East Midlands Trains' Franchise extended.

[bunnahabhain]

During the Northern strikes, EMT have been doubling the size of their trains to help people / help them look good.
When it's all sorted, the train lengths will slide back again

Actually services have been over formed where possible today to compensate for the potential issues should a lot of people still attempt to travel on the EMT services and be unfamiliar with the Northern Saturday timetable. 1R98 for example is 4 vice 2.

 

[cactustwirly]

A good, steady, operator. Hopefully, it stays with Stagecoach.

Hmm, they're ok, but there's room for improvement, especially on the Intercity side.
They're definately not as good as SWT, that's for sure!

Personally I hope Abellio win the next franchise, but I'd rather Stagecoach retain it, than Arriva winning.

 

[thenorthern]

Since the West Coast Franchise fiasco in 2012 the Government seems to enjoy extending franchises more than normal, not sure why.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Since the West Coast Franchise fiasco in 2012 the Government seems to enjoy extending franchises more than normal, not sure why.

They (and the civil service more widely) are a bit busy with a little other thing going on at the moment?

 

[Killingworth]

Actually services have been over formed where possible today to compensate for the potential issues should a lot of people still attempt to travel on the EMT services and be unfamiliar with the Northern Saturday timetable. 1R98 for example is 4 vice 2.

With 3 operators on the Sheffield--Manchester section any impact on one will rebound on the others. This morning a points failure east of Scunthorpe meant a TPE service arrived in Sheffield about 50 minutes late and was terminated. The Northern stopper at 9.14 left late and heavily overloaded. I suspect the preceeding and following East Midlands services would also have picked up some of those awaiting the delayed TPE.

The following Northern 10.14 was also heavily overloaded and it's possible anyone wanting to board in the Hope Valley may have had serious difficulty getting aboard.

4 coaches are needed on most EMT trains over that section except those late at night. Demand is growing fast, and I'd be interested to know by how much. With 3 TOCs involved that data may be hard to disentangle.

 

[ChrisC]

Actually services have been over formed where possible today to compensate for the potential issues should a lot of people still attempt to travel on the EMT services and be unfamiliar with the Northern Saturday timetable. 1R98 for example is 4 vice 2.

A number of services on the Robin Hood Line were also strengthened today due to Mansfield Town playing Notts County with a 1pm start at Meadow Lane in Nottingham. EMT are generally very good at this despite limited resources.

 

[jfowkes]

Personally I'll be happy if they stop charging for WiFi in standard, or at least increase the free allowance from a paltry 15 minutes to something like an hour.

 

[bunnahabhain]

Personally I'll be happy if they stop charging for WiFi in standard, or at least increase the free allowance from a paltry 15 minutes to something like an hour.

I prefer the SBB route of installing signal boosters in the train so that people can enjoy decent usage of their own mobile data. Much better for everybody concerned and isn't actually SBBs issue should the booster not be working in that coach, you just have to rely on the mobile network. Let train companies run trains, and phone networks provide your data.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I prefer the SBB route of installing signal boosters in the train so that people can enjoy decent usage of their own mobile data. Much better for everybody concerned and isn't actually SBBs issue should the booster not be working in that coach, you just have to rely on the mobile network. Let train companies run trains, and phone networks provide your data.

SBB I believe also have wi-fi. This is still of benefit for now at least because not all devices have a 4G connection, though like the likes of Rabbit phones this will be resolved over time.

 

[bunnahabhain]

SBB I believe also have wi-fi. This is still of benefit for now at least because not all devices have a 4G connection, though like the likes of Rabbit phones this will be resolved over time.

They have station WiFi, but on train you have to use your own data.

Passengers wanting to use WiFi on the train can use their smartphone as a personal hotspot and go online with their laptop or tablet computer.

 

[Bletchleyite]

They have station WiFi, but on train you have to use your own data.

So it seems, this article also confirms. Thanks.

https://www.thelocal.ch/20180513/sbb-rules-out-free-wi-fi-for-swiss-trains

 

[NoOnesFool]

Personally I'll be happy if they stop charging for WiFi in standard, or at least increase the free allowance from a paltry 15 minutes to something like an hour.

I think it's perfectly reasonable to charge for an additional service in Standard Class. I'm always surprised by how many people are outraged by it. It's no different to say, a tray charge in a hotel for room service or corkage charges in restaurants. At the end of the day, it's an additional service and EMT is a business, so it makes business sense to charge for that service, with all due respect.

 

[w1bbl3]

Personally I'll be happy if they stop charging for WiFi in standard, or at least increase the free allowance from a paltry 15 minutes to something like an hour.

I'd expect the next franchise to include free wifi access. https://www.gov.uk/government/news/free-wi-fi-to-help-rail-commuters-stay-connected

 

[whhistle]

It's no different to say, a tray charge in a hotel for room service or corkage charges in restaurants.

Or is it more akin to charging to use a bag drop off, or an additional charge for using bathroom towels?

The problem is, Wi-Fi is becoming/has become part of daily life and with that, an expectation that the establishment will provide internet for free. Near where I work, there's at least 10 free wifi spots.

Why the railway feels it has to drag it's heels with this, I don't know.
Provide me with good wifi or boosters to allow me to use my own data (although to be fair, a lot of the time it isn't that bad these days).

I'd expect the next franchise to include free wifi access. https://www.gov.uk/government/news/free-wi-fi-to-help-rail-commuters-stay-connected

I wonder if they get round this by providing free wi-fi already?
Albeit for a limited amount of time, but it's still free.

 

[edwin_m]

Part of the problem with wifi on EMT is that the 4G signal on Meridians is (in my experience) pretty terrible - possibly something to do with the film on the windows? So you don't have the option of using your own data.

 

[jfowkes]

I think it's perfectly reasonable to charge for an additional service in Standard Class. I'm always surprised by how many people are outraged by it. It's no different to say, a tray charge in a hotel for room service or corkage charges in restaurants. At the end of the day, it's an additional service and EMT is a business, so it makes business sense to charge for that service, with all due respect.

Well yeah, I'm not arguing that they have some sort of moral duty to provide free WiFi - I'm not outraged by it, just mildly annoyed. One view is that is makes business sense to charge for it, but as I understand it EMT are one of the few TOCs that actually do. It makes business sense to make your customers happy, which seems to be the route most have taken.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Well yeah, I'm not arguing that they have some sort of moral duty to provide free WiFi - I'm not outraged by it, just mildly annoyed. One view is that is makes business sense to charge for it, but as I understand it EMT are one of the few TOCs that actually do. It makes business sense to make your customers happy, which seems to be the route most have taken.

What's worse on VTWC is that not only do they charge for it, but it's also not fit for purpose - the cap is so low that all it's useful for is browsing on a phone, which can be done, er, on the phone. To me the use-case is being able to do my job via VPN, and it doesn't do that well at all.

Furthermore they refuse refunds when people find it is useless for this purpose despite the welcome screen not making it at all clear.

If I had the time I'd have taken them to Court, TBH.

 

[mallard]

Part of the problem with wifi on EMT is that the 4G signal on Meridians is (in my experience) pretty terrible - possibly something to do with the film on the windows? So you don't have the option of using your own data.

East Midlands Trains have (or had) an exclusive deal with Vodafone (link to Vodafone's website detailing the work done) to fit boosters/repeaters (for the Vodafone network only). Therefore, they have no incentive to do anything to improve mobile reception on their trains (I wouldn't be surprised if the Vodafone deal precluded them doing anything about other networks' signal levels).

It's definitely the window coating that's the issue, according to East Midlands Engineering’s Paul Caffrey from the Vodafone article; "It’s a modern train, but its materials – specifically a metallic coating that’s designed to shield the windows from bright sunlight – aren’t conducive to good mobile phone signal."

There's no real reason why a modern train can't have good mobile signal permeability; one of the things that's impressed me about the 80x trains is that mobile signals are excellent and even GPS (which requires the reception of multiple quite weak signals from different directions and has problems working in many buildings and even sometimes in narrow streets surrounded by tall buildings) works reliably! Surely replacing the old metal film window coatings with whatever the 80x train use at the next (urgently needed) refurbishment of the 222s wouldn't be impossible, unless the Vodafone deal prevents it.

 

[edwin_m]

East Midlands Trains have (or had) an exclusive deal with Vodafone (link to Vodafone's website detailing the work done) to fit boosters/repeaters (for the Vodafone network only). Therefore, they have no incentive to do anything to improve mobile reception on their trains (I wouldn't be surprised if the Vodafone deal precluded them doing anything about other networks' signal levels).

My useless 4G reception on Meridians is via ... Vodafone.

 

[InTheEastMids]

It's definitely the window coating that's the issue, according to East Midlands Engineering’s Paul Caffrey from the Vodafone article; "It’s a modern train, but its materials – specifically a metallic coating that’s designed to shield the windows from bright sunlight – aren’t conducive to good mobile phone signal."

Plus it absolutely hammers the phone battery as the handset whacks up the power to get anything through. And it more or less blocks GPS signals meaning you can't use Speedview to see how much faster they are than the HSTs.

I'm all for whatever option's likely to keep the HST's in place for the longest time. From that point of view, a continually extended franchise seems ideal.

No, they need replacing asap with modern, electric trains that are faster, quieter, more reliable, more accessible, don't chuck out CO2, don't fill stations full of fumes, aren't riddled with corrosion (apparently) and don't empty **** onto the tracks. Apart from that, they are fine.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Plus it absolutely hammers the phone battery as the handset whacks up the power to get anything through. And it more or less blocks GPS signals meaning you can't use Speedview to see how much faster they are than the HSTs.

Talking of that coating, are new windows on 22x using a different type to reduce the issue? I saw a Virgin Voyager in bright sunlight on Saturday, and it was obvious that about half the windows had a completely different coloured coating on them, and it wasn't a regular half, it was fairly random as to which ones, so looked a bit like it had been done progressively based on which had needed replacement for whatever reason. One was blueish and quite reflective, and one more brownish and matt.

 

[bb21]

My useless 4G reception on Meridians is via ... Vodafone.

They couldn't have done a very good job with it if they already attempted to solve the problem. Even last year I was told by the twitter team more would be done to improve reception on them, but so far, very little improvement. They have had long enough to resolve that issue so to me that is a big black mark.

The 222s in my opinion offer one of the worst customer journey experiences on the network at the moment, which is a shame really, as they are rather reliable units. I actively seek to avoid them not because I vastly prefer the clapped out HSTs, but rather because I can at least work on them, and not have threadbare seats whose frames dig into the back of my thigh.

 

[yorksrob]

Plus it absolutely hammers the phone battery as the handset whacks up the power to get anything through. And it more or less blocks GPS signals meaning you can't use Speedview to see how much faster they are than the HSTs.



No, they need replacing asap with modern, electric trains that are faster, quieter, more reliable, more accessible, don't chuck out CO2, don't fill stations full of fumes, aren't riddled with corrosion (apparently) and don't empty **** onto the tracks. Apart from that, they are fine.

Well, good luck with that - given that they're likely to be replaced with stock that's cramped, has uncomfortable hard seating, will commit us to chucking out fumes in all the major stations except St Pancras for another 20 - 30 years, more reliable (I'll believe it when I see it), have those dreadful vacuum toilets with hand dryers that don't work and lock themselves out of use at the drop of a hat, suffers from door failures because the computer needs rebooting etc.

I'll stick with the well designed comfortable and reliable HST for the timebeing thank you.

 

[Cosmicismsx]

There's no real reason why a modern train can't have good mobile signal permeability; one of the things that's impressed me about the 80x trains is that mobile signals are excellent and even GPS (which requires the reception of multiple quite weak signals from different directions and has problems working in many buildings and even sometimes in narrow streets surrounded by tall buildings) works reliably! Surely replacing the old metal film window coatings with whatever the 80x train use at the next (urgently needed) refurbishment of the 222s wouldn't be impossible, unless the Vodafone deal prevents it.

Not to sidetrack too much, but mobile phone "permeability" was specified in the tender for the IEP Class 800 trains. A really good inclusion after many years of Voyagers/Meridians and to some extend the pendolinos being basically faraday cages on rails.