EU Referendum: The result and aftermath...

[Bletchleyite]

No different to travelling, or even living, outside of the EU even without Brexit. As I have travelled several times, usually to meet my non-EU-resident sister.

Correct. But if Brexit reduced the countries you could go to from "all of Europe" to "England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland" you'd be a bit miffed, wouldn't you? I would.

 

[radamfi]

No different to travelling, or even living, outside of the EU even without Brexit. As I have travelled several times, usually to meet my non-EU-resident sister.

That's nice. Someone who is currently unable to travel outside the EU because they can't get insurance can at least travel within the EU because of the EHIC. You would prefer them to be unable to travel within the EU as well.

 

[Howardh]

That's nice. Someone who is currently unable to travel outside the EU because they can't get insurance can at least travel within the EU because of the EHIC. You would prefer them to be unable to travel within the EU as well.

It's actually very ironic, the first place I can't go to is...Jersey (as in channel isles) as the NHS won't cover you, but neither would the IHIC. But my main hols in June in Spain are binned.
Gibraltar in August is fine though!!

 

[Jonny]

The EHIC system is very hit-and-miss anyway. I wouldn't rely on it at the best of times. In fact, I would not trust it as far as I could throw it.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The EHIC system is very hit-and-miss anyway. I wouldn't rely on it at the best of times. In fact, I would not trust it as far as I could throw it.

Why? You just have to understand its scope, which is to give you precisely what the locals get on the same terms. Sometimes it's better (e.g. free dental in several European countries), sometimes it's worse (e.g. co-pays in some countries).

I have used it (and the previous E111/E128) and did not experience any problems.

 

[Howardh]

Why? You just have to understand its scope, which is to give you precisely what the locals get on the same terms. Sometimes it's better (e.g. free dental in several European countries), sometimes it's worse (e.g. co-pays in some countries).

I have used it (and the previous E111/E128) and did not experience any problems.

Yes. All you have to do is do your homework on where you're going, hardly an ask these days. I'd trust it more than insurance as they will wriggle out of everything..

 

[Jonny]

Besides, the whole EU system stinks... why should someone running a business have to potentially honour obligations to multiple governments?

If not having to collect VAT for OTHER COUNTRIES is the price of other people's ability to travel, then it is NOT a price that I accept willingly.

Another thing that is wrong is that little old lady from Germany who thinks it is OK to tell people off for crossing a road on a red man, because they are setting a bad example to children. I would be like "so what", probably followed by a few choice insults, if anyone challenged me for that.

In fact that is another point about the terms of leaving the EU, pandering to the motor car industry is a bad thing. After all, America has similar laws against so-called jaywalking because of the motor car industry lobby, as it makes car purchase less desirable.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Besides, the whole EU system stinks... why should someone running a business have to potentially honour obligations to multiple governments?

If not having to collect VAT for OTHER COUNTRIES is the price of other people's ability to travel, then it is NOT a price that I accept willingly.

Another thing that is wrong is that little old lady from Germany who thinks it is OK to tell people off for crossing a road on a red man, because they are setting a bad example to children. I would be like "so what", probably followed by a few choice insults, if anyone challenged me for that.

In fact that is another point about the terms of leaving the EU, pandering to the motor car industry is a bad thing. After all, America has similar laws against so-called jaywalking because of the motor car industry lobby, as it makes car purchase less desirable.

Wow. Just wow.

In particular paragraph 3. When in Rome, do what the Romans do. If you don't appreciate the nuances of other cultures and how to respect them, perhaps best stay in Blighty?

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Besides, the whole EU system stinks... why should someone running a business have to potentially honour obligations to multiple governments?

Because if you export to any country then that implies obligations to that country? I sell stuff to the USA and I therefore have to register with the US tax authorities, even though I'm based entirely in the UK. In fact co-incidentally I've just today received my annual Foreign Person's Source Income form from the US Internal Revenue Service. So if you think that kind of bureaucracy is unique to the EU... you could have a nasty shock awaiting you if we do Brexit.

If not having to collect VAT for OTHER COUNTRIES is the price of other people's ability to travel, then it is NOT a price that I accept willingly.

Are you sure that leaving the EU will change that?

For importing into the UK, a quick check reveals that UK VAT applies to imports from outside the EU. I may be mistaken because I'm not an accountant and this is based on quick scan of the UK Government rules, but it looks like its worse if you're outside the EU because there's no threshold below which you don't pay. If you're in the EU, you don't have to register or pay if you're below the VAT threshold. It seems a reasonable guess that you'll find similar things apply in other EU countries.

I'd suggest what you're complaining about isn't so much a problem with the EU, but a very typical bureaucratic hurdle you face if you export stuff to another country (annoying though I realise it is) - and one which, if anything, is somewhat eased by EU membership.

Another thing that is wrong is that little old lady from Germany who thinks it is OK to tell people off for crossing a road on a red man, because they are setting a bad example to children. I would be like "so what", probably followed by a few choice insults, if anyone challenged me for that.

In fact that is another point about the terms of leaving the EU, pandering to the motor car industry is a bad thing. After all, America has similar laws against so-called jaywalking because of the motor car industry lobby, as it makes car purchase less desirable.

Well yes, pandering to the motor industry is a bad thing. I'd agree with you there. But surely you're not blaming the EU for what the culture has been for a long time in Germany? I don't think our leaving the EU is going to stop old ladies in Germany from thinking it's wrong to cross on a red man.

 

[GusB]

I wonder how @Jonny would react to a little old English lady telling him off for crossing the road against a red man. While it may not be illegal here, it's still setting a bad example to children.

 

[Spamcan81]

Besides, the whole EU system stinks... why should someone running a business have to potentially honour obligations to multiple governments?

If not having to collect VAT for OTHER COUNTRIES is the price of other people's ability to travel, then it is NOT a price that I accept willingly.

Another thing that is wrong is that little old lady from Germany who thinks it is OK to tell people off for crossing a road on a red man, because they are setting a bad example to children. I would be like "so what", probably followed by a few choice insults, if anyone challenged me for that.

In fact that is another point about the terms of leaving the EU, pandering to the motor car industry is a bad thing. After all, America has similar laws against so-called jaywalking because of the motor car industry lobby, as it makes car purchase less desirable.

Good luck with that if the Polizei see you doing it. Apart from annoying old ladies, it's illegal and you can be fined for the German equivalent for jaywalking.

 

[Jonny]

I wonder how @Jonny would react to a little old English lady telling him off for crossing the road against a red man. While it may not be illegal here, it's still setting a bad example to children.

I would walk away from her... I'm not a parent and hopefully I never will be (something that has disappointed many women who have met me).

Good luck with that if the Polizei see you doing it. Apart from annoying old ladies, it's illegal and you can be fined for the German equivalent for jaywalking.

back...

You've hit the nail on the head as to why I don't travel in the EU in the first place, probably among a load of other silly laws waiting to ambush the unwary. If I don't sef foot in a country, then laws that can only possibly apply to those physically present there cannot apply to me.

Because if you export to any country then that implies obligations to that country? I sell stuff to the USA and I therefore have to register with the US tax authorities, even though I'm based entirely in the UK. In fact co-incidentally I've just today received my annual Foreign Person's Source Income form from the US Internal Revenue Service. So if you think that kind of bureaucracy is unique to the EU... you could have a nasty shock awaiting you if we do Brexit.

Are you sure that leaving the EU will change that?

For importing into the UK, a quick check reveals that UK VAT applies to imports from outside the EU. I may be mistaken because I'm not an accountant and this is based on quick scan of the UK Government rules, but it looks like its worse if you're outside the EU because there's no threshold below which you don't pay. If you're in the EU, you don't have to register or pay if you're below the VAT threshold. It seems a reasonable guess that you'll find similar things apply in other EU countries.

I'd suggest what you're complaining about isn't so much a problem with the EU, but a very typical bureaucratic hurdle you face if you export stuff to another country (annoying though I realise it is) - and one which, if anything, is somewhat eased by EU membership.

I was thinking of so-called 'digital goods' which are a whole different ballgame. Outside the EU, they will have little to no enforceable comeback, something that I would like to see the British government promote as a means of gaining revenue into the British economy. It also reduces the rules to those involving sender and receiver countries, which is much more helpful for implementing new technologies; consulting 27 other countries then becomes optional. As for bureaucracy, the best way to ease that, in an era of online forms, is copy-and-paste and autocomplete where appropriate.

Also, being personally VAT-registered, even exclusively because of another EU country (thresholds vary, even for remote services), would have certain other little-known, annoying consequences (not directly associated with accounting) that are not worth mentioning. It would likely be justification for having an intermediate company (declared to HMRC of course) to keep the affairs separate.

Well yes, pandering to the motor industry is a bad thing. I'd agree with you there. But surely you're not blaming the EU for what the culture has been for a long time in Germany? I don't think our leaving the EU is going to stop old ladies in Germany from thinking it's wrong to cross on a red man.

[/QUOTE]

She will at least be welcome to keep her opinion as to what happens in another country to herself. As you do...

 

[VauxhallandI]

The EHIC system is very hit-and-miss anyway. I wouldn't rely on it at the best of times. In fact, I would not trust it as far as I could throw it.

Well yes apart from assisting me when I was close to losing my life in Spain at no cost to me yes you must surely be right.

Why would anyone listen to your experience when it sounds like you find it difficult to leave your own village.

 

[radamfi]

In fact that is another point about the terms of leaving the EU, pandering to the motor car industry is a bad thing. After all, America has similar laws against so-called jaywalking because of the motor car industry lobby, as it makes car purchase less desirable.

If any European country panders to the motor industry, it is Britain. Major German cities have comprehensive S and/or U-Bahn systems or trams and have integrated ticketing. Buses in Germany are well integrated yet Britain is unique in having bus deregulation. Germany also has much better cycle provision than the UK although that varies a lot by area of Germany.

 

[SHD]

Come to France, nobody cares about jaywalking here except a few excitable motorists!

 

[Groningen]

The same in the Netherlands. At your own risk of course! Theresa May seems to sent a letter for delaying the Brexit for 3 months to 2 years to the EU today.

 

[Bantamzen]

You've hit the nail on the head as to why I don't travel in the EU in the first place, probably among a load of other silly laws waiting to ambush the unwary. If I don't sef foot in a country, then laws that can only possibly apply to those physically present there cannot apply to me.

I'd stay well away from the US too then, especially somewhere like New York!

So you basically don't like to travel in the EU because you might have to behave slightly differently & obey the local laws? I mean I've heard many the Brit complaining about the food abroad, or not being able to flush loo paper away in some countries, but being wary of laws you think are designed to "ambush" you?? I take @Bletchleyite's "Wow. Just wow" & double it....

In the meantime, and if its all the same to you, some of us rather enjoy travelling, trying out different cultures & climates, and don't mind taking a few moments to respect local laws & customs. After all, isn't that what Brexiteers expect of Johnny Foreigner when they come to the UK? The more I hear these kinds of arguments, the more I'm convinced that just perhaps Brexit is a really daft idea & risks not only sending us back to the 19th Century, but turning even more insular & parochial than ever. Before long it won't be the Europeans Brexiteers will be wary of, but those "foreigners" from Scotland, Wales, Ireland, Yorkshire, the next town over, the next street, next door.... . Perhaps a new flag is in order, made primarily of net curtains...

 

[Ianno87]

Another thing that is wrong is that little old lady from Germany who thinks it is OK to tell people off for crossing a road on a red man, because they are setting a bad example to children. I would be like "so what", probably followed by a few choice insults, if anyone challenged me for that.

I would walk away from her... I'm not a parent and hopefully I never will be (something that has disappointed many women who have met me).

You've hit the nail on the head as to why I don't travel in the EU in the first place, probably among a load of other silly laws waiting to ambush the unwary. If I don't sef foot in a country, then laws that can only possibly apply to those physically present there cannot apply to me.

549 pages in, and the most hilarious posts yet!

 

[dosxuk]

You've hit the nail on the head as to why I don't travel in the EU in the first place, probably among a load of other silly laws waiting to ambush the unwary. If I don't sef foot in a country, then laws that can only possibly apply to those physically present there cannot apply to me.

So basically, because the rest of the world isn't like England we should have no involvement in it?

 

[Bletchleyite]

So basically, because the rest of the world isn't like England we should have no involvement in it?

That's a very typical Brexiteer view. It belongs in the 1930s if even there.

 

[Groningen]

What has jaywalking to do with the referendum/Brexit/EU?

 

[fowler9]

What has jaywalking to do with the referendum/Brexit/EU?

Well apparently a little old lady in Germany wants to stop everyone crossing the road when the man is red.

Jonny I thank you. Your last few posts have been hilarious and a real eye opener.

 

[radamfi]

I'd trust it more than insurance as they will wriggle out of everything..

There are many stories of British holidaymakers to the US (particularly Florida) being made bankrupt by travel insurance failing to pay out on technicalities.

 

[bnm]

Why would anyone listen to your experience when it sounds like you find it difficult to leave your own village.

Well. We know what every village needs...

 

[jellybaby]

There are many stories of British holidaymakers to the US (particularly Florida) being made bankrupt by travel insurance failing to pay out on technicalities.

I can't find any. Can you provide a link or two?

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Well. We know what every village needs...

Maybe we could debate on the issues rather than resorting to these kinds of personal attacks, no matter how much you might dislike the other person's opinions?

 

[Bantamzen]

The PM has confirmed at PMQs that she has formally requested a postponement until 30/06/19, which is now her new "absolute" deadline for a deal to be brokered in Parliament. We probably won't know much before Friday if this is likely to be accepted by the EU.

I'm calling it now, a GE will be called within the next few weeks. Watch this space!

 

[Howardh]

The PM has confirmed at PMQs that she has formally requested a postponement until 30/06/19, which is now her new "absolute" deadline for a deal to be brokered in Parliament. We probably won't know much before Friday if this is likely to be accepted by the EU.

I'm calling it now, a GE will be called within the next few weeks. Watch this space!

I think the EU have responded by allowing to May 23rd.

 

[radamfi]

I can't find any. Can you provide a link or two?

On the forums at Money Saving Expert, there is a British ex-pat who's job is to work with American hospitals to claim back money from tourists who had insurance which didn't pay out, and I remember reading a longish thread about it, but I'm having difficultly finding it now.

 

[Groningen]

All 27 EU countries need to agree first. She wants extention till May 30th, 2019.