Experiences of heritage railway operations post lockdown

[trubla]

Visited the Churnet Valley Railway yesterday for the Saturday Lunch train. Plenty of signs saying prebooked travel only. One way system from ticket office( mobile number was asked for for track n trace even tho an email address was already known ) through the station to the platform. Plenty of hand sanitising available from ticket office onwards and before boarding train being guided to seats. The tables were covered with an extra table cloth which was removed before any food or drink was served.All staff/volunteers were wearing masks. Announcements were made asking passengers to stay in their seats for the journey including a reminder as we approached a tunnel not to lean out of window. As for the food well worth the money and excellent service from the staff. Return journey was not stop other then the runround at Ipstone. Back at the start we were asked to leave the train and exit the station following the 1 way system. Would I go back again yes cant wait to book the christmas meal.

 

[Nippy]

I am in Wales at the moment, and I am absolutely staggered at the prices. I may be out of touch but £51 for 2 adults and 1 child on the FR and £82 on the WHR seems steep considering they aren't even operating the whole line. I don't know how much they usually are, but it seems a lot. The Tal y Llyn is £60.

 

[UP13]

I'll be trying out the RH&DR tomorrow. You book an option, which I believe are:

- Hythe to Dungeness non-stop with an hour at Dungeness.

- New Romney to Dungeness

- Romney Sands to Hythe via Dungeness, with the options of boarding Dungeness and/or getting off at Dymchurch with 4 or 5 hours at Hythe or Dymchurch.

We're doing the first option. We normally hop on and off, i.e. beach for an hour at Dymchurch, model railway and playground at New Romney etc, so this will be different.

Facilities at New Romney are closed.

If it's run as well as the Mid Hants then we'll be in for a splendid day.

 

[plannerman]

We sampled the OP's Line 5 (Bala Lake railway) the weekend before last and found the experience very pleasant. The minimum fare was no problem as we were two adults travelling together. We bought our tickets online and just read out the reference number to the guard when they came along the platform before departure. All customer facing staff were wearing masks as were all the passengers I saw. The coach doors and seats were being cleaned between departures and the whole experience felt very safe. It's a shame the halfway station isn't in use, as on a hot day it would be good to stop and picnic by the lake and get back on a later service, but totally understand why this doesn't work at the moment. My wife got caught in a long queue for the ladies' toilets as there was apparently only one cubicle in use out of four, which I don't really understand but it wasn't an issue.

 

[Belperpete]

I am in Wales at the moment, and I am absolutely staggered at the prices. I may be out of touch but £51 for 2 adults and 1 child on the FR and £82 on the WHR seems steep considering they aren't even operating the whole line. I don't know how much they usually are, but it seems a lot. The Tal y Llyn is £60.

The trains are having to run with significantly less passengers than they would normally. They need to make a profit, as otherwise it would not make sense to run them. Therefore the fares have to be higher than normal. Undoubtedly there will be some who will baulk at the price, but then again the trains can't carry as many as they would normally. And those fares still sound fairly reasonable compared to SMR fares, ZIP world (£50 per person), pony trekking (£40 pp) etc.

 

[IanXC]

From what I've seen its the punters that are the biggest problem!

For instance one railway I've been to, a group had already sat in our assigned seating, who proceeded to put their dog on the table, only wear their face coverings when a member of staff was around and leave their seats walking up and down the train for no apparent reason (and against the railways rules). They'd managed to ignore the huge A4 size signs showing seat numbers and sit in the ones (which didn't match) on the tiny round white disks on the seats.

Of course the railway had planned on the basis that everyone would sit in the same seats on the way back and so they'd not need to clean the train. That first group had managed to find their correct seats on the way back, but another group "who wanted to sit on the other side" were sat where we were on the way out, leaving us no choice but to sit in the seats the first group has sat in on the outward journey. All rather unsatisfactory.

 

[C37]

Was at the GCR on Saturday, seems very popular, lots of families with young children. The cafe at Rothley was busy as well.
I would hazard there were more people travelling 3 available services than there were on weekend services pre-covid?
I do hope they are able to get back to a normal timetable, miss spending the whole day roaming between stations.

 

[Belperpete]

I am in Wales at the moment, and I am absolutely staggered at the prices. I may be out of touch but £51 for 2 adults and 1 child on the FR and £82 on the WHR seems steep considering they aren't even operating the whole line. I don't know how much they usually are, but it seems a lot. The Tal y Llyn is £60.

The normal FR fare for the journey Porthmadog - TanyBwlch would have been £17, the current charge is £25. Bearing in mind that 2 adults will be taking up a compartment of 6 seats, that does not seem unreasonable to me. You would still be paying less than the normal full-line fare.

The normal WHR fare for the journey Caernarfon - Beddgelert would be slightly over £30, the current charge is £40. In this case, 2 adults will be taking up 12 seats (one bay of 6, plus the adjacent bay that is kept empty), so again that does not seem unreasonable. Again, you would still be paying less than the normal full-line fare.

I don't know what this year's TR fare would have been, as their leaflet doesn't say, but 2019's fare was just shy of £20, the current charge is £60 for a compartment of 6 seats.

The FR and TR are half-day outings, the WHR effectively a full day. When compared with similar half and full day tourist experiences, they are still remarkably good value for money. Which is why the trains are busy. I wouldn't be surprised if the railways didn't review their pricing structures for future years, if they can charge these levels of fares and still run full. Bearing in mind that the financial hit from this year will take many years to recover.

It will be interesting to see what happens to tourist numbers when the schools go back - I suspect that there will then be a large number of older tourists who don't want to risk going abroad or on a cruise this year, and have been biding their time, waiting for the holiday rush to die-down a bit.

 

[WesternLancer]

It's not the price of these things for me personally, it's the logistics as it were. After a week at work I might want to wake up on a Saturday morning, look out the window at the weather, and see if fancy going for a trip on my local railway. I don't want to bother logging on to book, or find out all seats are taken, or pre book a week or so ahead to then turn up on the day when the weather is foul (say), or can't suddenly change my plans when some other issue crops up. Then when I put it to the family others will say 'lets not bother, sounds like hassle, we'll do something else instead that we don't need to book' - which might be no more than a walk in the countryside - at next to no cost of course, so no 'tourist spend' as a consequence.

It's really hard for any attraction to solve this, because if they need strict number limits you do not want people turning up on spec to be sent away and told 'sorry, full up'.

And it's not just railways having this problem. The other day we looked at going to a National Trust place. They have a pre timed ticket system that you must book ahead to just get into the large garden and vast park (house is not open at all - which I assume may well be simply due to the fact that they cannot risk the health of their large and dedicated but often older room volunteers, which is understandable). They are charging a higher than normal entry fee to get into a large garden that you have to pre book at least 24 hours ahead when you might get drenched if the weather turns....it's not a recipe for visitor numbers is it? no wonder they say they are going to be down £2m income. I guess part of that is simply about social distancing in the car park since plenty of space in the gardens I would say.

I wonder if when the school hols season opens places will try to allow an element of 'walk up' visiting, preserved railways that is - given this isn't a thread about the National Trust!!

But I should end by saying I can see how difficult things are from the railways point of view - they need to be seen to be 'covid secure' as far as they can be for obvious reasons.

 

[peteb]

From what I've seen its the punters that are the biggest problem!

For instance one railway I've been to, a group had already sat in our assigned seating, who proceeded to put their dog on the table, only wear their face coverings when a member of staff was around and leave their seats walking up and down the train for no apparent reason (and against the railways rules). They'd managed to ignore the huge A4 size signs showing seat numbers and sit in the ones (which didn't match) on the tiny round white disks on the seats.

Of course the railway had planned on the basis that everyone would sit in the same seats on the way back and so they'd not need to clean the train. That first group had managed to find their correct seats on the way back, but another group "who wanted to sit on the other side" were sat where we were on the way out, leaving us no choice but to sit in the seats the first group has sat in on the outward journey. All rather unsatisfactory.

This is where railways that offer a compartment for the day win hands down because it's less likely that a group will get in the wrong compartment if they are numbered prominently. I find open carriage travel is always a lottery even with reserved seats and not just on preserved railways. People cant go backwards or wish to sit out of the sun etc. Perhaps you should contact the railway inviting them to review their boarding and stewarding arrangements?

 

[andythebrave]

Had a day out on the Severn Valley Railway yesterday, the day out from Bridgnorth.
A lovely day with just the right amount of time in Kidderminster Bewdley and Highley.
A blessed relief not to have the usual panic over 'will we get seats together?' as each party was allocated a specific compartment for the day. At £77 all in for four of us it was good value too and quite well patronised. I just hope it's enough to return at least a small margin.

 

[45517]

Travelled on the KWVR on the first day of 'Back in Steam' on 19th August, powered by 41241.
Oxenhope-Keighley return £20 for two adults in a private compartment, with free pre-booked parking, great value for money.
Refreshments available in the shed at Oxenhope. Friendly and well-organised social distancing.
Very enjoyable, great value, glad to see it was well-patronised.
Thanks to all involved at KWVR for a lovely afternoon.

 

[bramling]

Had a day out on the Severn Valley Railway yesterday, the day out from Bridgnorth.
A lovely day with just the right amount of time in Kidderminster Bewdley and Highley.
A blessed relief not to have the usual panic over 'will we get seats together?' as each party was allocated a specific compartment for the day. At £77 all in for four of us it was good value too and quite well patronised. I just hope it's enough to return at least a small margin.

We did same on the diesel day, have to say rather disappointing. To be honest trundling up and down in the same compartment all day isn’t really the most exciting thing in the world, especially as the train seemed to be increasingly full of drunks as the day progressed - no doubt an element of boredom contributing to that. As with many attractions at present there’s a dystopian backdrop of feeling heavily controlled - in this case no flexibility to choose a different seat or compartment on each trip (so stuck looking at the same view up and down), stuck next to the same drunk group all day, etc.

I was also a little unimpressed to see someone challenged over masks at one of the stations. Whilst ostensibly it was done by the book (“is there a reason why you’re not wearing a mask?”), the tone was distinctly frosty.

Even a premier line like the Severn Valley gives a distinct feeling of being under the weather at the moment. Our carriage had badly flatted wheels, and the journey was characterised by multiple TSRs, most unusual for the Severn Valley.

Did I feel it was good value for £77? Being brutally honest, no. Pleased to have supported the railway financially, but I’d probably not repeat. The steam services were running very empty - one service we passed must have had fewer than ten people on it. Had we had the flexibility we’d have been quite happy to have changed to a steam service, but of course not possible with the restrictions applicable.

The only way this is all going to change is if attractions start kicking up a fuss to the government. Which will of course then means the Karen types are going to have to be nailed firmly back in their boxes. If this doesn’t happen soon I fear a lot of good places are going to fold.

It already takes a special sort of person to do things in Britain with variables like the weather (especially the dreary weather we’re seeing at the moment), and frankly it’s not inviting to visit attractions and pay a lot of money at the moment to feel like one is back in a school-like environment.

 

[railfan99]

Why the cloak and dagger approach? Identify the railways not adhering to Welsh or English Covid rules. If you knew someone who'd died from covid you might be less keen to protect those putting customers and staff at risk for purely selfish reasons.

I am Australian so your experiences in the UK may differ, but experts here are increasingly suggesting that social distancing of say 1.5 metres, good hand (and face) hygiene and wearing masks are really all that's required. In my state of Victoria we've had 600 surgeons and others in that field sign a letter to end our lockdown.

In my country, almost everyone who's died has been over 70. They will in the main have had other health issues so may not have really died 'of the virus.'

I love heritage (and 'regular') railways and want to see as many as possible T & H railways in UK profitable, so dobbing them in to a government authority when any breach isn't likely to have deleterious consequences for travellers is an over reaction.

Very pleasing to read above that on SVR and the Dartmouth one, patronage has been good.

Worried for you folk that restrictions may be reimposed.

 

[geoffk]

Which will of course then means the Karen types are going to have to be nailed firmly back in their boxes.

I may be out of touch with current slang, but what's a Karen type? I know several women called Karen and I'm sure they'd like to know too!

 

[headshot119]

I may be out of touch with current slang, but what's a Karen type? I know several women called Karen and I'm sure they'd like to know too!

I couldn't quickly find a more UK based definition, but this definition (More American based) sums it up quite well

Karen
[ kair-in ]

WHAT DOES KAREN MEAN?
Karen is a pejorative slang term for an obnoxious, angry, entitled, and often racist middle-aged white woman who uses her privilege to get her way or police other people's behaviors.
As featured in memes, Karen is generally stereotyped as having a blonde bob haircut, asking to speak to retail and restaurant managers to voice complaints or make demands, and being an anti-vaxx , Generation X soccer mom.
In 2020, Karen spread as a label used to call out white women who were captured in viral videos engaging in what are widely seen as racist acts.

 

[brstd4260]

Visited the Bucks Rail Centre at Quainton today. It was well organised with an effective one way system around most of the site. 95%+ of the site was open. Numbers reasonable but plenty of space for social distancing (except around the miniature railway, open for the first time since lockdown). Little 0-4-0 in steam. Rides appeared well organised with passengers called forward to board individual compartments. Limited food service - a few different sandwiches and some hot food - mainly of the "...and chips" variety. We had sausage and cheese and onion rolls and chips. The sausage/cheese and onion rolls were fine but the chips were either well overcooked or recooked, so not so good. The overall set up was well done, it was just a shame that as usual some of the "Great British Public" either can't read, are stupid or have no intention of following the COVID instructions, totally ignoring the one way system in the main building and failing to follow any real social distancing around the miniature railway. Mind you I guess that attitude is why we appear to be heading for a second lockdown

 

[Shenandoah]

Visited the Bucks Rail Centre at Quainton today. It was well organised with an effective one way system around most of the site. 95%+ of the site was open. Numbers reasonable but plenty of space for social distancing (except around the miniature railway, open for the first time since lockdown). Little 0-4-0 in steam. Rides appeared well organised with passengers called forward to board individual compartments. Limited food service - a few different sandwiches and some hot food - mainly of the "...and chips" variety. We had sausage and cheese and onion rolls and chips. The sausage/cheese and onion rolls were fine but the chips were either well overcooked or recooked, so not so good. The overall set up was well done, it was just a shame that as usual some of the "Great British Public" either can't read, are stupid or have no intention of following the COVID instructions, totally ignoring the one way system in the main building and failing to follow any real social distancing around the miniature railway. Mind you I guess that attitude is why we appear to be heading for a second lockdown

Without doubt that is the way we seem to be heading. Far too many people are travelling round it would seem, many having scant regard for precautions.
An escaltion will have an effect of heritage lines, after all they are not essential, forms of travel. This must cast a shadow over Christmas arrangements being made on heritage lines. Costly arrangements, which have to be cancelled, could cut deeply into profits made while the sun shines.

 

[sprinterguy]

We did same on the diesel day, have to say rather disappointing. To be honest trundling up and down in the same compartment all day isn’t really the most exciting thing in the world, especially as the train seemed to be increasingly full of drunks as the day progressed - no doubt an element of boredom contributing to that.

Sounds like the ticket options from Kidderminster are better, as we had over 4 hours roaming around Bridgnorth between outbound and return trains, much like our trips on the Severn Valley Railway always have been. Getting on the beer round a few pubs in Bridgnorth has always been the primary reason for our visits.

I've mentioned before either on this thread or another that I think the booked compartments are an excellent idea and something I've thought should be available in the past. Even with just three of us I thought it was good value in the current climate, and that's even considering that we'd previously have had rail staff discount.

 

[SeanG]

Myself and my wife did the Swanage Railway on Friday and were very impressed (she even enjoyed herself on a train, of which I will be sure to remind her!)

We prebooked online, £25 for an exclusive use of a table Norden - Swanage return, which seemed reasonable at £12.50 per head.

On arrival therevwas sanitiser available and we showed the email on our phone at the booking office to receive our tickets. On the platform everyone was spaced out. There were 2m markings/stickers on the floor which we are all now familiar with, but they didn't detract from the ambiance of the place, and I was still able to take photographs etc.

The train was made up of 2x mk1 compos and 3x mk1 open coaches - our table was in one of the open coaches. Wooden boards had been put above each seat to form a partition, and to the normal, ie my wife, they looked rather authentic and better than plastic screens. The train had been fully disinfected before we were allowed to board.

On arrival at Swanage the platform was varriered in two to allow for arriving/departing passengers so that they did not mix. It was rather busy when leaving the station which unsettled us a bit but we waited at the end of the platform for it to quieten down and then left when there was more space, which was fine by us.

We got back to the station about 45 minutes before our return train but were allowed onto the platform to access the shop and toilets. It was barriered off bit those with train tickets could enter.

The return journey was in the similar manner as the first.

All in all we had an excellent day and whilst all health precautions were in place, they did not override the whole experience, indeed the only thing that stood out was mask wearing on the train, but that's a small price to pay in my book. The staff were excellent, friendly but adhering to all restrictions etc.

9/10 rating in my far from official scale - perhaps the exiting of Swanage Station could have been a bit better but hard to see what they could have done.

 

[lil Bear]

Visited the Churnet Valley Railway yesterday for the Saturday Lunch train. Plenty of signs saying prebooked travel only. One way system from ticket office( mobile number was asked for for track n trace even tho an email address was already known ) through the station to the platform. Plenty of hand sanitising available from ticket office onwards and before boarding train being guided to seats. The tables were covered with an extra table cloth which was removed before any food or drink was served.All staff/volunteers were wearing masks. Announcements were made asking passengers to stay in their seats for the journey including a reminder as we approached a tunnel not to lean out of window. As for the food well worth the money and excellent service from the staff. Return journey was not stop other then the runround at Ipstone. Back at the start we were asked to leave the train and exit the station following the 1 way system. Would I go back again yes cant wait to book the christmas meal.

Pretty much the same experience I had on the Bombay Express (except it was dark at the summit). The dining options are actually great value, the breakfast train for £20 is very tempting!

 

[Bessie]

I enjoyed an excellent day out on the Countryman Dining Train at the Mid Hants Railway today. The weather was atrocious but on board dining was excellent, all staff were wearing appropriate PPE and passengers were wearing masks when not seated at their tables. Will be looking to return for their Autumn Gala in a couple of weeks time - let's hope the weather is as good as it was back in 2018 for this event

 

[bramling]

Sounds like the ticket options from Kidderminster are better, as we had over 4 hours roaming around Bridgnorth between outbound and return trains, much like our trips on the Severn Valley Railway always have been. Getting on the beer round a few pubs in Bridgnorth has always been the primary reason for our visits.

I've mentioned before either on this thread or another that I think the booked compartments are an excellent idea and something I've thought should be available in the past. Even with just three of us I thought it was good value in the current climate, and that's even considering that we'd previously have had rail staff discount.

The thing that messes me up with the booked compartments is that you’re stuck in the same one for the whole day. Which means if you’ve got a noisy group in the adjacent one you’re stuck with it for the whole day, and likewise you’re stuck with the same scenery for the whole day, not having the option to move to the other side (obviously not an issue for those railways with full-width compartments).

I like the concept, but it needs refining. Sell a number of compartments for each train but let people choose where they go would work for me.

 

[UP13]

Choosing your own compartment would require even more cleaning.

It's a lot simpler and to keep groups to the same compartment.

 

[RichJF]

A friend & I (that's been in my social bubble for a while) went on the Bluebell.

Pre-booked dining car on the Wealden Rambler:
Only 3/4 tables occupied in each open Mark 1 dining car, with a total of 6 carriages on the train. Food was pre-prepared & set out for us when we boarded. Utensils are airline style (disposable).

Train departs from Horsted Keynes, travels up to Kingscote, non-stop back to Sheffield Park, then returns to Horsted Keynes.

Staff all wearing disposable gloves, face masks and very efficient social distancing going on. Good adherence to distancing & masks by the visiting public too.
We were allowed to explore each of Sheffield Park & Horsted Keynes at our leisure, providing we notified a member of staff.
A bit weird, but still enjoyable in the current climate!

 

[geoffk]

Expecting a wet weekend, I decided to have a trip on the East Lancs Railway last Sunday, having only just got round to getting a residents' permit. I booked a ticket on line and saw that, unlike the Worth Valley and most other heritage lines at the moment, I didn't have to book for a particular train and stay in the same seat all day.

I got to Heywood in good time for the 0940 dmu, which went as far as Bury. There were few passengers on this. We were all given a temperature check on arrival and handed a copy of the timetable with the Covid regulations on the back. We were asked to give our name and contact number on each train.

From Bury, where the island platform (nos. 3 and 4) was in use, I had the "pleasure" of being hauled by rebuilt Austerity 2890 to Rawtenstall and back to Ramsbottom. This was fairly busy but there was no difficulty finding a socially-distanced seat in either direction. There was a refreshments trolley on board but toilets were available only at stations.

2890 was taken off the service train at Bury to work the diner so it came back behind D1501, closely followed by the dmu, on which I went back to Heywood at 13.30. At Bury we had to wait for the diner coming from Heywood. This ran non-stop through platform 2, which was accessible only from the Trackside Bar, the stairs up to the entrance hall being locked up. The bar was busy, with many drinkers on the platform.

Only passengers with tickets were allowed on the platform at Ramsbottom (and probably also at Bury and Rawtenstall, although I didn't leave the station). There was a lot of cleaning going on and plenty of staff in attendance. Everyone wore a face covering and there were one-way systems in place to keep people apart. It all seemed to work well, given the circumstances, and everyone was sticking to the rules. It was evidently not worth lighting up a second steam loco just for the diner. I overheard some staff saying that ten posts had been removed as part of the plan to reduce costs.

 

[STEVIEBOY1]

I have just come back from a long weekend in the Notts/Derby area. Had some great trips on the Ecclesbourne Valley, diesel hauled. The Battlefield line, Bubble car at the front of the 2 carriage train, hauling a front or back trailer of another DMU. Visited Mountsorrel, although no trains were running on that branch and also went to the Great Central Railway which was excellent as it was steam hauled. We visited Crich Tramway too which had 4 Leeds trams running. All these sites where running well and I felt quite safe at them all. (Even the pub in Crich was open ) Well done to all the staff concerned, it must be difficult working in these odd times, but it was so good to be able to be a bit normal. I hope to get to the Bluebell and Mid Hants lines later in the year if possible and their main line connections are working at East Grinstead and Alton.

 

[EbbwJunction1]

I travelled on two heritage railways a couple of weeks ago whilst in East Anglia.

The first was the Nene Valley Railway, which was a little complicated to arrange, but worked out well in the end. The complication was that although I could board a train at Peterborough, I couldn't book from there to Wansford. I had to pay on arrival and use a dedicated coach for the whole journey, which seemed to be to be a bit odd, but it did work. Most of the activity is at Wansford, where the model railway and the cafe but not the shop (although there was a "pop-up" version was open. I wanted to visit Railworld next door, but I didn't have enough time.

The other railway was the North Norfolk, which although it was a fairly long journey from Cambridge (where I was staying) was an absolute delight. The access to the platform at Sheringham was controlled, but everyone was very helpful and pointed out what had to be done and where. I travelled both ways in a dedicated compartment in one of the Gresley Quad Art Sets, which I hadn't used before, and they were excellent. I just did an out and back trip to Holt, but this was enough and I thoroughly enjoyed myself.

A third place I visited was not strictly a heritage railway, but it does have a lot of railway interest. This was Bressingham Steam and Gardens, where there are three narrow gauge lines and a length of standard gauge track. Two of the former were operating, but not the latter - in fact, I don't think that this operates very often, although I may be mistaken. The admission price included trips on the two railways, and I took these, and also walked around the site a couple of times seeing what was there. One of the non-railway attractions is the official "Dad's Army" Collection, which brought back a few memories! Things seemed to be quite relaxed, although the usual precautions needed to be taken, and it's a very good place to visit.

All of these visits went very well (as did some to other, non-railway, places, and showed what can be achieved when things are planned properly. Sadly, I'm now locked down in Newport (as is everyone else here), so there'll be no more trips until that's resolved ... fingers crossed, it won't be for long, but I don't know when things will change.

 

[STEVIEBOY1]

Is the Gresley Quad Art Sets, an LNER Teak Suburban non corridor carriage? Glad you had a good time and hope you can go out and about soon, I have a friend not too far from your area and he had to cancel a holiday to England last week.

 

[EbbwJunction1]

Is the Gresley Quad Art Sets, an LNER Teak Suburban non corridor carriage? Glad you had a good time and hope you can go out and about soon, I have a friend not too far from your area and he had to cancel a holiday to England last week.

Yes, that's the one. I'd heard about them before, but never seen or travelled in them, so it was a pleasure to do so. They've been excellently restored and are part of the experience on the North Norfolk Railway.

As I say, I'm hoping to get out and about soon, but I don't know when this will be. I have great sympathy with your friend, as he's going through the same experiences as I am!