ireland at a time when no restrictions applied to travel to Northern Ireland - one of these was a person walking to their nearest shop, which happened to be in Northern Ireland.

I would also disagree that the willingness of Irish society to inform on their neighbours for very minor transgressions, such as having one too many people attend a funeral, or having a friend visit the day before restrictions on household visits were lifted showed compassion and tolerance.

And I would definitely disagree that the iron-fisted enforcement of restrictions, often going above and beyond what was legally required, showed compassion and tolerance. A coffee shop in a town near my parents' home refused to accept vaccine passports unless they were displayed on a smartphone, for no apparent reason and for the entire period they were required, leaving several elderly customers to eat outside. A family with an autistic child were thrown out of the local supermarket as the child could not wear a mask, despite the child's condition being abundantly clear and the law permitting such exemptions.

There’s also been a lady in Cork repeatedly prosecuted for not wearing a mask in a café, despite that Irish legislation only requires they be worn by staff.

 

[greyman42]

There’s also been a lady in Cork repeatedly prosecuted for not wearing a mask in a café, despite that Irish legislation only requires they be worn by staff.

How can you successfully prosecute someone when they have not broke the law?

 

[danm14]

How can you successfully prosecute someone when they have not broke the law?

From memory, she was prosecuted for not wearing a mask in a shop, and the judge made it a condition of her suspended sentence that she wasn't permitted to leave home at all without wearing a mask.

 

[berneyarms]

I would argue that it has in ways and hasn't in other ways, with the latter massively outweighing the former.

I would agree that the supports provided in Ireland to businesses and especially individuals were exemplary. I would agree that supports to brighten the lives of those elderly and vulnerable who were shielding, especially those offered by An Post (free mail collection, free post to nursing homes, check-ins with people living alone) went well beyond those offered in the UK.

I would disagree that the willingness of Gardaí to enforce laws that didn't exist or to intentionally misinterpret them showed compassion, some examples that I am personally aware of include:

• A 70 year old was threatened with imprisonment for not shielding, despite this not being legally required. She was going for a walk.
• A friend was threatened with arrest for bringing their child to the other parent for the weekend as directed by the courts, despite the law permitting travel and household visits to fulfil custody arrangements, and then had this failure to visit used against them.
• A friend who was emigrating was fined €2,000 for "non-essential foreign travel" despite a one way ferry ticket, a car packed to the gills with personal belongings and proof of their new job in England, because it was "too convenient" that they were emigrating the day before restrictions in England lifted.
• Several people I know were threatened with fines for travelling to Northern Ireland at a time when no restrictions applied to travel to Northern Ireland - one of these was a person walking to their nearest shop, which happened to be in Northern Ireland.

I would also disagree that the willingness of Irish society to inform on their neighbours for very minor transgressions, such as having one too many people attend a funeral, or having a friend visit the day before restrictions on household visits were lifted showed compassion and tolerance.

And I would definitely disagree that the iron-fisted enforcement of restrictions, often going above and beyond what was legally required, showed compassion and tolerance. A coffee shop in a town near my parents' home refused to accept vaccine passports unless they were displayed on a smartphone, for no apparent reason and for the entire period they were required, leaving several elderly customers to eat outside. A family with an autistic child were thrown out of the local supermarket as the child could not wear a mask, despite the child's condition being abundantly clear and the law permitting such exemptions.

With all due respect, we can all quote some examples of heavy-handedness or some business being over-zealout in any of the countries in these islands, but to suggest that these sort of examples were the norm right across Ireland is anything but the case.

But I will be absolutely honest, none of that bears any resemblance to my experiences here in Dublin.

You're trying to make the country out as something it was not. I certainly don't recognise the image of people "informing" on others at all.

In fact I could counter those with far more examples of people going out of their way to help neighbours. The vast majority of people here understood the gravity of the situation and pulled together.

 

[yorkie]

I don't think the pandemic response has shown that "Ireland remains a compassionate and tolerant society"; quite the opposite, in fact.

That's not a criticism of the people of Ireland but to say society has been run that way during the pandemic is not a plausible claim in my opinion.

 

[island]

From memory, she was prosecuted for not wearing a mask in a shop, and the judge made it a condition of her suspended sentence that she wasn't permitted to leave home at all without wearing a mask.

Yes either that or bail conditions, I forget which.

 

[MikeWM]

I think that you will find that Ireland is a very well adjusted country, with a society that is nowhere near as polarised as England, and one that, as I said, where we tend to take a far more collective view than just looking at our individual situations.

Ireland excluded a section of its population from large parts of society for 6 months based on medical status - bad enough, but in this case even worse as there was no evidence that it would or did achieve anything at all, and yet they did it and continued with it.

Any country willing to do that (and sadly, there are a lot of them) is not remotely 'well-adjusted' in my book.

 

[danm14]

Ireland excluded a section of its population from large parts of society for 6 months based on medical status - bad enough, but in this case even worse as there was no evidence that it would or did achieve anything at all, and yet they did it and continued with it.

And did so without exception, those who were medically unable to be vaccinated were simply excluded "temporarily for their own protection" and told repeatedly for those six months that a scheme would be put in place for them "in due course", which never happened.

A small number of businesses accepted proof of medical exemption, but to do so was just as much of a criminal offence as not checking at all.

 

[Yew]

From memory, she was prosecuted for not wearing a mask in a shop, and the judge made it a condition of her suspended sentence that she wasn't permitted to leave home at all without wearing a mask.

So now judges are experts in public health epidemiological experts?

 

[nw1]

I would argue that it has in ways and hasn't in other ways, with the latter massively outweighing the former.

I would agree that the supports provided in Ireland to businesses and especially individuals were exemplary. I would agree that supports to brighten the lives of those elderly and vulnerable who were shielding, especially those offered by An Post (free mail collection, free post to nursing homes, check-ins with people living alone) went well beyond those offered in the UK.

I would disagree that the willingness of Gardaí to enforce laws that didn't exist or to intentionally misinterpret them showed compassion, some examples that I am personally aware of include:

• A 70 year old was threatened with imprisonment for not shielding, despite this not being legally required. She was going for a walk.

Whether it's legally required or not, is it morally acceptable to shut someone up against their will just because they are of a certain age? Granted a 70 year old is going to be more vulnerable than a younger person, but one should let the 70 year old be the judge of that. If they want to risk going out because they do not wish to stay at home all the time, why not let them? If they get bad Covid, it's their own risk. The state should warn them, but it should not impose legal restrictions which a 60 year old or 40 year old does not have.

 

[MrTurbostar170]

Denmark is looking to remove almost all restrictions on February 1st.

Netherlands lifts toughest Covid curbs with Denmark and France set to follow

Many EU countries opt to reopen despite record infections as WHO suggests Omicron may signal more manageable phase of pandemic

www.theguardian.com

The Danish government, which two weeks ago allowed cinemas and music venues to reopen after a month’s closure, also announced on Wednesday plans to scrap remaining domestic coronavirus controls from 1 February. The move – which must be approved by parliament – will allow nightclubs to reopen, restaurants to serve alcohol after 10pm, and shops to lift limits on customer numbers. Vaccine passes will no longer be needed, and commuters may travel without wearing masks.

 

[Huntergreed]

Denmark is looking to remove almost all restrictions on February 1st.

Netherlands lifts toughest Covid curbs with Denmark and France set to follow

Many EU countries opt to reopen despite record infections as WHO suggests Omicron may signal more manageable phase of pandemic

www.theguardian.com

Excellent news. Particularly happy that masks and vaccine passes are going (as I note some groups are attempting to rebrand these as 'protective measures' to try and argue for their longer term retention)

 

[Mainline421]

Sweden removing all restrictions in law from next week https://bnonews.com/index.php/2022/02/sweden-to-drop-all-covid-19-restrictions/

Swedish Prime Minister Magdalena Andersson will announce on Thursday that all restrictions against coronavirus will be removed, following the example of neighboring countries, according to local media.


The Expressen newspaper, citing sources, reported that the government will announce that all mandatory restrictions will be allowed to expire next Wednesday. Some general advice – such as staying at home when you’re sick – will be maintained. Although Sweden is experiencing a record-breaking surge in coronavirus cases, the situation in hospitals remains stable as the Omicron variant is considered to be milder with a lower risk of hospitalization.


Neighboring countries such as Denmark and Norway have already dropped nearly all of their restrictions against COVID-19. “It’s time to take back our everyday life,” Norway’s health minister said on Tuesday. Also on Wednesday, Finnish Prime Minister Sanna Marin said the government plans to gradually lift coronavirus restrictions this month, with the aim of removing all curbs in early March.

 

[kristiang85]

Switzerland are also thinking of dropping most of their rules in the next couple of weeks in a "turbo" de-restriction process.

When are the core EU countries going to get the hint? (Especially when you consider that the non EU ones of us, Switzerland and Norway could be some of the most free on the continent).

 

[island]

The Irish government website suggests that its only remaining domestic legal restriction (masks) is set to be dropped at the end of the month. Fully vaccinated travellers are already able to come without a test or isolation. Guidance to self-isolate on a positive test remains in place but is not a matter of law. And the pandemic unemployment payment closed for new applications a week and a half ago and claimants will move onto standard unemployment benefit amount from 8 March and standard unemployment benefit terms from 5 April.

 

[AlterEgo]

Sweden removing all restrictions in law from next week https://bnonews.com/index.php/2022/02/sweden-to-drop-all-covid-19-restrictions/

Excellent news, I am due in Sweden in a few weeks' time.

The Irish government website suggests that its only remaining domestic legal restriction (masks) is set to be dropped at the end of the month. Fully vaccinated travellers are already able to come without a test or isolation. Guidance to self-isolate on a positive test remains in place but is not a matter of law. And the pandemic unemployment payment closed for new applications a week and a half ago and claimants will move onto standard unemployment benefit amount from 8 March and standard unemployment benefit terms from 5 April.

Also good news. Ireland has had some pretty strict measures and I am pleasantly surprised that masks are going.