Ex-Northern 321/9 and 322 for Greater Anglia

[Bringback309s]

5L50 Belmont to Clacton, 2 units (484 & 903), on the way.

Realtime Trains - 594A 1055 Belmont Down Yard to Clacton C.S.D.

Realtime Trains provides live realtime running information for the Great British railway network using open data.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

484?? Ah sorry, 322484!

 

[fgwrich]

PIS incompatibility, perhaps? It may be there is an issue with them and Renatus sets with different PIS or call-for-aid or whatever.

I'm not so sure about that, as I believe they all have the same Train FX system installed around the same time. Could be to do with the lack of First Class, although I would be surprised if that bothered GA that much.

 

[Roast Veg]

Perhaps the wording of the lease doesn't permit it, or their mileages have to be recorded differently for maintenance purposes?

 

[Neptune]

I'm not so sure about that, as I believe they all have the same Train FX system installed around the same time. Could be to do with the lack of First Class, although I would be surprised if that bothered GA that much.

The ex Northern units do not have TrainFX. It is an older (and much more reliable) system fitted at refurbishment 15 or so years ago.

I don’t know what the GA units have.

 

[fgwrich]

The ex Northern units do not have TrainFX. It is an older (and much more reliable) system fitted at refurbishment 15 or so years ago.

I don’t know what the GA units have.

Ah, ok. Apologies, I thought they all (certainly the 322s) had the same system. Presumably that may be the reason then.

 

[F Great Eastern]

The ex Northern units do not have TrainFX. It is an older (and much more reliable) system fitted at refurbishment 15 or so years ago.

I don’t know what the GA units have.

Whatever it is the system is dreadfully cheap and nasty and apparently the manufacturer is no longer around and the Renatus units has seen basically the same displays installed but tidied up, although other people say they are simply clones of the same ones that were originally installed.

The fail/not working rate of the GA 321s is very high, I would estimate that at least 40% of the time I'm on a 321 the displays are either not working or spewing out gibberish or just not updating as the train goes through stops. It just screams cheap and nasty.

Compare them to the displays on the 360s however, that I have only seen broken about 3-4 times and I must have been on them not far off 1,000 times and even then a couple of times it was just the carriage I was on.

On the 321s the front and rear displays screen cheap as well and look like they are stuck on with masking tape thanks to their white surround.

 

[Neptune]

Whatever it is the system is dreadfully cheap and nasty and apparently the manufacturer is no longer around and the Renatus units has seen basically the same displays installed but tidied up, although other people say they are simply clones of the same ones that were originally installed.

The fail/not working rate of the GA 321s is very high, I would estimate that at least 40% of the time I'm on a 321 the displays are either not working or spewing out gibberish or just not updating as the train goes through stops. It just screams cheap and nasty.

Compare them to the displays on the 360s however, that I have only seen broken about 3-4 times and I must have been on them not far off 1,000 times and even then a couple of times it was just the carriage I was on.

On the 321s the front and rear displays screen cheap as well and look like they are stuck on with masking tape thanks to their white surround.

In the 15 or so years since they were fitted to the Northern 32x units and I’ve never had one fail with the exception of some of the external screens (nothing that a laminated sheet of A4 couldn’t remedy).

Now compare it to TrainFX which we’ve had at Northern for 5 or so years and its failure rate is phenomenal.

Give me cheap and reliable anyday rather than this TrainFX garbage.

 

[sheepy1991]

Nope, I agree too. To me, both the 319 and 321 fleets have always looked rather dated. Does anyone happen to know What is the reasoning behind the lack of inter-compatibility between the rest of the 321 fleet? They share the same couplers & PA system, they just lack First Class.

It is a Door Control wiring incompatibility between these units and the GA fleet that that requires these units to only operate in multiple together.
As the units are a stop gap measure it remains to be seen if they will be modified to work the rest of the GA fleet or not

 

[Bikeman78]

It is a Door Control wiring incompatibility between these units and the GA fleet that that requires these units to only operate in multiple together.
As the units are a stop gap measure it remains to be seen if they will be modified to work the rest of the GA fleet or not

I'm fairly sure that class 321/3 and 322 worked together in the 1990s. So which has changed since and why?

 

[F Great Eastern]

In the 15 or so years since they were fitted to the Northern 32x units and I’ve never had one fail with the exception of some of the external screens (nothing that a laminated sheet of A4 couldn’t remedy).

Now compare it to TrainFX which we’ve had at Northern for 5 or so years and its failure rate is phenomenal.

Give me cheap and reliable anyday rather than this TrainFX garbage.

I don't know anything about the Northern ones, just the ones which were fitted out by NXEA, which are dreadful.

The only good thing is that NXEA didn't put the sponsored announcements on them which they put on the 360 system.

 

[fgwrich]

It is a Door Control wiring incompatibility between these units and the GA fleet that that requires these units to only operate in multiple together.
As the units are a stop gap measure it remains to be seen if they will be modified to work the rest of the GA fleet or not

Fair enough, thanks for the update. I wonder how long it would take to modify the units?

Unfortunately 321901 won't be out today on any services, as it is currently running on the 5V69 Clacton On Sea - Ilford EMUD after being visited by the graffiti vandals last night. Thankfully it doesn't look too affected, but GA obviously doesn't want a vandalised unit running out and about today.

 

[Shunter_69]

I spotted that graffiti around 7 last night. I wondered if it had been done before it arrived but sounds like it wasn’t.

 

[bramling]

God they look outdated. Is it just me who thinks that?

The front end, yes, although IMHO it looked dated pretty much from new.

 

[D365]

God they look outdated. Is it just me who thinks that?

The 321/9s are worse in my eyes because of the sheet amount of yellow and blue/purple.

 

[IanXC]

I'm fairly sure that class 321/3 and 322 worked together in the 1990s. So which has changed since and why?

Fitment of incompatible PA systems.

 

[SteveyBee131]

Fitment of incompatible PA systems.

Sounds like a similar situation to the East Midlands Sprinters not being able to work with ex Anglia 156s. The PA/PIS systems won't work together and with the wonders of modern technology both would crash if it were tried.

As PIS is a PRM/DDA requirement, such an eventuality would render two units in need of repairs and unusable for a time. Therefore better to keep units with incompatible systems apart, to keep as many in service as possible.

Of course, in a sensible world, the units transferred in would be fitted with a compatible PIS, to avoid such problems. But if the hope is to have new trains in service to replace them before too long, perhaps it was deemed unnecessary. Here's hoping I haven't just opened up a can of worms!

 

[NoMorePacers]

As PIS is a PRM/DDA requirement, such an eventuality would render two units in need of repairs and unusable for a time.

Try telling that to Northern for the countless times their units have rocked up with a non-functional PIS system (it's probably more frequent than when a unit has a functioning one, at least it feels that way).

 

[IanXC]

As PIS is a PRM/DDA requirement, such an eventuality would render two units in need of repairs and unusable for a time. Therefore better to keep units with incompatible systems apart, to keep as many in service as possible.

It doesn't break it as such to my understanding - just doesn't work or doesn't behave as it should. Variously I've heard issues of Driver - Guard cab to cab being lost, very loud volume in one unit or the other, gibberish being produced on the screens etc etc, but in all cases I've heard of, once split the units worked find again.

 

[Bikeman78]

Sounds like a similar situation to the East Midlands Sprinters not being able to work with ex Anglia 156s. The PA/PIS systems won't work together and with the wonders of modern technology both would crash if it were tried.

As PIS is a PRM/DDA requirement, such an eventuality would render two units in need of repairs and unusable for a time. Therefore better to keep units with incompatible systems apart, to keep as many in service as possible.

Of course, in a sensible world, the units transferred in would be fitted with a compatible PIS, to avoid such problems. But if the hope is to have new trains in service to replace them before too long, perhaps it was deemed unnecessary. Here's hoping I haven't just opened up a can of worms!

In a sane world, all units of the same class would have the same system installed.

 

[delt1c]

In a sane world, all units of the same class would have the same system installed.

I believe they did when built under BR , but now each operator has their own specifications fitted making classes often incompatible with classmates operated by other operators. That is progress

 

[3973EXL]

24/08 ROG STP schedules

Realtime Trains - 092U 0726 Leicester L.I.P. to Belmont Down Yard

Realtime Trains provides live realtime running information for the Great British railway network using open data.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Realtime Trains - 515C 1112 Belmont Down Yard to Clacton C.S.D.

Realtime Trains provides live realtime running information for the Great British railway network using open data.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[507021]

Does anyone know if 322481/2 have transferred yet, or if they are actually intended to? Cheers.

 

[XCTurbostar]

Does anyone know if 322481/2 have transferred yet, or if they are actually intended to? Cheers.

Funnily enough thats whats transferring to Clacton C.S.D today.
Reported as 37800 + 322481 + 322482 on 5L21

 

[507021]

Funnily enough thats whats transferring to Clacton C.S.D today.
Reported as 37800 + 322481 + 322482 on 5L21

Thanks very much.

 

[fgwrich]

Funnily enough thats whats transferring to Clacton C.S.D today.
Reported as 37800 + 322481 + 322482 on 5L21

Is that all of the 321/9 & 322 Fleets with GA now?

 

[urpert]

Ahh yes you are correct. The Picture is HERE

The big yellow end makes me think of the 321 that was painted in NS livery!

edit: I see @samuelmorris has beaten me to it

 

[fgwrich]

The big yellow end makes me think of the 321 that was painted in NS livery!

edit: I see @samuelmorris has beaten me to it

Well, they are operated by Abellio afterall!

 

[XCTurbostar]

I take it 481 and 482 are being reviewed now by GA? Any ideas when they’ll be in service?

322481 and 322482 just passed Colchester under their own power on their way to Ilford Depot.

 

[86246]

Having been working together earlier in the week, 901 and 902 are now working in multiple with other 321s.

 

[43096]

I take it 481 and 482 are being reviewed now by GA? Any ideas when they’ll be in service?

322481 and 322482 just passed Colchester under their own power on their way to Ilford Depot.

322481/482 are now on lease to Greater Anglia.