ECML/MML major power problems (09/08)

Discussion in 'UK Railway Discussion' started by yorkie, 9 Aug 2019.

  1. TrainGeekUK

    TrainGeekUK Member

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    Disruption now on Southern and Gatwick Express, plus Clapham Junction has lost all its departure boards.

    What procedures are now used to combat this problem as I’ve never heard of such a large power outage occurring on this scale.
     
  2. lyndhurst25

    lyndhurst25 Member

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    No problems with domestic electricity supply here in north Liverpool. The problem seems to be very widespread for it just to be due to weather or lightning. People have talked about the possibility of cyberattacks on infrastructure. Pure speculation and I hope that this isn't the case.
     
  3. AndrewE

    AndrewE Established Member

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    and as long as the signaling keeps working!
     
  4. High Dyke

    High Dyke Established Member

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    There are ways and means that you can get round that, but the important thing is that you still have a good means of communication.
     
  5. sharpley

    sharpley Member

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    A sudden drop in generating capacity to the National Grid, causing a significant drop in frequency below its 50Hz norm is being reported on Twitter (for what thats worth)
     
  6. robbeech

    robbeech Established Member

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    This in itself can cause chaos with sensitive equipment, far far more than a fluctuation in voltage every with with modern equipment. That said, things ought to be good for a few Hz below so it would have to be some serious change.
     
  7. HSTEd

    HSTEd Established Member

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    And years of corner cutting by DECC/BEIS/whoever/Free Markets in allowing the generating margin to shrink finally bites them.
     
  8. Hadders

    Hadders Established Member

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    A 700 has just passed WGC on the northbound slow.
     
  9. Saint66

    Saint66 Member

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    LNER suspended in and out of Kings Cross at the moment.
     
  10. westv

    westv Established Member

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    First time I've been on a northbound service that has called at platform 1 at Peterborough.
     
  11. HSTEd

    HSTEd Established Member

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    Gridwatch suggests grid frequency was as low as 48.889Hz at 15:55
    And that wasn't the extreme value but just the one that happened to be taken then.

    Licence requirement is above 49.5Hz
     
  12. harryclewis

    harryclewis Member

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    Reports on Twitter of passengers having left a stranded train. Sounds like absolute pandemonium today, glad I got the bus!

    https://mobile.twitter.com/GNRailUK/status/1159872660538634240

     
    Last edited: 9 Aug 2019
  13. AntoniC

    AntoniC Member

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    There is a problem in Liverpool affecting Wirral Line services, resolution date/time unknown.
    They are trying to organise Rail Replacement Buses or advising make your own way home.
    Source : Merseyrail https://www.merseyrail.org/
     
  14. robbeech

    robbeech Established Member

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    Yes, 48.889 would be as low as I’ve seen a grid measurement for a while, and of course that’s generally an average of a set number of cycles so it may have been lower. Anyone playing an old Hammond Organ is going to be very annoyed.
     
  15. hwl

    hwl Established Member

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    Looks like 0.95GW of Wind generation suddenly went off line (lightning strike on windfarm substation???)
     
  16. Highlandspring

    Highlandspring Established Member

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    It’s not often I laugh out loud at something on the internet, so well done in that regard.
     
  17. lyndhurst25

    lyndhurst25 Member

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    243V 50.0Hz on my supply in Liverpool just now.

    If I were an evil genius planning a cyber attack, Friday evening rush hour would be when I'd do it.
     
  18. MJG

    MJG Member

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    Kings Cross station is closed according to the BBC. Power out in the subway at Clapham Junction resulting in what looks like dangerous conditions.
     
  19. HSTEd

    HSTEd Established Member

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    We really are in trouble if 950MWe of plant dropping can cause this.

    Sizewell B could do that with a single unexpected trip, or a site trip at another nuclear station, for example.
     
  20. Dren Ahmeti

    Dren Ahmeti Member

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    From what I’ve heard from a friend at UKPN, it’s due to a gust of wind maxing out the wind turbines and causing surge protection to kick in.
     
  21. Mathew S

    Mathew S Established Member

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    There's a specific entry in the internal style guide banning 'power outage' along with most other Americanisms.
    That said, conveying meaning is more important than linguistic nicities. Especially in situations like this.
     
  22. Essexman

    Essexman Established Member

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    Gust of wind. God?

    If in doubt of who to blame I tend to say it's most likely to be the Tories.

    Seriously, why should people get compensation if no one is at fault. Some things can't be helped.
     
  23. hwl

    hwl Established Member

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    Yep not good. With Sizewell scramming you would at least have some time to adjust though.

    This will be one of those we didn't model/understand that properly jobs.
     
  24. MalaiseForever

    MalaiseForever Member

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    Why does it seem to be the default when an incident occurs for passengers to attempt to force their way off the train? This seems to happening with greater frequency of late. How it can be stopped?
     
  25. Dren Ahmeti

    Dren Ahmeti Member

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    Because people seeing such incidents occurring in the media has begun to normalise pulling the egresses.

    Education in these situations is paramount; this time round, detrainments were considered very quickly due to the amount of trains stranded.
     
  26. gazzaa2

    gazzaa2 Member

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    Trains are busier and busier so people are less willing to be stranded for hours if they haven't even got a seat or even space to move. Also, the more people that are on the train then by the law of averages the more likely it is someone will try and force their way off. Especially if you're within site of a platform.

    If it's an air conditioned train with toilets and refreshments and everyone/most has a seat then it's far less likely.
     
  27. Mitchell Hurd

    Mitchell Hurd Member

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    CrossCountry have tweeted that because of disruption (i.e multiple incidents across the network) they're unable to do cycle or seat reservations. They'll be responding to more urgent tweets basically.

    I'm not liking the sound of this!
     
  28. malc-c

    malc-c Member

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    just watching open trains and the area between Hatfield and Welwyn North is gridlocked and hasn't changed in the past 45 minutes since I opened the page. !!

    It's hard to accept that a gust of wind caused a wind turbine to in turn cause this disruption... Surely they would have been designed to withstand winds well in excess of those we get here in the UK.
     
  29. AndrewE

    AndrewE Established Member

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    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-49300025 says
    Let's hope that all the railway ones are run up regularly, the fuel tanks are de-sludged on schedule and that they have enough capacity for 12 hours or so...
     
  30. gazzaa2

    gazzaa2 Member

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    Emergency services dealing with an incident between Cheltenham and Bristol.
     

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