European Vehicle Numbering and National Vehicle Registry UK compliance with EU rules?

Discussion in 'Traction & Rolling Stock' started by GM228, 26 Aug 2015.

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  1. GM228

    GM228 Member

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    I was under the impression that it was obligatory for all EU railways to display EVN numbers as part of the NVR and was curious as to why no UK stock (bar some ECR 66s?) seem to carry them?
     
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  3. crehld

    crehld Established Member Associate Staff Senior Fares Advisor

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    I have no idea what an EVN or NVR is!

    However if there if the EU has passed some sort of policy to display EVN numbers (whatever they are), the obligation of people/companies to adhere to such policy depends on whether said EU policy / requirement was a 'regulation', 'directive' or 'opinion': a subtle but very important difference! Only regulations are directly enforceable.

    If you knew what regulation/direction/opinion this requirement appears in, then I would be able to elaborate further.
     
  4. ainsworth74

    ainsworth74 Forum Staff Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Please could we define some terms. We do allow the use of industry 'slang' in our forum rules but these terms would appear to be very technical and in need of definition!
     
  5. crehld

    crehld Established Member Associate Staff Senior Fares Advisor

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    My apologies.

    Regulation = legislative act by the EU which is directly enforceable. If the requirement to display EVN numbers forms part of a regulation then it must be complied with.

    Directive = decision by the EU which requires transposition into national law. This allows member states to tailor it to their own specific circumstances. If the requirement for EVN numbers to be displayed is a directive then it first needs to be incorporated in the UK law. It might (or might not) be the case that the UK's interpretation of the EU requirement actually does not stipulate that EVN numbers are required.

    Opinion = a non-binding requirement. If the EU requirement to display EVN number is an opinion then there is no actual requirement to display them.

    More information can be found here: http://europa.eu/eu-law/decision-making/legal-acts/index_en.htm
     
  6. ainsworth74

    ainsworth74 Forum Staff Staff Member Global Moderator

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    I didn't actually mean you and was talking more about what an EVN or NVR is! Interesting post though in any case ;)
     
  7. Hyphen

    Hyphen Member

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    It appears that the UK implementation of this directive (which appears to be in GM/RT2453 - PDF) permits any stock which is not intended for use in international service to only display the TOPS number.

    Relevant clauses are A.1.2 for locos and A.2.4 for multiple-unit vehicles. Section A.3 (for fixed-formation/MU set identifiers) makes no reference to EVNs at all!

    EVN = "European Vehicle Number".
    NVR = "National Vehicle Register".
     
  8. GM228

    GM228 Member

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    My apologies, they arn't slang or short hand etc, but the official titles AFAIK!

    EVN - European Vehicle Numbering
    NVR - National Vehicle Registry
     
  9. ainsworth74

    ainsworth74 Forum Staff Staff Member Global Moderator

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    No worries and perhaps 'slang' was the wrong word for me to use anyway :)
     
  10. swt_passenger

    swt_passenger Veteran Member

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    We had a thread about this earlier in the month. I posted this extract from the group standard:

    See this thread also: http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=119259
     
    Last edited: 26 Aug 2015
  11. GM228

    GM228 Member

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    Thanks for the replies, so having read through that it would seem that all stock must be assigned EVNs and be on the NVR but only cross-border stock has to display the numbers.

    My question is if that is the case then why don't 92s, Eurostars, LeShuttles etc display the EVNs?
     
  12. 59CosG95

    59CosG95 Established Member

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    92s don't venture further than France, and there, they refer to it as Class BB92000, as it used to operate a few. Le Shuttle locos can likewise only be found in and around the Channel Tunnel, while the new Class 374 Velaros have EVNs.
     
  13. 87015

    87015 Established Member

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    Eurostar do, don't they, above the solebar? I might be imagining it... Nothing else is international in the railway sense as they don't get beyond the border point (Calais) much like Bulgarian passenger locos don't display the full UIC job despite geographically working into Romania, Serbia and Turkey - its only international beyond the 'exchange point' as far as the various railway outfits are concerned.
     
  14. route:oxford

    route:oxford Established Member

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    What about the cross-border trains between Eire and the UK?
     
  15. GM228

    GM228 Member

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    All trains for Irish Rail are slowly receiving EVNs aswell as the Cross-Border Enterprise stock. Even Irish Rail stock which dosn't and can't operate cross-border is getting them. According to the Railway Safety Commission's (Irelands equivalent of the RSSB) EVN documents they state that EVNs are obligatory in all EU member states as determined by the EU bodies which is the case.

     
    Last edited: 26 Aug 2015
  16. SpacePhoenix

    SpacePhoenix Established Member

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    Is it basically a European version of TOPS?

    Apart from class 373s, 374s, "le shuttle locos" (can't remember what their class number is) and 92s I can't think of any other class that currently venture through the channel tunnel or will do
     
  17. AM9

    AM9 Established Member

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    How about 319008 and 319009?
     
  18. ainsworth74

    ainsworth74 Forum Staff Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Didn't they more venture into and then out the same way rather than go all the way through?
     
  19. GM228

    GM228 Member

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    Class 21/9s?
     
  20. 30907

    30907 Established Member

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    There was a detailed article in Today's Railways Europe a couple of years back if anyone really wants to know.
     
  21. GM228

    GM228 Member

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    A purely hypothetical question, but I was wondering had the Scottish Referendum passed would EVNs have been required then on trains operating over the borders?
     
  22. crehld

    crehld Established Member Associate Staff Senior Fares Advisor

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    In all likelihood the directive probably didn't exist then.
    --- old post above --- --- new post below ---
    That would depend on how the Scottish and (not so) United Kingdom governments chose to translate the directive into their respective national legislative frameworks.
     
  23. GM228

    GM228 Member

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    The current directive wasn't but the older UIC (Union internationale des chemins de fer or International Union of Railways) numbers were (EVNs replaced the UICs), I believe the Nightstar stock had UICs initially?
     
    Last edited: 10 Sep 2015
  24. jopsuk

    jopsuk Veteran Member

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    Do Irish/Northern Irish vehicles on corss border services carry full EVN? Or is there a "don't bother" agreement in place?
     
  25. GM228

    GM228 Member

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    See message #14
     
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