EU Referendum: The result and aftermath...

[HLE]

We don't need those foreign cars anyway. Let's go back to the days of Pony & Trap. Well apart from Farage; he'll have a German car.

I'll dig out the muck bucket and spade.

 

[EM2]

Away from Honda...
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-tariffs-in-case-of-no-deal-michael-gove-says

The government will apply tariffs to food imports to protect British farmers in a no-deal scenario, the environment secretary, Michael Gove, has confirmed.

And, contrary to claims by hard Brexiters, he warned that delays were likely in Calais because of mandatory EU checks on food imports on the French side of the channel.

The tariff regime Britain would like to apply in the event of no deal will be revealed in the “next few days”.

He told the National Farmers’ Union’s annual conference in Birmingham that reports that Britain would operate a zero tariff regime in order to secure frictionless trade in a no-deal scenario were “not accurate”.
...
“The EU still have not listed the UK as a full third country … As I speak there is no absolute guarantee we will continue to be able to export to the EU,” he told farmers.

Gove also said that the dangers of no deal would not be removed if, in future, a trade deal was sealed between the UK and the EU.

Once tariffs are imposed by the EU on British exports “it will be difficult to re-establish that market access even if tariffs reduced in the future”.

 

[dosxuk]

That's going to upset Mr Wetherspoons, he's spent the last two years telling us how prices are going to get cheaper because he won't have to pay tariffs on his food and drink imports.

 

[furnessvale]

It's only the same as Brexiters not believing experts when they say something they don't want to hear, but believe them when they do. My money's on the CEO not wanting to upset his Brexit-supporting buyers, I reckon the union rep's nailed it; but let's face it, why are they moving to Japan which has got a free-trade deal with the EU when the UK hasn't?

Anyhow the good news generally is that unemployment's down; so that makes a mockery of leaving the EU to free up jobs. So now what are we leaving for?

Fair enough. I've always believed remainers have a selective memory when it comes to what facts to believe. Thanks for the confirmation.

 

[Groningen]

Both sides have selective memory! Leave: no problem at all and Remain: there will be chaos.

 

[YorkshireBear]

Fair enough. I've always believed remainers have a selective memory when it comes to what facts to believe. Thanks for the confirmation.

Both sides are as bad as each other you cannot possibly deny this.

 

[furnessvale]

Both sides are as bad as each other you cannot possibly deny this.

Both sides have selective memory! Leave: no problem at all and Remain: there will be chaos.

No problem but we made progress when a remainer admitted that BOTH sides have a selective memory.

Previously, the narrative has always been only leave had that fault.

 

[Howardh]

You had your vote and lost.
There's been a significant amount of airtime and commons time given to those who want to remain & have a second vote. Hardly ignored.

And where has all that "time" got us? Absolutely nowhere as we're still stuck chained to the ERG, and I don't recall any single vote for their version of Brexit at the referendum, on the grounds it wasn't on the paper. If the 48 had been taken into account, as I alluded to before, Brexit would have been done and dusted months ago, but instead there's still a fair chance it won't happen at all. Brexit/May have made a complete and utter shambles of it by not compromising.

 

[Groningen]

I am from the Netherlands so have no real influence in this case

 

[Howardh]

With three Tory defections right now, May's/DUP/ERG tiny majority has now gone. So whatever she can get from Brussels - even if she gets anything at all - won't get through parliament unless she can grab the votes of the likes of Hoey who appears to be part of Labour's version of the ERG.

All to play for - Brexit's up for grabs! Should be an interesting PMQ's; ah, aren't you so glad you voted for parliament to have it's sovereignty back....

 

[HH]

With three Tory defections right now, May's/DUP/ERG tiny majority has now gone.

Theoretically, but as Sinn Fein don't take their seats etc., not in practice. Even if votes are tied, IIRC the Speaker has to then vote for the Government.

 

[A Challenge]

The convention is at second reading, the speaker votes Aye to let the bill continue but at third reading the speaker votes Noe as otherwise it would become law.

 

[bramling]

With three Tory defections right now, May's/DUP/ERG tiny majority has now gone. So whatever she can get from Brussels - even if she gets anything at all - won't get through parliament unless she can grab the votes of the likes of Hoey who appears to be part of Labour's version of the ERG.

All to play for - Brexit's up for grabs! Should be an interesting PMQ's; ah, aren't you so glad you voted for parliament to have it's sovereignty back....

Soubry was never going to vote for anything to do with Brexit anyway, so I don't think much has changed on that score. Obviously the defections may have an impact on other areas of government policy.

Quite frankly, given the way she has conducted herself over the last couple of years, good riddance IMO. To me she simply comes over as a hysterical attention-seeker.

 

[Howardh]

Soubry was never going to vote for anything to do with Brexit anyway, so I don't think much has changed on that score. Obviously the defections may have an impact on other areas of government policy.

Quite frankly, given the way she has conducted herself over the last couple of years, good riddance IMO. To me she simply comes over as a hysterical attention-seeker.

You mean like Boris?

 

[87 027]

The Guardian is now reporting that we may well yet need visas to travel to mainland Europe

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...52-visa-to-visit-mainland-europe-after-brexit

"British tourists travelling to continental Europe may need to pay £52 for a visa in a few weeks after Spanish demands over the status of Gibraltar again derailed Brussels’ preparations for Brexit.
Agreement on legislation exempting UK nationals from requiring the travel permit is mired in a dispute over whether the British overseas territory should be described as a “colony” in the EU’s statute book.

Spain has insisted, with the reluctant support of the other 26 member states, that a footnote containing the contentious description of the disputed territory is added to the legislation.
But the European parliament on Wednesday morning rejected the language proposed by the council of the European Union, the body that represents the member states.

It is the third time the member states’ proposal has been sent back by MEPs and casts doubt over whether the legislation can be salvaged in the next few weeks."

 

[Howardh]

The Guardian is now reporting that we may well yet need visas to travel to mainland Europe

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...52-visa-to-visit-mainland-europe-after-brexit

"British tourists travelling to continental Europe may need to pay £52 for a visa in a few weeks after Spanish demands over the status of Gibraltar again derailed Brussels’ preparations for Brexit.
Agreement on legislation exempting UK nationals from requiring the travel permit is mired in a dispute over whether the British overseas territory should be described as a “colony” in the EU’s statute book.

Spain has insisted, with the reluctant support of the other 26 member states, that a footnote containing the contentious description of the disputed territory is added to the legislation.
But the European parliament on Wednesday morning rejected the language proposed by the council of the European Union, the body that represents the member states.

It is the third time the member states’ proposal has been sent back by MEPs and casts doubt over whether the legislation can be salvaged in the next few weeks."

It's a misleading report - one needs to look at the detail.
Brits will need to fill in the ETIAS form (e7) to visit up to three months, that's Spain and the whole of the EU + Schengen area less Ireland.
Spain can't opt-out and force tourist visas when the rest of the EU doesn't (as we could simply drive into Spain from France or Portugal!). Other countries don't want the hit on tourists being forced to pay extra and then going elsewhere.
Anyone else who wants to stay longer, work, reside etc will need the full-on Visa.
Think that, unless negotiated differently, was always going to be the case. The EU have specifically ruled out visas for short-term tourists (as long as the UK does) but you are still gonna have the situation where UK's going to Europe will be required to complete at least one form and require a passport with over 6 months validity; whereas any EU can get into the Republic with just an ID card, and they are free to enter the UK unchallenged across that border.
More #brexitlogic...securing our borders makes them no more secure than they are today.

 

[Bornin1980s]

I always thought VISA was a type of credit card!

 

[jellybaby]

The EU have specifically ruled out visas for short-term tourists

Only if they the necessary enabling legislation is passed by the European Parliament. Which it hasn't yet.

 

[Basher]

Must admit I associate Honda more with motorbikes rather than cars!

I'm a motorcycle man too, and the bikes are not as good as they were. Did I hear correctly that Honda formula one cars are struggling too?

 

[HLE]

Soubry was never going to vote for anything to do with Brexit anyway, so I don't think much has changed on that score. Obviously the defections may have an impact on other areas of government policy.

Quite frankly, given the way she has conducted herself over the last couple of years, good riddance IMO. To me she simply comes over as a hysterical attention-seeker.

Well put. Hopefully her's and Cooper's constituents remember how they voted during the referendum, and how their MP went about it in parliament.

I don't have much time for our MP but despite him being a remainer, he's voted in a way which best represents his constituents wishes during the 2016 vote.

 

[HLE]

And where has all that "time" got us? Absolutely nowhere as we're still stuck chained to the ERG, and I don't recall any single vote for their version of Brexit at the referendum, on the grounds it wasn't on the paper. If the 48 had been taken into account, as I alluded to before, Brexit would have been done and dusted months ago, but instead there's still a fair chance it won't happen at all. Brexit/May have made a complete and utter shambles of it by not compromising.

It's got us nowhere because rather than getting on with it, MP's like Soubry, Cooper etc have tabled amendments purposely to delay brexit.

It's not been helped by Corbyn who has just hit back at everything the government has done, and hasn't really said too much on what his party would do. The ERG have a part to play in the delay, however their concerns are about what brexit will mean for the country, and what form it will take, which is completely different and somewhat understandable compared to Cooper and Co. who are acting like children who haven't got their own way. Anything they do isn't to aid brexit, it's to try to stop it.

 

[HH]

Well put. Hopefully her's and Cooper's constituents remember how they voted during the referendum, and how their MP went about it in parliament.

I don't have much time for our MP but despite him being a remainer, he's voted in a way which best represents his constituents wishes during the 2016 vote.

And what about Mark Field, the MP for Westminster (as one example)? Or are MPs voting against the wishes of their constituents OK if it's for Brexit?

 

[Esker-pades]

I hope that Guardian article is wrong. I'm supposed to be taking a Wind Band to Belgium in June and I've told them that there won't be any Visas, even in a no deal scenario. I'll look a right tit if I have to stand up and demand visas.

 

[Puffing Devil]

It's not been helped by Corbyn who has just hit back at everything the government has done, and hasn't really said too much on what his party would do. The ERG have a part to play in the delay, however their concerns are about what brexit will mean for the country, and what form it will take, which is completely different and somewhat understandable compared to Cooper and Co. who are acting like children who haven't got their own way. Anything they do isn't to aid brexit, it's to try to stop it.

Corbyn wants Brexit. He'll do what he can to covertly assist the process, hence the split with his MPs.

 

[Puffing Devil]

I'm a motorcycle man too, and the bikes are not as good as they were. Did I hear correctly that Honda formula one cars are struggling too?

You're saying that they're no good anyway and we're better off without them? Try taking that narrative to the unemployed of Swindon.

 

[Basher]

I never said that. Honda engineering is not as good as it was. A friend of mine has a never honda and it's spent more time back at the deals than he has had it. He is asking for aother car.
All my motorcycle are Suzuki. And Drive a Indian company car . The engineering is good.

 

[Puffing Devil]

I never said that. Honda engineering is not as good as it was. A friend of mine has a never honda and it's spent more time back at the deals than he has had it. He is asking for aother car.
All my motorcycle are Suzuki. And Drive a Indian company car . The engineering is good.

Throwing mud again - this time via your "friend"? And your bikes are Suzuki? How can you comment on Honda?

Same as Momentum - straight into attack and denial once the Independent group announced their decision.

 

[swt class 450]

There is nothing wrong to having to get a visa. I remember many years ago this was required for visiting most countries around the world. But now with so many countries being visa free people have gotten lazy and expect to get in to any country visa free.

Whenever i have visited Russia or Belarus or China or Iran or Turkmenistan (all countries i have visited in the past few years) and many other countries i have had to go to the embassy and get a visa. It's really no problem at all. You just have to go the embassy with your passport and fill out some forms and pay a fee and you will get your visa. Yes it is not as easy as going somewhere visa free but it's not the end of the world. It's not really that difficult. People just expect everything to be easy and free these days.

So even in the rare chance that the EU was to make us get full visas it really wouldn't be a problem. It's not like they are stopping us from visiting. I don't care if i have to go to an embassy and fill in some forms and pay a fee.

 

[HH]

There is nothing wrong to having to get a visa. I remember many years ago this was required for visiting most countries around the world. But now with so many countries being visa free people have gotten lazy and expect to get in to any country visa free.

Whenever i have visited Russia or Belarus or China or Iran or Turkmenistan (all countries i have visited in the past few years) and many other countries i have had to go to the embassy and get a visa. It's really no problem at all. You just have to go the embassy with your passport and fill out some forms and pay a fee and you will get your visa. Yes it is not as easy as going somewhere visa free but it's not the end of the world. It's not really that difficult. People just expect everything to be easy and free these days.

So even in the rare chance that the EU was to make us get full visas it really wouldn't be a problem. It's not like they are stopping us from visiting. I don't care if i have to go to an embassy and fill in some forms and pay a fee.

Remind me where all the Embassies are again...

 

[GusB]

There is nothing wrong to having to get a visa. I remember many years ago this was required for visiting most countries around the world. But now with so many countries being visa free people have gotten lazy and expect to get in to any country visa free.

Whenever i have visited Russia or Belarus or China or Iran or Turkmenistan (all countries i have visited in the past few years) and many other countries i have had to go to the embassy and get a visa. It's really no problem at all. You just have to go the embassy with your passport and fill out some forms and pay a fee and you will get your visa. Yes it is not as easy as going somewhere visa free but it's not the end of the world. It's not really that difficult. People just expect everything to be easy and free these days.

So even in the rare chance that the EU was to make us get full visas it really wouldn't be a problem. It's not like they are stopping us from visiting. I don't care if i have to go to an embassy and fill in some forms and pay a fee.

Ah, you just miss having your passport stamped.