• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Cheshire Bus News (was East Cheshire Bus News)

Status
Not open for further replies.

LOL The Irony

On Moderation
Joined
29 Jul 2017
Messages
5,335
Location
Chinatown, New York
The 88 can run as current upto Wilmslow. There was no point in typing out the full route description. Would you by using a bus taking 2-3 x longer than the train?
For some people, that's the only option. Also, how will you ensure through ticketing?
I am basing it off the demographics of the areas, Altrincham being a place where the more wealthy shop and Alderley Edge residents being more wealthy
The Alderley Edge residents who mostly own cars and can drive there?
and the 88A which ran and seemed to carry a fair few through Wilmslow when I saw it.
Because it was trying to make up for the loss of a half hourly service.
It's quite clear the current bus network in Cheshire East is failing. Do you 1. let it fail and leave the area with barely any buses or 2. try to innovate and look in depth at the demographics and journey opportunities which people make to create a network which does the best it can.
1 is the east option, 2 is the option no one wants to do because it requires risks and hard work.
The 130 had no leg to stand on once it stopped going into the center of Manchester, taking it to Altrincham will be just the same as taking it to East Didsbury. Also, why can't the 88 & 130 exist in harmony in going to Altrincham? They could get more leisure passengers if they send both via the viewing park on Saturdays from April - September and during school holidays. Stunting one service just to save another could easily kill both, which would leave Wilmslow and Knutsford with just one, practically useless bus service (the evening 288 & the sporadic 47 respectively).

I agree a massive boost in bus services is needed, but they have to be done right and not at the detriment to other services where possible.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

markymark2000

On Moderation
Joined
11 May 2015
Messages
3,538
Location
Western Part of the UK
...and more importantly someone with pockets deep enough to fund it.
That was highly unlikely pre-Covid, and even more so now!
That depends on who is making the changes. IF the council funds both services, the changes shouldn't cost much.

The cost of not taking a serious look at all this stuff is going to be job losses for the bus operators and for the economy, it would be even worse.


For some people, that's the only option. Also, how will you ensure through ticketing?

The Alderley Edge residents who mostly own cars and can drive there?

Because it was trying to make up for the loss of a half hourly service.

The 130 had no leg to stand on once it stopped going into the center of Manchester, taking it to Altrincham will be just the same as taking it to East Didsbury. Also, why can't the 88 & 130 exist in harmony in going to Altrincham? They could get more leisure passengers if they send both via the viewing park on Saturdays from April - September and during school holidays. Stunting one service just to save another could easily kill both, which would leave Wilmslow and Knutsford with just one, practically useless bus service (the evening 288 & the sporadic 47 respectively).

I agree a massive boost in bus services is needed, but they have to be done right and not at the detriment to other services where possible.
Through ticketing. Have you seen the demographic of those using these services?

Alderley Edge residents might mainly own cars but if they wanted to get the bus, they couldn't because the services don't exist to where they want to go. Wilmslow, Handforth or Macc for shopping.

I never said the 88A wasn't making up for a loss of service. It still carried a good few though Wilmslow which is the point. Colshaw Farm to Knutsford must have a bit of demand somewhere.

As for the last point, the 130 I do partly agree that it lost a good few passengers from taking off the Manchester link but it will have cost a fair bit in resources and punctuality. It was a no win situation for them really. As for Altrincham over East Dids, I think the main difference would be that East Didsbury you have very little there and would have to change to go to somewhere useful. Altrincham is a town in it's own right and is a growing retail destination. There is no rail link there from Macc or Alderley Edge and therefore people have to drive or change buses in Wilmslow.
The 88 and 130 can exist in harmony to Altrincham but you would make one confusing route serving Colshaw Farm, back to Wilmslow and then off to Altrincham and you lose any potential longer distance passengers with the journey time.
The Viewing Park, I 100% agree with you on but I think bus passengers have kept reducing to such levels that the viewing park isn't worth what it once was. Howards used to fill buses on the 200 with the viewing park, When D&G ran the 737, it was rarely used so I don't know if that would just be a wasted diversion in the end.
As for your last point, you do risk killing both routes but there is also the risk doing nothing will kill them as the people who are using them, unfortunately wont live forever. You also have the argument that keeping them as they are, clearly isn't working as the 130 has been around in many variations over the past few years and it has killed off demand on the current routing, a new routing might entice passengers back. If it doesn't you will have lost nothing as the pass holders go wherever the bus goes normally. They have a preference but will still use the bus.
 

LOL The Irony

On Moderation
Joined
29 Jul 2017
Messages
5,335
Location
Chinatown, New York
Through ticketing. Have you seen the demographic of those using these services?
Yes, a fair few don't have bus passes, so any money (as well as passengers) from that would disappear over night as nobody from Knutsford would want to go to Wilmslow, as they are pretty much the EXACT same town. And even those who do have a pass probably wouldn't want to wait in another cold bus shelter for 20 minutes.
Alderley Edge residents might mainly own cars but if they wanted to get the bus
Most Alderley Edge residents don't seem like the type of people to take the bus.
The 88 and 130 can exist in harmony to Altrincham but you would make one confusing route serving Colshaw Farm, back to Wilmslow and then off to Altrincham and you lose any potential longer distance passengers with the journey time.
Then why does the 88 waste time going via Lindow and Moreley Green (the latter of which, along with Hale Barns, usually involves a wait because some moron at one of the councils (or both) decided to time it to take 10 minutes longer than when GHA ran it)?
The Viewing Park, I 100% agree with you on but I think bus passengers have kept reducing to such levels that the viewing park isn't worth what it once was. Howards used to fill buses on the 200 with the viewing park, When D&G ran the 737, it was rarely used so I don't know if that would just be a wasted diversion in the end.
If something goes via somewhere, people are more likely to go to that place than they normally would. I wouldn't have had any reason to ever visit Wilmslow if the 88 never went there (although, the only reason to go there now is the direct link to London).
If it doesn't you will have lost nothing as the pass holders go wherever the bus goes normally.
And every single passenger from Knutsford who went to Altrincham on the bus? Is attempting to save 1 service really worth the high risk of killing off both?
 

daodao

Established Member
Joined
6 Feb 2016
Messages
2,908
Location
Dunham/Bowdon
...the 130 has been around in many variations over the past few years...
The forerunner of route 130 was established by the NWRCC nearly 100 years ago, and ran from Macclesfield via Monk's Heath and Wilmslow to Cheadle (White Hart), where it connected with one of Manchester's earliest bus services that ran to West Didsbury tram terminus, from which there were frequent tramcars to the city centre. It was extended to Manchester in the late 1920s when a network of limited stop bus services was established to serve outlying towns. I recall using the route (then NWRCC 29 and subsequently Crosville E29) to travel from Birchfields Road to the LMS bus station in the early 1970s.

See photographs on page 19 of this booklet - http://www.lthlibrary.org.uk/library/PDF-042-1.pdf - and page 27 of this booklet - http://www.lthlibrary.org.uk/library/PDF-043-1.pdf

Nowadays, there is minimal demand for bus services in Wilmslow and environs, which is an affluent semi-rural area. The run-down of the former AZ (previously ICI) Alderley Park research laboratories has greatly diminished any demand for commuter bus services at the southern end of route 130. However, there is a case for reinstating some sort of regular daytime weekday bus service from Macclesfield and its DGH to Wilmslow and then to Handforth via the relatively deprived Colshaw Farm Estate.
 
Last edited:

markymark2000

On Moderation
Joined
11 May 2015
Messages
3,538
Location
Western Part of the UK
Yes, a fair few don't have bus passes, so any money (as well as passengers) from that would disappear over night as nobody from Knutsford would want to go to Wilmslow, as they are pretty much the EXACT same town. And even those who do have a pass probably wouldn't want to wait in another cold bus shelter for 20 minutes.

Most Alderley Edge residents don't seem like the type of people to take the bus.

Then why does the 88 waste time going via Lindow and Moreley Green (the latter of which, along with Hale Barns, usually involves a wait because some moron at one of the councils (or both) decided to time it to take 10 minutes longer than when GHA ran it)?

If something goes via somewhere, people are more likely to go to that place than they normally would. I wouldn't have had any reason to ever visit Wilmslow if the 88 never went there (although, the only reason to go there now is the direct link to London).

And every single passenger from Knutsford who went to Altrincham on the bus? Is attempting to save 1 service really worth the high risk of killing off both?
Those who don't have passes might suffer very slightly but again, how many of these are travelling through Wilmslow from Mobberley or Knutsford to Altrincham. Very, very few.

Alderley Edge residents won't all take the bus but some will but only if it goes to the right areas. They certainly won't change buses. Fast direct link to where they want to go at a reasonable price and they will use it.

The 88s current routing is done to incorporate as much area as possible using as few buses as possible. The timings are in part due to GHA generally just running without complaining about any timetables and the timetable was just a guide and D&G wanting more padding because the end to end journey can be delayed so they wanted certainty they could catch up. Even so, Morley Green is at least going in the right direction. Diverting the 130 off to Colshaw Farm before then heading to Altrincham is quite far out of the way.

There is that argument. As I say, I would't rule out the viewing park, just putting in the counterargument.

Finally, as I keep reiterating, not that many people travel through Wilmslow and therefore not many will be affected. The 88 demand is for local journeys, not longer distance. Knutsford to Altrincham market share is mainly on trains and those few who do the journey on the bus are those on concessionary passes only using the bus because it's free and the train isn't. There is the alternative there though which is the important point!

The forerunner of route 130 was established by the NWRCC nearly 100 years ago, and ran from Macclesfield via Monk's Heath and Wilmslow to Cheadle (White Hart), where it connected with one of Manchester's earliest bus services that ran to West Didsbury tram terminus, from which there were frequent tramcars to the city centre. It was extended to Manchester in the late 1920s when a network of limited stop bus services was established to serve outlying towns. I recall using the route (then NWRCC 29 and subsequently Crosville E29) to travel from Birchfields Road to the LMS bus station in the early 1970s.

Nowadays, there is minimal demand for bus services in Wilmslow and environs, which is an affluent semi-rural area. The run-down of the former AZ (previously ICI) Alderley Park research laboratories has greatly diminished any demand for commuter bus services at the southern end of route 130. However, there is a case for reinstating some sort of regular daytime weekday bus service from Macclesfield and its DGH to Wilmslow and then to Handforth via the relatively deprived Colshaw Farm Estate.
There doesn't seem to be that much in Macclesfield for residents of Colshaw Farm. They would be much better off with a Wythenshawe link but that is a new route completely. IF the job centre has a lot of claimants from Colshaw Farm, A link to either Macc or Wythenshawe is probably needed but they can't be using the bus that much now or there would be more demand on the 130.
 

LOL The Irony

On Moderation
Joined
29 Jul 2017
Messages
5,335
Location
Chinatown, New York
Finally, as I keep reiterating, not that many people travel through Wilmslow and therefore not many will be affected. The 88 demand is for local journeys, not longer distance. Knutsford to Altrincham market share is mainly on trains and those few who do the journey on the bus are those on concessionary passes only using the bus because it's free and the train isn't. There is the alternative there though which is the important point!
The biggest catchment area of the 88 in Knutsford aren't close to the station at all, and I know paying passengers who go through to Altrincham, so to say or otherwise imply that only concessions use it is false.
 

markymark2000

On Moderation
Joined
11 May 2015
Messages
3,538
Location
Western Part of the UK
The biggest catchment area of the 88 in Knutsford aren't close to the station at all, and I know paying passengers who go through to Altrincham, so to say or otherwise imply that only concessions use it is false.
Knutsfords demand is mainly around Longridge. It's still quicker for those to go into Knutsford and get the train than it is to travel around Wilmslow to get to Altrincham. Just because a few people make a journey, it's clear the overall demand for bus use in Cheshire East is declining and the bus network has to adapt to that.

As we are now seeing on the high street on a larger scale and it will happen to the bus network in the next few years, failure to adapt to changing nee leads to reduced revenue and eventually closure of businesses. Current passengers won't stay around forever. Jobs change, people move houses and elderly don't stay with us forever. The reality is the network has to change and people like yourself constantly putting up barriers because one or two people make a journey once a week, is what is stopping the network adapting to encourage new passengers.

I've used the buses in the area many times over the past years and the same things keep happening. Reduced usage leads to cuts leads to more reduced usage. Break the cycle or you will have no buses left in a few years and sometimes, messing up a few peoples journeys can lead to vastly increased usage from other areas.
 
Joined
17 Oct 2013
Messages
41
I’m not sure why Such a conurbation like wilmslow cannot get under the umbrella of TFGM when places like New Mills and Glossop can. I still think a regular circular service to wythenshawe interchange would be the answer. So many onward services available and easy access to the tram network
 

jfollows

Established Member
Joined
26 Feb 2011
Messages
5,757
Location
Wilmslow
I've used the buses in the area many times over the past years and the same things keep happening. Reduced usage leads to cuts leads to more reduced usage. Break the cycle or you will have no buses left in a few years and sometimes, messing up a few peoples journeys can lead to vastly increased usage from other areas.
Absolutely right.

Although I used the E29 in the 1970s, and my parents bought the house I now live in in Wilmslow in 1982, I only moved to Wilmslow myself in 2007. At that time the 130 was half-hourly, but it seemed like a bus service run by local people for people in the know, because it wasn't easy to find out (as an occasional traveller) how to pay the fare and how much it was going to be. But, much worse, it was totally unreliable. My partner used the bus to commute to work, but spent on average several hours a week waiting at bus stops. He walked to Heald Green when he worked there rather than spend time waiting for the bus, which was good for his health, and when I was ill in 2013 he learned to drive, bought a car, and hasn't needed to use the bus since. I reckon that this change gave him an extra 60 minutes a day at home thanks to leaving later and, in particular, arriving back earlier from work. By then he worked in East Didsbury, and the bus service appeared to offer a better service than the train because of its frequency, but the reality didn't deliver on the promise.

But since 2007, and especially recently, what was a "fixture" service just deteriorated into a shambolic mess of changes, operators, times and routes.

If you'd asked a random person about the service ten years ago they'd probably have had a vague idea that it was a reasonably frequent service which ran from Wilmslow to Manchester and Macclesfield in different directions. Now, I suspect they wouldn't have an answer other than "what bus service?".

The users who have no choice, mainly the young and elderly, often who don't live near rail alternatives, have been let down by everyone involved. Anyone who has the choice will drive now.

Since I stopped working I sold my car, but I've used the 130 precisely once since I sold my car in November 2018, which was to go to Cheadle ( #1,626 ).

Running bus services in the hope that people might use them, whilst failing to deliver on the timetable promises and making frequent changes to timetable and route mean that, now, probably precisely zero people want to use the service if they have an alternative. Walking to the station may take longer on the face of it, but if it means catching a reliable train service instead of waiting at the side of the road for an unreliable bus service, may be a better option.

Oh yes, and the bus was more expensive than the train on parallel routes. And the bus fares went up often, for no reason, except that the fare rises will have driven even more people off the services.

It's probably something mirrored across the country and caused by deregulation years ago, augmented by starving local councils of money from central government whilst loading them up with centrally-imposed obligations which don't include provision of bus services. It's not a new story I'm sure. But the 130 seems doomed to me.
 
Last edited:

jfollows

Established Member
Joined
26 Feb 2011
Messages
5,757
Location
Wilmslow
I’m not sure why Such a conurbation like wilmslow cannot get under the umbrella of TFGM when places like New Mills and Glossop can. I still think a regular circular service to wythenshawe interchange would be the answer. So many onward services available and easy access to the tram network
It is certainly true that Wythenshawe Hospital could be a destination for a bus service from Wilmslow. When I had to make a regular 5 minute outpatient appointment there, public transport (train to Manchester Airport, bus from there) took 3 hours in total. Maybe today the journey would be slightly quicker with the replacement of the bus service from Manchester Airport to Wythenshawe Hospital by the tram, although there's a bit of a walk involved at the hospital end of the journey?
 
Last edited:

markymark2000

On Moderation
Joined
11 May 2015
Messages
3,538
Location
Western Part of the UK
I’m not sure why Such a conurbation like wilmslow cannot get under the umbrella of TFGM when places like New Mills and Glossop can. I still think a regular circular service to wythenshawe interchange would be the answer. So many onward services available and easy access to the tram network
I don't think Wilmslow is that well liked by TFGM for some reason. Otherwise they would have extended the 312 into Wilmslow to cover the Stockport to Wilmslow link which got lost by Stagecoach a few years back instead of terminating it at Handforth Dean (which seems to be dead based on previous attempts at running buses there)

Absolutely right.

Although I used the E29 in the 1970s, and my parents bought the house I now live in in Wilmslow in 1982, I only moved to Wilmslow myself in 2007. At that time the 130 was half-hourly, but it seemed like a bus service run by local people for people in the know, because it wasn't easy to find out (as an occasional traveller) how to pay the fare and how much it was going to be. But, much worse, it was totally unreliable. My partner used the bus to commute to work, but spent on average several hours a week waiting at bus stops. He walked to Heald Green when he worked there rather than spend time waiting for the bus, which was good for his health, and when I was ill in 2013 he learned to drive, bought a car, and hasn't needed to use the bus since. I reckon that this change gave him an extra 60 minutes a day at home thanks to leaving later and, in particular, arriving back earlier from work. By then he worked in East Didsbury, and the bus service appeared to offer a better service than the train because of its frequency, but the reality didn't deliver on the promise.

But since 2007, and especially recently, what was a "fixture" service just deteriorated into a shambolic mess of changes, operators, times and routes.

If you'd asked a random person about the service ten years ago they'd probably have had a vague idea that it was a reasonably frequent service which ran from Wilmslow to Manchester and Macclesfield in different directions. Now, I suspect they wouldn't have an answer other than "what bus service?".

The users who have no choice, mainly the young and elderly, often who don't live near rail alternatives, have been let down by everyone involved. Anyone who has the choice will drive now.

Since I stopped working I sold my car, but I've used the 130 precisely once since I sold my car in November 2018, which was to go to Cheadle ( #1,626 ).

Running bus services in the hope that people might use them, whilst failing to deliver on the timetable promises and making frequent changes to timetable and route mean that, now, probably precisely zero people want to use the service if they have an alternative. Walking to the station may take longer on the face of it, but if it means catching a reliable train service instead of waiting at the side of the road for an unreliable bus service, may be a better option.

Oh yes, and the bus was more expensive than the train on parallel routes. And the bus fares went up often, for no reason, except that the fare rises will have driven even more people off the services.

It's probably something mirrored across the country and caused by deregulation years ago, augmented by starving local councils of money from central government whilst loading them up with centrally-imposed obligations which don't include provision of bus services. It's not a new story I'm sure. But the 130 seems doomed to me.
The 130 is a typical example of what Arriva NW&W love doing when they can't be bothered with a route and don't want anyone else to success. Keep running it at a loss but keep changing it all the time and gradually kill off demand. Then when someone else goes for it, no passengers are left (As D&G have found out). Fair play to D&G for keep trying but it won't help that they are never around for longer than a few months then run off saying it's not viable then running back a few months later. Had they kept the 130 to the Airport on, there would have been 1/2 a chance they would have built up a customer base but... as I have said previously, it's all too easy to try and make things work.
 

jfollows

Established Member
Joined
26 Feb 2011
Messages
5,757
Location
Wilmslow
The 130 is a typical example of what Arriva NW&W love doing when they can't be bothered with a route and don't want anyone else to success. Keep running it at a loss but keep changing it all the time and gradually kill off demand. Then when someone else goes for it, no passengers are left (As D&G have found out).

OK, but why would Arriva seek to run a bus service but deliberately run it down so that they don't get as much money from it? If they didn't want to run the service, they didn't have to, and ultimately came to this conclusion. Is it because of incompetence because I can't see the point of running down a service through deliberate intent? I don't believe Arriva got anything for running the 130 service. And even if they ran it as a loss-making feeder route to some of their other services, there's still no point in running it down.

They certainly gave the appearance of wanting the service to fail, given the shambolic way in which they implemented the service and the dire state of the buses they used on it. I've said before that my partner suffered journeys cut short on three occasions because of bus engine fires.

I agree that by the time Arriva pulled out the service was pretty much doomed. But why couldn't Arriva be bothered with it - is this a manifestation of a corporate structure which leads to the people who have to implement a bus service having no incentive to do so well, perhaps?
 

markymark2000

On Moderation
Joined
11 May 2015
Messages
3,538
Location
Western Part of the UK
OK, but why would Arriva seek to run a bus service but deliberately run it down so that they don't get as much money from it? If they didn't want to run the service, they didn't have to, and ultimately came to this conclusion. Is it because of incompetence because I can't see the point of running down a service through deliberate intent? I don't believe Arriva got anything for running the 130 service. And even if they ran it as a loss-making feeder route to some of their other services, there's still no point in running it down.

They certainly gave the appearance of wanting the service to fail, given the shambolic way in which they implemented the service and the dire state of the buses they used on it. I've said before that my partner suffered journeys cut short on three occasions because of bus engine fires.

I agree that by the time Arriva pulled out the service was pretty much doomed. But why couldn't Arriva be bothered with it - is this a manifestation of a corporate structure which leads to the people who have to implement a bus service having no incentive to do so well, perhaps?
I don't know really what they get out of it but they have done it a fair few times. At least once it has worked (route 12) at Chester and 1 in progress (route 3). They were trying it with the X1 Runcorn as well. Arriva are quite well known for it. 'Death by 1000 cuts' it is known as on some other forums. The only thing I can think of is that if they pulled off a route running every 30 minutes such long distance, people will be asking questions. This way, they kill the demand and can claim it's not viable to beg for funding or eventually cut it.

I think that Arriva want too much from their routes and the routes are controlled by those with no care because they are that high up, they won't lose their job. At one point, I heard someone in Newcastle was doing the timetables for the routes. You also have the Aintree Head Office dictating certain things. They aren't affected by route losses and they don't answer to anyone. It's the local depot who has to deal with the fallout.
 

itsonlyme

Member
Joined
24 Jul 2012
Messages
101
Arriva. Route 84 Crewe - Nantwich. Service frequency roughly half normal due to Covid

09:03 journey cancelled - no driver.

Where are those drivers who are not working?

No, or insufficient, spare staff rostered?

They don't care about customers
 

LOL The Irony

On Moderation
Joined
29 Jul 2017
Messages
5,335
Location
Chinatown, New York
Knutsfords demand is mainly around Longridge.
Because CEC forced it to be there by being incompetent.
It's still quicker for those to go into Knutsford and get the train than it is to travel around Wilmslow to get to Altrincham.
But that's just more money. I'd be somewhat ok with it if the times met up (I can't possibly think why they don't...).
The reality is the network has to change and people like yourself constantly putting up barriers because one or two people make a journey once a week, is what is stopping the network adapting to encourage new passengers.
I'd rather take things more slowly and not take your approach of rushing into bus routes with crayons & scissors. Once the 88 leaves Altrincham, it's probably never going back there. So if the 130 fails, the 88 is stuck going to Handforth. As for barriers, when I went down the why not both approach, you were apprehensive. It's clear both services are important to us and we need to agree that it would be good if both services went to Altrincham. Also, why can't there be a service that goes from Wilmslow to Handforth via Colshaw Farm?
 

Simon75

On Moderation
Joined
25 May 2016
Messages
881
My experience of Arriva North West are with Winsford/Macclesfield depot
They seem to have given up. No day tickets for town only (Macclesfield, Winsford, Northwich)
Macclesfield outstation, in my opinion looks run down (no proper bus wash I believe)
The 38 Sapphire deckers inside look tired.
 

daodao

Established Member
Joined
6 Feb 2016
Messages
2,908
Location
Dunham/Bowdon
When I last had to use Macc, they didn't even offer student tickets. It's pretty clear they're winding down Cheshire operations to focus on Manchester & Merseyside.
Other than withdrawal of route 130 and Sunday/evening services, there is little recent evidence on the ground that Arriva are currently planning to abandon Macclesfield or Winsford completely.
However, in Manchester, their operations are still being whittled down, with recent frequency reductions, withdrawal of routes and withdrawal of evening services. They now only operate 4 services out of their Sharston depot (19, 245, 247 and 263) and relatively few services (presumably including route 10 in Salford) out of their Bolton depot. The long-term viability of these small depots seems dubious.
 

markymark2000

On Moderation
Joined
11 May 2015
Messages
3,538
Location
Western Part of the UK
Other than withdrawal of route 130 and Sunday/evening services, there is little recent evidence on the ground that Arriva are currently planning to abandon Macclesfield or Winsford completely.
However, in Manchester, their operations are still being whittled down, with recent frequency reductions, withdrawal of routes and withdrawal of evening services. They now only operate 4 services out of their Sharston depot (19, 245, 247 and 263) and relatively few services (presumably including route 10 in Salford) out of their Bolton depot. The long-term viability of these small depots seems dubious.
38 reduction and the 84 Saturday reduction could be added to the above. Moving heavy maintenance of Winsford out to Runcorn, not having a depot manager at Winsford for a good 6 months. The aren't trying to kill off the whole area but they are reducing costs as much as they can which eventually leads to reduced standards and it's a slippery slope.

The companies which normally thrive in towns like Macc are independents. There has been many roumers about Centrebus group buying Macc and Winsford for High Peak and D&G respectively but not sure on the truth of it.

Manchester, I think they might wait for the franchising to buy the ops off them. I've seen on a few other forums that Abellio are after the depot as well to bid on franchised routes.
 

LOL The Irony

On Moderation
Joined
29 Jul 2017
Messages
5,335
Location
Chinatown, New York
I've seen on a few other forums that Abellio are after the depot as well to bid on franchised routes.
Stagecoach has also been thrown around although I can't see any service they'd want to operate except for the 38 and a returned 130 (if indeed it does). It's safe to say that we'll probably only really know when it's close to happening.
 

Andy Pacer

Established Member
Joined
11 Jul 2017
Messages
2,644
Location
Leicestershire
38 reduction and the 84 Saturday reduction could be added to the above. Moving heavy maintenance of Winsford out to Runcorn, not having a depot manager at Winsford for a good 6 months. The aren't trying to kill off the whole area but they are reducing costs as much as they can which eventually leads to reduced standards and it's a slippery slope.

The companies which normally thrive in towns like Macc are independents. There has been many roumers about Centrebus group buying Macc and Winsford for High Peak and D&G respectively but not sure on the truth of it.

Manchester, I think they might wait for the franchising to buy the ops off them. I've seen on a few other forums that Abellio are after the depot as well to bid on franchised routes.
I'd rather expect Julian to just be there ready to pick up the pieces should Arriva pull out.
 

jfollows

Established Member
Joined
26 Feb 2011
Messages
5,757
Location
Wilmslow
130 bus has been permanently scrapped. CEC TFGM and the local MP currently looking at something to not leave handforth and Wilmslow with a bus service. Why a wilmslow-handforth-heald green-wythenshawe interchange service cannot be sorted out is beyond me. Gives people access to onward bus travel and the metrolink
Despite the unchanged information on the Cheshire East Web site (https://www.cheshireeast.gov.uk/public_transport/bus/bus_service_changes.aspx)

"Saturday 2 May 2020

130 D&G Bus Macclesfield - Handforth: registration cancelled, service withdrawn. "

the council has given up on keeping the information updated:

"Bus operators may need to change bus services at short notice each day. You should check on the bus operators’ websites for details about individual bus services."

and D&G is showing a limited 130 service now operating at http://www.dgbus.co.uk/assets/sk130_2020-06-08.pdf; which I'm assuming (because it doesn't say anything in the timetable itself) is a service operating from Monday 8 June. Anyway, it looks like a one bus operation with a service every two hours, starting with a service at 07:45 from Handforth to Macclesfield and ending with a 17:45 from Macclesfield to Handforth. Monday to Friday of course.
 

markymark2000

On Moderation
Joined
11 May 2015
Messages
3,538
Location
Western Part of the UK
Despite the unchanged information on the Cheshire East Web site (https://www.cheshireeast.gov.uk/public_transport/bus/bus_service_changes.aspx)

"Saturday 2 May 2020

130 D&G Bus Macclesfield - Handforth: registration cancelled, service withdrawn. "

the council has given up on keeping the information updated:

"Bus operators may need to change bus services at short notice each day. You should check on the bus operators’ websites for details about individual bus services."

and D&G is showing a limited 130 service now operating at http://www.dgbus.co.uk/assets/sk130_2020-06-08.pdf; which I'm assuming (because it doesn't say anything in the timetable itself) is a service operating from Monday 8 June. Anyway, it looks like a one bus operation with a service every two hours, starting with a service at 07:45 from Handforth to Macclesfield and ending with a 17:45 from Macclesfield to Handforth. Monday to Friday of course.
I can confirm that D&G are running a vastly reduced timetable on the 130. CEC has never been good with public transport as we know so this just proves their incompetence.
 
Joined
17 Oct 2013
Messages
41
If not a new service from wilmslow to wythenshawe circular. The rerouting of the 313 to drive through handforth and wilmslow and route back around is something that should be looked at. Or getting the 378 back through to wilmslow station now there’s no longer the traffic issues from when building the bypass. Cab only be CEC not wanting to pay towards these Services considering how many end right in the border. 42b 312 313 378 etc
 

markymark2000

On Moderation
Joined
11 May 2015
Messages
3,538
Location
Western Part of the UK
If not a new service from wilmslow to wythenshawe circular. The rerouting of the 313 to drive through handforth and wilmslow and route back around is something that should be looked at. Or getting the 378 back through to wilmslow station now there’s no longer the traffic issues from when building the bypass. Cab only be CEC not wanting to pay towards these Services considering how many end right in the border. 42b 312 313 378 etc
I fully agree that more could be done. I think Stagecoach don't want to touch Cheshire East if they can help it as is proven with their services all stopping on the border. Their previous experience a few years back cutting back the 378 I think has put them off the area completely. Also the fact we all know Arriva and D&G have slowly killed the demand for buses in the area, any buses sent into Wilmslow will take a little bit of time to build up and gain passengers trust the route will be around for longer than 3 months.

313 now goes to the Airport so that could come off the list. The 312 could extend into Wilmslow using the dead time at Stockport Rail Station.

CECs un willingness to support local buses is bonkers. They are one of the councils which fit into the category of 'don't care and wont care for as long as they keep being paid council tax and gov funds'.
 

M60lad

Member
Joined
31 May 2011
Messages
853
I dont think there is any dead time for 312 or there didnt used to be as the tender that it is tied in with also interworks with other tendered services in Stockport area.
 

markymark2000

On Moderation
Joined
11 May 2015
Messages
3,538
Location
Western Part of the UK
I dont think there is any dead time for 312 or there didnt used to be as the tender that it is tied in with also interworks with other tendered services in Stockport area.
I don't think it interworks anymore since it terminates Stockport Train Station to replace the Stockport Metroshuttle.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top