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EU Referendum: The result and aftermath...

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NSEFAN

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125 forever said:
The more reasonable thing to do would not be to bomb countries in the first place, therefore no need for migrants to come here.
I agree that not bombing the middle east to pieces would be good, although we're not the only ones involved in this, and even then it'll take a long time to rebuild some of the hellholes that have been created.

But in any case, refugees aren't the only people who come to the UK. As others have said, the government still allows plenty of non-EU immigration each year, so the UK's population and resource problems cannot really be blamed upon the EU.
 

DynamicSpirit

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Although it may be reasonable to think that recently arrived migrants with no possessions and without two pennies to rub together would indeed be in the greatest need of housing, and would therefore be housed before others slightly better off who had been on the housing list for years?

Yes, migrants in that situation would theoretically be in greatest need of housing, but unless they actually have secured one of certain types of visa to remain in the UK, they still won't be entitled to a council house. EU migrants exercising treaty rights can in theory get council houses - but if they've only just arrived, they are likely to fall foul of the guidelines requiring residency for 2 years (I think that's to be increased to 5 years, not sure if that's already happened). And besides, EU migrants tend not to arrive with children and 'without two pennies to rub together'!

So in practice the number of people in the situation you describe and able to get council houses is likely to be negligibly small. Asylum seekers might be given some temporary accommodation (eg. some kind of hostel) but they are not entitled to council houses either - unless/until they are actually granted asylum - and contrary to popular belief, those numbers are relatively small. So asylum seekers also shouldn't have any direct significant impact on housing supply for UK citizens (It may cost the local authority money, but that too won't restrict council house supply, since the limiting factor is Government regulation apparently designed to prevent local authorities building more houses).

Bluntly, the kind of immigration you describe is not going to significantly impact council house availability or waiting times for UK citizens. (Sadly of course, that doesn't stop lots of people incorrectly blaming immigration for their housing problems when the cause is nothing of the sort). I don't want to belittle the housing problems. We have a very serious social housing crisis, which is causing untold misery for so many people who need council houses and can't get them. But, on the whole, the problem is not caused by immigration, or by our membership of the EU)
 
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Xenophon PCDGS

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Who or what is 'Bliar'?

I think there is a process called word blending, as used in "Brexit", so my suggestion for what it is worth comes from the two words "bl**dy" ( here I am being rather kind) and "liar"...:D
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Who (or what) is BLM?

Branch Lending Managers, (found in a number of financial institutions....so I have been told)...:D
 

SWTCommuter

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Who or what is 'Bliar'?


It's a deliberate misspelling of the surname of a recent Prime Minister

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WelshBluebird

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EVERYBODY matters and not just some. As much as I am against hatred of minorities (believe it or not) I am also against hatred of the silent majority who have been ignored for far too long.

But it isn't a silent majority is it. Don't be disengenious with your arguments, it gets in the way of any good points you may make.

The people have spoken, so now it's their time.

What people?

In terms of Brexit, the majority was a narrow one. And if you then consider "the people" to be those who didn't vote too then you no longer have a majority.

In terms of Trump, he didn't even get a majority when it comes to "the people". The only reason he has won is because of the electoral college. Certainly not "the people", he only got the votes of about a quarter of those able to vote.
 
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Railops

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In terms of Trump, he didn't even get a majority when it comes to "the people". The only reason he has won is because of the electoral college. Certainly not "the people", he only got the votes of about a quarter of those able to vote.

I very much doubt that Clinton publically complained about the tried and tested electoral system in the U.S. before the election.
You moan that Trump only got 25% of the votes of potential voters, Clinton had virtually the same number of votes so if she had won it would have been no different.
Not wanting to bring US politics into this thread I'll say no more.
 
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WelshBluebird

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I very much doubt that Clinton publically complained about the tried and tested electoral system in the U.S. before the election.
You moan that Trump only got 25% of the votes of potential voters, Clinton had virtually the same number of votes so if she had won it would have been no different.
Not wanting to bring US politics into this thread I'll say no more.

Oh I agree, I am not complaining about the result. The system they have is well know and has helped Democrats and Republicans alike. I don't specifically agree with it, but that is for a different discussion!

I am more making a point of the fact the phrase that is being banded about after the result is totally disingenuous when compared with what actually happened. All this talk about "the will of the people" or that "the people have spoken" or "the silent majority" and all that rubbish.
 

miami

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Oh I agree, I am not complaining about the result. The system they have is well know and has helped Democrats and Republicans alike. I don't specifically agree with it, but that is for a different discussion!

The only time in living history this happened was 2000 with the hanging chads / Bush-Gore debacle. Before then you have to go back to 1888, when the Democrats won the popular vote and lost the Electoral College. Again in 1876 the Democrats lost out. The other time was 1824 before the current parties (it was the Federalists and the Democratic Republicans)
 

TheKnightWho

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The only time in living history this happened was 2000 with the hanging chads / Bush-Gore debacle. Before then you have to go back to 1888, when the Democrats won the popular vote and lost the Electoral College. Again in 1876 the Democrats lost out. The other time was 1824 before the current parties (it was the Federalists and the Democratic Republicans)

As predicted, it's the small, safe, conservative mid-Western states that cause this in modern times. I'm at a loss as to how it happened in the 19th century though, given the Democrats were the right-wing party back then.
 
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YorkshireBear

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So LEGO has ended the deal with The Daily Mail, because of the remarks the newspaper made about immigrants.

Hopefully the first of many.

The media throughout the EU Referendum and the US election has done nothing but incite hatred and fear so they can sell the media. Essentially lying with their own propaganda so that everyone follows their agenda (both sides).

For every person saying that Brexit will be a glorious return to days of old for the UK there is another saying it will be end of the world and we should be worried and leave and be depressed.

If both of them stopped we might have a chance. But for me whilever the media are not held to account over what they print society will continue to be divided and embarrassing.
 
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DynamicSpirit

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As predicted, it's the small, safe, conservative mid-Western states that cause this in modern times. I'm at a loss as to how it happened in the 19th century though, given the Democrats were the right-wing party back then.

At a guess, I'd say it's most likely that the Democrat vote was more highly concentrated, resulting in them getting a few large majorities where the Republicans got more smaller majorities. That seems to be borne out by Wikipedia. Scroll down to 'Election Results' and open the 'Results by County' map on the right. This seems to show lots of places where the Democrats got > 90% of the vote, but relatively few equivalents for the Republicans. The impression I get is that that's really what killed Hilary's chances this year too.

In a first-past-the-post based system, having your vote more geographically concentrated is great if you are a small party (like the SNP in the UK) but a real downer if you're one of the biggest parties.
 

me123

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... one could argue he's doing a better job than Corbyn, as much as it pains me to say it.
 

me123

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I don't really see how Farage is on the same side as the government. Certainly they don't entirely disagree, but they don't entirely agree. And I see of and hear from Farage more than I do from Corbyn.
 

dosxuk

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... one could argue he's doing a better job than Corbyn, as much as it pains me to say it.

Apart from the bit about him being completely incapable of getting himself elected to Parliament.

In fact, why's he spending so much time in the US at the moment? We're paying him to be in Brussels.
 

me123

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In fact, why's he spending so much time in the US at the moment? We're paying him to be in Brussels.

He's never bothered turning up for work and it seems people like him for it. This is your "man of the people", everyone. He gets a ~£6,537 per month salary, and is happy to make full use of the expenses system too, yet has participated in less than half of the parliament's votes.
 

PHILIPE

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Apart from the bit about him being completely incapable of getting himself elected to Parliament.

In fact, why's he spending so much time in the US at the moment? We're paying him to be in Brussels.

Carwyn Jones, the Welsh First Minister, today stated that Farage should have been at a Remembrance Event at home yesterday instead of hobnobbing with Trump
 

Tim R-T-C

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Problem is, Farage is like Trump, seemingly immune to criticism that would destroy a lot of moderate politicans.

I suspect a lot of people who voted for Trump and Farage/UKIP didn't necessarily like the men, but supported the message and see them as the only people prepared to stand up and say it.
 
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Baxenden Bank

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Hopefully the first of many.

The media throughout the EU Referendum and the US election has done nothing but incite hatred and fear so they can sell the media. Essentially lying with their own propaganda so that everyone follows their agenda (both sides).

For every person saying that Brexit will be a glorious return to days of old for the UK there is another saying it will be end of the world and we should be worried and leave and be depressed.

If both of them stopped we might have a chance. But for me whilever the media are not held to account over what they print society will continue to be divided and embarrassing.

The problem is, people keep buying those papers (or watching the TV Channels) so the publishers / editors must feel they are addressing their market.
 

Domh245

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37983948

The government has no overall Brexit plan and a negotiating strategy may not be agreed by the cabinet for six months, a leaked memo has suggested.
The memo - obtained by The Times and seen by the BBC - warns Whitehall is working on 500 Brexit-related projects and could need 30,000 extra staff.
However, there is still no common exit strategy "because of divisions within the cabinet", the leaked document adds.
A government spokesman said it "didn't recognise" the claims made in the memo.

Well I never. It turns out the Government doesn't have a plan. Who'd have thought it.
 

Railops

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37983948



Well I never. It turns out the Government doesn't have a plan. Who'd have thought it.

Cameron said months ago that there never was any alternative plan as Remain would obviously win, looked what happened to him.
It's down to Cameron that now we're playing catch-up with Nigel Farage the only politician with his finger on the pulse.
He's run rings round the Tories making Remainer May look a complete fool.
 

TheKnightWho

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Cameron said months ago that there never was any alternative plan as Remain would obviously win, looked what happened to him.
It's down to Cameron that now we're playing catch-up with Nigel Farage the only politician with his finger on the pulse.
He's run rings round the Tories making Remainer May look a complete fool.

No he didn't. He said it was Leave's duty to come up with their own plan.

As usual, that personal responsibility thing you have going on always seems to go out the window when it comes to yourselves...
 

AM9

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Cameron said months ago that there never was any alternative plan as Remain would obviously win, looked what happened to him.
It's down to Cameron that now we're playing catch-up with Nigel Farage the only politician with his finger on the pulse.
He's run rings round the Tories making Remainer May look a complete fool.

Who is to blame is irrelevant (so is Farage). The fact is the current administration is all at sea about the biggest change to the UK for 50 years but they still keep plodding on.
 
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