End of Austerity Measures? Cameron next victim?

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Masboroughlad

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Well, in France they have voted Investment vs Austerity. Greece going the same way.

Cameron and Clegg got a kicking in the polls last week....

Have people had enough? The very rich geting richer and the gap getting wider?

I wonder if Clegg and the LibDems will hold out on their issues of Lords reform, gay marriage etc as the Conservatives step up a gear on lurching to the right?

I'd like to thnk that this will be the start of the end of the coallition in the UK, but am sure the lilly livered LDs will give up on their morals and values once more!

Worrying thing in Greece is the strength of the far right. I hope we don't go that way. Multi-cultural, open, welcoming Britain is a good place to live.

Going to be an interesting year in politics! (Well as interesting as it can be!)
 
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Trog

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Get real.

It does not matter which party is in power, the country is in hock up to its eyeballs and spending more than we earn has to stop.

As for the Greeks they can vote to start spending again every day of the week, but if no one will lend them the money that won't get them very far.
 

455driver

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Maybe if we stopped (or at least cut back) on the amount of money we give away in "foreign aid" we could get out of this mess a bit quicker.
 

ainsworth74

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Well, in France they have voted Investment vs Austerity. Greece going the same way.

They've voted that way, whether or not they'll actually get it is another matter entirely. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Hollande tones down some of his election pledges now that he's actually in office (though he might not have a choice if the legislature elections in June don't go his way as Sarkozys UMP hold power there so they'd need to be unseated for him to able to have free reign).

I would also be surprised if the LibDems gave up on Lords reform as there is fairly good cross party support for that, just disagreements on what form it's going to take. As for Gay Marriage that could get lost in the crossfire because it probably isn't a big issue for most people (though of course it is a massive issue for those that actually want to get married and it's ridiculous that it isn't already legal).

The far right in this country is the BNP and the National Front and neither are exactly bashing the doors down when it comes to getting representation. The BNP have a few councilors on local councils and a couple of seats at the European Parliament. I don't think we're about to see British shift suddenly to the right wing of the political spectrum. There might be a shift to the left but I'd doubt it's going to be anything spectacular (I doubt that the Socialist Party or the Trade Unionist and Socialist Coalition are about to take the House of Commons by storm).

It is real - it is happening!

What's happening? Some sort of left wing uprising or a general strike that's going to bring down the government? I find that highly unlikely.

As Trog says until we can get the deficit down to manageable levels (give it a year or two more) there isn't much we can do. The reason we've not had our credit rating curtailed (with the consequent increases in the cost of borrowing that would help stuff the economy even more) is that we actually have a plan (of sorts) to bring our borrowing back under control, therefore the credit markets still have some confidence in our ability to service our debts. If you would like to know what happens when that confidence evaporates, look at Greece.

Maybe if we stopped (or at least cut back) on the amount of money we give away in "foreign aid" we could get out of this mess a bit quicker.

Agreed. Why are we giving money to India (for example) when they'd rather spend money on a space program and ICBMs than feeding their poor?
 

IanXC

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They've voted that way, whether or not they'll actually get it is another matter entirely. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Hollande tones down some of his election pledges now that he's actually in office (though he might not have a choice if the legislature elections in June don't go his way as Sarkozys UMP hold power there so they'd need to be unseated for him to able to have free reign).

He has already started to tone down his pledges. Hes gone from 'we will renegotiate the Stability Pact' to 'we will negotiate a new agreement on Growth'. I think its likely the legislature elections will give a result as split down the middle as the presidential elections have been.

I would also be surprised if the LibDems gave up on Lords reform as there is fairly good cross party support for that, just disagreements on what form it's going to take. As for Gay Marriage that could get lost in the crossfire because it probably isn't a big issue for most people (though of course it is a massive issue for those that actually want to get married and it's ridiculous that it isn't already legal).

I think that there is probably quite a lot of discussion going on ahead of the Queens Speech. I think its probably fair to say the content has changed quite a lot over the last week!

If the Conservatives are to bring forward some of the kind of proposals that they perhaps put on the back burned while in coalition, I think that will harden the view within the Liberal Democrats that certain policies must be pursued. Further and faster on the personal allowance is likely to be high on the agenda, along with Lords Reform.

Marriage is an interesting one. I think the Conservative backbenches are keen to implement something like the married couples tax allowance, however I think that the Liberal Democrat backbenches will want something in return. Perhaps Gay Marriage.

Maybe if we stopped (or at least cut back) on the amount of money we give away in "foreign aid" we could get out of this mess a bit quicker.

Agreed. Why are we giving money to India (for example) when they'd rather spend money on a space program and ICBMs than feeding their poor?

While I agree that India has demonstrated it no longer required international aid, I don't think that we really ought to be reducing the help we give to the poorest people in the world in order to have little impact on our overall budgetary position.
 

ainsworth74

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While I agree that India has demonstrated it no longer required international aid, I don't think that we really ought to be reducing the help we give to the poorest people in the world in order to have little impact on our overall budgetary position.

Hmm perhaps. I think the two things that rankle me are that 1) countries like India are still getting aid (perhaps we should refocus our spending away from nations with space programs?) and 2) that the DFID budget has escaped any sort of reduction whilst the budgets of departments that actually do things for the people that live in the UK have been cut (I should point out I have no issue with the DFID spending on the Overseas Territories however).
 

Ferret

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It is going to be an interesting few months...... for Europe and for the UK!

And America. If the markets have an attack of the vapours over here, it'll spread back to the US in a flash. Still, it's all well and good the voters rejecting austerity, but if you wish to go on a spending spree funded by borrowing, there has to be someone willing to lend you the money...
 

IanXC

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And America. If the markets have an attack of the vapours over here, it'll spread back to the US in a flash. Still, it's all well and good the voters rejecting austerity, but if you wish to go on a spending spree funded by borrowing, there has to be someone willing to lend you the money...

Well unless you just inflate your way there, although then of course cost of your existing borrowing rises, and ultimately you end up not being able to renew it. And default comes after that.
 

NY Yankee

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And America. If the markets have an attack of the vapours over here, it'll spread back to the US in a flash. Still, it's all well and good the voters rejecting austerity, but if you wish to go on a spending spree funded by borrowing, there has to be someone willing to lend you the money...

Don't worry. In America, they blame everything on Obama, even though his predecessor was ten times worse.

Hmm perhaps. I think the two things that rankle me are that 1) countries like India are still getting aid (perhaps we should refocus our spending away from nations with space programs?)

Countries like India and North Korea spend money on nuclear weapons while their citizens starve. Africa has been in abject poverty for decades. There's a reason why everyone from India and Africa wants to emigrate to the UK.
 

Clip

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No, the tide has turned in Greece and France.

Well they have only voted in new governments - maybe those they have voted in have no real idea of how the markets work and what is going to be available to them to try and increase spending and cut their austerity measures.

I can see Greece only going one way and thats out the Euro and trying to rebuild their country back under the Drachma - though this in itself will cost them. Worth noting though how they now approach things like taxes as when I was there back in jan/feb they now all give you a reciept for everything you purchase whereas before they didnt so they can show they are declaring what they are taking. I did hear from my friends there that this was a major issue as many places were declaring far less than they were taking..

But it will be interesting with France and what Hollande has declared he will do with high earners paying an astonishing amount of income tax and reneging on the austerity packages that were agreed with the European Union.

But whatever happens with Europe will have an effect on us and that is stuff that is out of our hands and im not sure people understand that we cannot control it nor the effect on our markets.
 

Eagle

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No, the tide has turned in Greece and France.
Well they have only voted in new governments...
That's just to do with timing. If we'd had a general election this year then it's fairly obvious that Labour would win with a decent majority (current opinion polls predict a majority of 90 to 100 seats, see here).

Although I should point out for pedantry reasons that France hasn't elected a new government, it's elected a new president. (Their general election will take place next month; their government is currently a conservative–liberal coalition, with a mainly socialist opposition... ring any bells?)
 

Clip

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That's just to do with timing. If we'd had a general election this year then it's fairly obvious that Labour would win with a decent majority (current opinion polls predict a majority of 90 to 100 seats, see here).

Although I should point out for pedantry reasons that France hasn't elected a new government, it's elected a new president. (Their general election will take place next month; their government is currently a conservative–liberal coalition, with a mainly socialist opposition... ring any bells?)

Oh aye Labour would romp it now which is why the coalition will ride out the storm by not calling an Election for a few more years.

But again - Thatcher rode out a stiff 2 year recession in the early 80s, I seem to remember her being in power a lot longer ;)

True about it only being the President they have elected something that I shouldve said.
 

Eagle

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Oh aye Labour would romp it now which is why the coalition will ride out the storm by not calling an Election for a few more years.

Not that they're actually able to call an early election anymore; the Fixed Term Parliaments Act 2011 means that the only way the election won't be on 07-05-2015 is if there's a vote of no confidence. (Not even a world war can change it anymore; although in the unlikely event that were to happen I guess there'd be a temporary Act passed to override it.)
 
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4SRKT

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Not that they're actually able to call an early election anymore; the Fixed Term Parliaments Act 2011 means that the only way the election won't be on 07-05-2015 is if there's a vote of no confidence. (Not even a world war can change it anymore; although in the unlikely event that were to happen I guess there'd be a temporary Act passed to override it.)

Or given that a world war would go nuclear very quickly a temporary act might not be necessary if all the voters are dead. Or mutants dragging their knuckles through the dust and debris of what was once society (sounds a bit like a night out in Peterborough TBH).
 

Aictos

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Or given that a world war would go nuclear very quickly a temporary act might not be necessary if all the voters are dead. Or mutants dragging their knuckles through the dust and debris of what was once society (sounds a bit like a night out in Peterborough TBH).

Am sure there are worse places then Peterborough, ;)
 

LE Greys

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Am sure there are worse places then Peterborough, ;)

Next stop south on East Coast semi-fasts!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
That's just to do with timing. If we'd had a general election this year then it's fairly obvious that Labour would win with a decent majority (current opinion polls predict a majority of 90 to 100 seats, see here).

Although I should point out for pedantry reasons that France hasn't elected a new government, it's elected a new president. (Their general election will take place next month; their government is currently a conservative–liberal coalition, with a mainly socialist opposition... ring any bells?)

Meaning that the next government spends its first year reversing half of what the previous government did, and then takes the credit for the economy picking up - which it's almost certainly going to do anyway no matter who is in power. Labour then breaks the bank again, and undoubtedly people cheer them on because they can't see beyond the end of their current pay cheque.
 

Xenophon PCDGS

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I am idly thinking.....
"What if Labour under the leadership of Gordon "Prudence" Brown had actually won the last General Election"


No-one would better know what the debt level incurred under his long period of Chancellorship actually was, than he. As such, the electorate would need to then be told what measures were proposed by the Labour government to meet the required debt reduction programme.

How would Labour under his leadership be handling matters in May 2012, as he had far more experience of world financial organisational structures than any of the current Labour shadow cabinet members.
 

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How would Labour under his leadership be handling matters in May 2012, as he had far more experience of world financial organisational structures than any of the current Labour shadow cabinet members.

Sorry to edit the full post so heavily but I cant answer the first part but I would like to add to the second.

Why is it that Labour now say they have all the answers to our problems yet fully dont explain them and if they do have the answers why didnt they put them into practice when the serious financial crash happened?


And why do the electorate not understand that we are in the fall out of what the presiding govt oversaw so how can they possibly think that such an inept group of politicians who were in positions of power in the last government can possibly do any better now?
 

Johnuk123

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Sorry to edit the full post so heavily but I cant answer the first part but I would like to add to the second.

Why is it that Labour now say they have all the answers to our problems yet fully dont explain them and if they do have the answers why didnt they put them into practice when the serious financial crash happened?


And why do the electorate not understand that we are in the fall out of what the presiding govt oversaw so how can they possibly think that such an inept group of politicians who were in positions of power in the last government can possibly do any better now?

Agree with all that.

Anyone noticed how the chief culprit Gordon Brown has vanished into the Scottish mist.
 

swj99

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.............and if they do have the answers why didn't they put them into practice when the serious financial crash happened?

...........an inept group of politicians who were in positions of power in the last government can possibly do any better now?

The crash would have happened regardless. Several politicians over the years have promised to end the 'boom - bust' characteristics of the capitalist economies, but none has succeeded. This is because economies are cyclical, ie we have a period of growth and prosperity followed by a period of stagnation and depression. You could almost compare it to King Canute's failure to stop the tide from coming in.

Russian Economist Nikolai Kondratiev was the first person to realize the cyclical nature of economic life. Several books have been written about it including one called The Downwave, by Robert Beckman. This book was published back in the late 1980s. Has anyone from here read it ?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/The-Downwave-Surviving-Second-Depression/dp/0903852381

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kondratiev_wave

Personally, I don't think politicians are inept. Immoral sometimes maybe, but they're not usually poor are they ? Could this be because they know it's possible to get rich in a recession ?



If the chart is anywhere near accurate, then it appears to be spelling good news, in that we seem to be at the end of the current downwave, so the tide is about to turn and a period of growth and prosperity is dawning.
 
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