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Every Tube ticket office to close

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Mojo

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l think a forum member attended a meet earlier this year with a 'disposable' Smartcard from abroad. Possibly somewhere in the Netherlands?

Adding One Day Travelcards to Oyster was actually something that came out of the staff engagement on the changes to station functions, so we may see something coming out of it.
 
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jon0844

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l think a forum member attended a meet earlier this year with a 'disposable' Smartcard from abroad. Possibly somewhere in the Netherlands?

Yeah, I think they've got them there. You can buy sheets of NFC tags on Amazon and eBay for peanuts these days, so it can't be long until they can be embedded in a cheaper ticket.

I appreciate these NFC tags don't hold as much data, but if you were TfL then economy of scale would bring the prices way down anyway. Wasn't the original contract with the company behind Oyster one reason cards were so expensive in the first place?

It can't be long either, going off topic, before NFC tags will be included within products in shops - supplementing or even replacing the barcode for product identification, additional information, price checking and so on.
 

313103

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Now that everyone on here (or so it would appear) wants booking offices shut and replaced with a costa bar and to buy from newsagents I wonder if any booking offices have ever done what this newsagent done http://metro.co.uk/2013/06/25/newsagent-sold-commuters-fake-oyster-card-top-ups-worth-10000-3856106/
and this one http://squaremilenews.blogspot.co.uk/2013/11/mean-and-greedy-newsagents-oyster-card.html

I am so glad TFL have not mentioned theses incidents. rolls eyes!

It is blindingly obvious that (and it also seems) many on here have bought it. That the announcement that all booking offices will close (bad news) has had good news (tube to run 24 hrs), along with 750 staff to be made redundant (bad news) with (good news) tube to become fully accessible with wifi. Typical right wing press thing to do rubbish the bad news and sugar coat the good news and most people will buy the good news more then the bad news.

Also this has nothing to with new technology, the railways since their very humble beginnings has always moved along when new technology has come in, if not Stephenson's rocket would be doing the 10:00 Flying Scotsman service on a Monday to Friday.

The real truth of the matter is that TfL have to make savings of 12.5 % in its budget that has been cut by Mr Osbourne and the vast majority of savings will be made by shedding staff. My company were the first in the firing line getting rid of 128 conductors off the pay role to save tfl money, now 750 jobs to go in London Underground and London Overground always follow their sister company, and probably in the next year or so I would not be surprised to hear that my fellow colleagues on LO will go the same way as their LU colleagues.

It truly is a bad news day, but its what the public want, and what the public want is what the public gets!

The Sex Pistols were quite prophetic with their song 'God save the Queen' Just these two words from that song sum it right up 'NO FUTURE'.

Note my avatar it says 'UNEMPLOYED' That is what the future will be bringing to many transport workers in London. Not a nice post to record my 1000st post on this group.
 
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radamfi

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l think a forum member attended a meet earlier this year with a 'disposable' Smartcard from abroad. Possibly somewhere in the Netherlands?

Yes, 1/24/48/72/96/120/144/168 hour tickets in Amsterdam come on disposable smartcards. Similiarly for 1 hour, 2 hour and day tickets in Rotterdam and 1 hour and day tickets in The Hague.

Dutch Railways will soon be replacing paper train tickets with disposable smartcards.
 

jon0844

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Comparing the loss of guards to shutting ticket offices isn't right. There's an argument to keep guards, with known safety considerations.

With regards to ticket offices, people aren't using them. The demand isn't there and never likely to return.

Putting the staff on the concourse and giving them the ability to use any ticket machine to do the things they did behind some glass is a good thing. No sugar coating needed here.

Problems with some newsagents on the fiddle isn't going to change that. You just fix that problem.

Meanwhile, I suspect rather a lot of people would probably love to have a Costa, or similar, at stations - but at the same time, I rather doubt that this will happen.
 

Daz28

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With regards to ticket offices, people aren't using them. The demand isn't there and never likely to return.

Quite right. I have been travelling in and around London for 30 years. I have never used a tube ticket office.

In the eighties I would typically purchase a travelcard from National Rail or use the ticket machines at the tube station. Ticket machines were always quicker than queuing up for the ticket office.

I purchased my Oyster card from my local newsagent, topped up locally or at a machine. I registered online when that facility became available and now use auto topup.

My interactions with Underground staff have always been at the ticket barrier or on the platform. Typically asking for advice in times of disruption or the rare occasions when a ticket won't work the barriers.

I won't be sorry to see the ticket offices go but more staff on the concourse would be appreciated.
 

radamfi

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Dutch Railways will soon be replacing paper train tickets with disposable smartcards.

That will coincide with the closure of all ticket offices, replaced by customer assistants.
 
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Tom C

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If LUL booking offices are closing then it presents an opportunity to NR stations within the travelcard zone to lease the redundant FASTIS equipment.

FCC had said the only reason they do not have FASTIS in London ticket offices is because of the high leasing costs. Surely CUBIC will not be so stupid as to keep the price high after LUL have gone so will want to keep some revenue coming in.

Could mean some London booking offices survive which in the majority of cases keeps the station manned at least for some time of the day.
 

DavyCrocket

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That will coincide with the closure of all ticket offices, replaced by customer assistants.

Replaced with fewer staff overall.

Ticket office staff (from station assistant to station supervisor) aren't locked in ticket offices and don't not do anything else. They can and do respond to emergencies, go to platforms and on the track.
 

radamfi

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Replaced with fewer staff overall.

Ticket office staff (from station assistant to station supervisor) aren't locked in ticket offices and don't not do anything else. They can and do respond to emergencies, go to platforms and on the track.

Are you talking about the Underground or Dutch Railways?
 

bicbasher

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With regards to ticket offices, people aren't using them. The demand isn't there and never likely to return.

According to a poster on District Dave who has looked at TfL's own data for ticket office use, 3% of passengers start their journey by using the ticket office at LUL managed stations.

TfL haven't posted the actual figures for ticket office use, however it appears 36m people use the services per annum.
 

Be3G

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Adding One Day Travelcards to Oyster was actually something that came out of the staff engagement on the changes to station functions, so we may see something coming out of it.

If so: hallelujah!
 

cjp

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l think a forum member attended a meet earlier this year with a 'disposable' Smartcard from abroad. Possibly somewhere in the Netherlands?
Quite likely
Three or so day passes are available for tourists and the like in Amsterdam which operate like oysters by waving them within a six inches or so of a reader on a tram metro or bus otherwise there is the OV chipkaart which is also usable thoughout the Neterlands on trains when it should have at least 20 Euros on it as a min fare

Reading on I see this had already been commented on:oops:
 
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ModernRailways

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Yeah, I think they've got them there. You can buy sheets of NFC tags on Amazon and eBay for peanuts these days, so it can't be long until they can be embedded in a cheaper ticket.

I appreciate these NFC tags don't hold as much data, but if you were TfL then economy of scale would bring the prices way down anyway. Wasn't the original contract with the company behind Oyster one reason cards were so expensive in the first place?

It can't be long either, going off topic, before NFC tags will be included within products in shops - supplementing or even replacing the barcode for product identification, additional information, price checking and so on.

The SPT Subway in Glasgow has their paper tickets embedded with ITSO. It looks just like a paper ticket you would get out of a NR TVM (different colours) but has no magnetic strip because inside it has the ITSO stuff to make it smart. It's weird 'touching' in/out with a paper ticket instead of feeding it through a slot! I can put a photo up of the ticket if you like.
 

Peter Mugridge

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Adding One Day Travelcards to Oyster was actually something that came out of the staff engagement on the changes to station functions, so we may see something coming out of it.

Would a one day Travelcard on Oyster still be subject to the silly journey time limits thus rendering it useless for enthusiast purposes?
 

Mojo

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Would a one day Travelcard on Oyster still be subject to the silly journey time limits thus rendering it useless for enthusiast purposes?
Period Travelcards aren't so I couldn't imagine why a One Day version would be. That is assuming of course this was implemented.
 

telstarbox

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This detailed article on London Reconnections states that TfL will divide all tube stations into four categories to determine their staffing provision from 2015:
  • Gateway (Euston, Heathrow Terminals 123, King’s Cross St. Pancras, Liverpool Street, Paddington and Victoria)
  • Destination (eg Embankment)
  • Metro (eg Chancery Lane)
  • Local (inc quieter outer London stations)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
TfL have also produced a map with the provisional category for each station shown:

https://fitforthefuture.tfl.gov.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Stations-factsheet1.pdf
 

Mojo

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There are two categories within Local - Local A and Local B.

The former category includes stations with some level of complexity, such as lifts, escalators, or one which has points or section switches nearby. These will have a member of staff on-site with a Supervisor license, but rather than the current actual Supervisor who staffs all LU managed stations (except ex-Silverlink) 24/7 this will effectively be an upskilled CSA in the role of 'Customer Service Supervisor.'

In the diagrams also; there is also the issue that currently, a not insignificant number of stations only have a Supervisor on duty for all/most of the day and not a CSA.
 

jon0844

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So as time goes on, more stations will get complex as they get lifts installed at the very least for accessibility.
 

Mojo

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So as time goes on, more stations will get complex as they get lifts installed at the very least for accessibility.
Yes, except with a caveat that someone making that statement assumes that the current designs of lifts installed on LU stations continue.

One of the advantage of LU's lifts is that many faults which result in the lift becoming stalled in the shaft can be dealt with by the appropriately licensed station supervisor to free the customers (and then lock it out awaiting the engineer). However, if they moved to a Network Rail/Shopping Centre model (for example at Harrow/Wealdstone the LU Supervisor stationed there 24/7 cannot do anything with the lifts other than telephone for help as they are a Network Rail asset) then adequately trained staff would not necessarily need to be on site.
 

cjp

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This detailed article on London Reconnections states that TfL will divide all tube stations into four categories to determine their staffing provision from 2015:
  • Gateway (Euston, Heathrow Terminals 123, King’s Cross St. Pancras, Liverpool Street, Paddington and Victoria)
  • Destination (eg Embankment)
  • Metro (eg Chancery Lane)
  • Local (inc quieter outer London stations)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
TfL have also produced a map with the provisional category for each station shown:

https://fitforthefuture.tfl.gov.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Stations-factsheet1.pdf

Called into Paddington yesterday and dicovered that the circle line station ticket office has already been closed permanently. THe Bakerloo line ticket office had one person who was a wondering if he had a job or if that ticket office would also close etc.
And as for not being used very often there was a queue in front of me when I got there and when I left about another eight people waiting.
 

swt_passenger

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Called into Paddington yesterday and dicovered that the circle line station ticket office has already been closed permanently.

Is that the H&C/Circle - or the District/Circle?

If it's the former it closed a couple of years back, when the common FGW/LU gateline was installed at the southwest end of the footbridge. Then the new H&C/Circle station was opened without a manned ticket office wasn't it?
 

cjp

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Is that the H&C/Circle - or the District/Circle?

If it's the former it closed a couple of years back, when the common FGW/LU gateline was installed at the southwest end of the footbridge. Then the new H&C/Circle station was opened without a manned ticket office wasn't it?

It was the District / Circle ticket office that has been permanently closed.
 

Mojo

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It was the District / Circle ticket office that has been permanently closed.
This was planned before the recent announcement as the ticket office there is being converted into a new station control room.
 

Aictos

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Umm one question, can these TVMs renew season tickets? Be a tad stupid if the TVMs couldn't :roll:
 

Darren R

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I've just happened upon the following article in the London Evening Standard. It's from a week ago, and those in the London area may already have seen it, but it amused me! (The article amused me, that is, not the closure of the ticket offices!)

Tube workers mock Boris Johnson ticket office U-turn using Quote of the Day board

Boris Johnson has come under fire over London Underground ticket office closures from an unlikely source – a station’s information board.

Workers at Clapham South station have hit out at the Mayor by using his pledge to protect TfL ticket offices as their ‘Quote of the Day’.

Appearing on the service information board at the Northern Line station this morning, the message read: “This Mayor takes his promises to Londoners extremely seriously. Every station that has a ticket office will continue to have one.”

The quotation was taken from a statement made by the Mayor in City Hall in March 2010.

Last week the general secretary of the Transport and Salaried Staffs Association (TSSA), Manuel Cortes, highlighted the Mayor’s U-turn. He said: “It was the Mayor who came into office in 2008 with a firm pledge to keep open every ticket office on the grounds of keeping passengers safe and secure at all times.”

In November 2013 Mr Johnson announced the eventual closure of all London Underground ticket offices, along with up to 750 job cuts, in an attempt to cut spending by £40 million a year.

Next month members of the Rail Maritime and Transport union (RMT) will stage two 48-hour strikes in opposition to the cuts, with more industrial action expected to follow.

Phil Hufton, London Underground's chief operating officer, said: “All Tube stations will remain staffed at all times when services are operating, and we'll be introducing a 24-hour service at weekends during 2015. In future, there will be more staff in ticket halls and on platforms to help customers buy the right ticket and keep them safe and secure.

“We're committed to working with unions and staff to implement changes to station staffing without compulsory redundancies and we've been clear that there'll be a job for everyone at LU who wants to work for us and be flexible. I urge our trade union colleagues to work with us to shape the future of the Tube.”

Members of the TSSA will vote in the coming weeks on whether to launch their own campaign of industrial action against the strikes.

Link: http://www.standard.co.uk/news/transport/tube-workers-mock-boris-johnson-ticket-office-uturn-using-quote-of-the-day-board-9056701.html
 

telstarbox

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Is this what they're going to put in the redundant ticket offices?

Major retailers to bring 'click and collect' revolution to the London Underground network

Picking up shopping on the move is set to become simple for thousands of London Underground customers as Transport for London (TfL) today announced that it is entering into partnership working with several major companies.

Tesco, Waitrose and automated parcel Locker Company InPost are all set to establish 'click and collect' facilities at stations, transforming the services on offer to customers as they move around the transport network.
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/media/newscentre/29523.aspx
 

transmanche

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Is this what they're going to put in the redundant ticket offices?
Well why not, could be a useful source of income for LU.

I notice that they've already started a limited trial with Asda, where you can order your groceries online by lunchtime and collect them from a van in the station car park on your way home.
 

jon0844

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It's a great idea that seems to work elsewhere.

I've seen Amazon lockers at my nearby outlet shopping centre, and they'd make perfect sense at a train station.
 
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