Explore Wales pass.

[glenbogle]

Can anyone kindly provide a list of buses that are valid with this pass especially in South West Wales.
On enquiring with ATW customer service they said buses were not valid at all on the pass whatsoever - that’s a new one to me.
Any help would be most welcome.

 

[attics26]

up to last year was always 4 days rail and 8 days bus travel, seems even though the price remains the same there is no mention of bus travel this year, really hope that is not the case as I love using the North and Mid Wales pass.

 

[glenbogle]

I do hope that’s not the case or this trip could prove a lot more expensive then I’d bargained for. I can’t get hold of any leaflets and doesn’t appear to be anything up to date on line.

 

[Flying Snail]

Can anyone kindly provide a list of buses that are valid with this pass especially in South West Wales.
On enquiring with ATW customer service they said buses were not valid at all on the pass whatsoever - that’s a new one to me.
Any help would be most welcome.

Official documentation is spectacularly unhelpful on this, both national rail and ATW sites have no mention of bus validity and where it is mentioned vague terms such as "most" or "many" are used.

https://www.arrivatrainswales.co.uk/ExploreWalesTermsConditions/

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_fares/pr14490cc35ce74101d518784bce2d58.aspx

http://www.anglesey.gov.uk/Journals/x/w/b/advertroverssaesgaeaf250117.pdf

here is an old (2009) ATW leaflet
https://issuu.com/arrivatrainswales/docs/walesflexipass

The omission of bus info almost makes it look like they have removed the bus validity from these tickets but I doubt that is correct.

It is sad but rovers in general are unloved, badly administered and marketed by most rail companies. I wouldn't be surprised if there is an element within the industry that wants them removed altogether with bad promotion being seen as the next best thing.

 

[marcouk2]

I had the same query recently (did a Explore South Wales in January), couldn't find any details regarding bus travel online except for a First Bus leaflet which just says to go to the ATW website for specific details. The Explore Wales page is still full of incomplete or incorrect details anyway.

On my thread where I asked the same question as you a Stagecoach South Wales staff member said that from their point of view it would be accepted.

On my first day in Wales I went to the ticket office at Cardiff Central to ask about bus travel on the pass, staff there looked it up (presumably on iKB) and expressed surprise when there was no details about buses at all. When I actually used the pass on buses, drivers either didn't waved me past or had no idea what I was showing them but a quick explanation sufficed to get me on board, this was just on Stagecoach services though so depending on what services you want to use might end up differently.

 

[glenbogle]

Thanks to you both for replies, I’m glad it’s not just me that is struggling to get up to date info - I think you won’t have a problem with First, Stagecoach or the Trans Cymru routes but the smaller operators is a different kettle of fish.
If the pass had a simple “includes bus” on it like “plusbus” that’d do for most drivers, it’s the fact bus isn’t mentioned which confuses most drivers.
I’ve had these tickets every year for the past 10 years as I think they are fantastic value and Wales is great for exploring especially with all the heritage railways - I would think twice about getting it again if the bus facility is withdrawn permanently.

 

[gazthomas]

Contradictions galore on the ATW website.

Encouragingly I found this page:

https://m.arrivatrainswales.co.uk/explore-wales-pass/

“The Explore Wales Pass is also valid on selected bus services in Wales, who provide access to some beautiful coastal and mountainous scenery.

How long can I use my Explore Wales Pass?

Each Explore Wales Pass allows four days train and eight days bus travel within a period of eight consecutive days.”

 

[gazthomas]

This leaflet is from 2013:

https://www.arrivatrainswales.co.uk...et_Description/Explore Wales leaflet 2013.pdf

 

[attics26]

latest mention of buses was in January 2017 update, have emailed ATW and they promise to answer within 20 working days, so will update any reply prob around mid summer.

 

[gazthomas]

And the bus map from ATW’s website:

https://www.arrivatrainswales.co.uk...tent/Explore_Wales/Explore Wales Map 2013.pdf

From 2013 of course

 

[bspahh]

This is tweet from January 20th https://twitter.com/ArrivaTW/status/954721714528837632 said in reply to the question:
"Does the Explore Wales Pass include free bus travel and discount for some heritage railways?"

Hi Matthias, it does include bus travel but mainline trains only. There are some Rangers & Rovers that include heritage railway travel http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_fares/pr9ef8ea0d8240bfae38accb393ae920.aspx ^Liv

https://www.arrivatrainswales.co.uk...et_Description/Explore Wales leaflet 2013.pdf and
https://www.arrivatrainswales.co.uk...tent/Explore_Wales/Explore Wales Map 2013.pdf are from 2013 which explicitly mention bus travel.

 

[keppoch69]

Sounds like a ((BRITISH)) thing. All around our British Islands, we cannot organise an inebriation within a brewery.

 

[marcouk2]

Contradictions galore on the ATW website.

The ATW page is just a mess...

There are three types of Explore Wales Pass, which all offer unlimited travel on all mainline rail services in Wales, plus the routes between Newport, Shrewsbury and Crewe, Crewe to Chester and Newport to Gloucester.

The Explore Wales Passes are valid on all trains within the Arriva Trains Wales network.

(Emphasis mine)

Do you think a guard would accept a South Wales Pass leaving Llandudno?

How long can I use my Explore Wales Pass?
Each Explore Wales Pass allows four days train.

Looks like the bus validity end to the sentence has just been deleted and the sentence no longer makes sense.

You can travel by train anytime Monday to Sunday including Bank Holidays on any time on the following routes:-

- Heart of Wales Line trains only, between Swansea, Llandrindod and Shrewsbury
- Services between Fishguard Harbour, Milford Haven, Pembroke Dock and Carmarthen
- Services between Aberystwyth, Machynlleth and Pwllheli
- Services between Llandudno and Blaenau Ffestiniog
- Services between Wrexham Central and Bidston

But it doesn't actually say anywhere what time the rover is valid from everywhere else!

 

[glenbogle]

This is the first reply I got from their customer relations

Hi,I'm afraid currently bus travel is not included in the Explore Wales Passes. This product is currently under review by our retail team ^Joy

I then quoted that tweet to them which was dated January 2018 and got this reply.

I'm not sure I'm afraid, If this changes after the product has been reviewed our explore wales page on the website will be updated. ^Joy

Basically nobody has a clue!!!

 

[glenbogle]

The ATW page is just a mess...




(Emphasis mine)

Do you think a guard would accept a South Wales Pass leaving Llandudno?



Looks like the bus validity end to the sentence has just been deleted and the sentence no longer makes sense.



But it doesn't actually say anywhere what time the rover is valid from everywhere else!

It used to be 0915 outwith these routes.

 

[Parallel]

It's all a bit weird. It definitely allowed 50% discount on Ffestiniog and Welsh Highland Railway last summer.

It reminds me of a couple of summers ago with the Dartmoor Sunday Rover, GWR staff had no idea if it allowed travel on trains between Newton Abbot and Exeter. They tweeted me something from the council that it was all train services in Devon plus selected bus routes, but GWR's own terms and conditions said it wasn't valid on trains between those two stations.

 

[glenbogle]

It's all a bit weird. It definitely allowed 50% discount on Ffestiniog and Welsh Highland Railway last summer.

It reminds me of a couple of summers ago with the Dartmoor Sunday Rover, GWR staff had no idea if it allowed travel on trains between Newton Abbot and Exeter. They tweeted me something from the council that it was all train services in Devon plus selected bus routes, but GWR's own terms and conditions said it wasn't valid on trains between those two stations.

It was a sad day when they took the bus off that took you to Gunnislake, it was a spectacular ride complimented by the trains.

 

[0B00]

I believe the updated list of bus operator validity is now with the ATW Marketing team and a web update is imminent. Meanwhile I can confirm that the 50% discount on full fare single or return Ffestiniog Railway and Welsh Highland Railway tickets remains in place for the 2018 operating season. It also gives a discount on the 'Snowdonia Single' ticket for one 'trough journey' either way FR/WHR or WHR/FR making that fare £21.00 for an adult.

 

[glenbogle]

I believe the updated list of bus operator validity is now with the ATW Marketing team and a web update is imminent. Meanwhile I can confirm that the 50% discount on full fare single or return Ffestiniog Railway and Welsh Highland Railway tickets remains in place for the 2018 operating season. It also gives a discount on the 'Snowdonia Single' ticket for one 'trough journey' either way FR/WHR or WHR/FR making that fare £21.00 for an adult.

Thanks for that. Managed to get on the T5 from Haverfordwest this morning without any issues.

 

[185143]

I had quite a few issues using the North+Mid Wales rover on buses last summer with drivers who didn't have a clue what the ticket was (as the words 'Rail Rover' are very helpfully printed on it...

All but one drivers were more than happy to accept it when shown the T&Cs from the ATW website. One driver even asked me where I'd been on the train with it as it looked like a really good ticket! (As did a Virgin RPI at Crewe for that matter)

I had no issue using the ticket on the morning WAG to Shrewsbury either, nor on the 08:35 Chester-Euston as far as Crewe.

I ended the week by travelling on the Mold-Ellesmere Port route operated by Stagecoach. The driver initially point blank refused to accept the ticket, and wouldn't accept the T&Cs as 'we don't accept Arriva tickets'. (That route was *specifically* mentioned as being valid!) He soon realised I wasn't going anywhere and reluctantly let me on.

Upon arrival, he told me that Arriva had ran that route (apparently on a short term measure when GHA Coaches went bust) so suspected that the website may have been updated around that time. He also said he was going to look into it as he was fairly certain that the ticket wasn't intended to be valid on Stagecoach-which, to be honest, beyond the Welsh border and into Ellesmere Port, I'd be inclined to agree with.

The quite lengthy detail of what buses were valid disappeared about 2 weeks later. So I wonder if Stagecoach have made a complaint and they've realised it was out of date and panicked...

 

[glenbogle]

Part of an e mail I’ve just received.


9. The Explore Wales pass can be used in with the following bus operators in Wales; First Group, Cardiff Bus, Arriva Bus Wales and Stagecoach Bus.

10. Prices are valid until 19/05/2018.

 

[splashoutradio]

Oh dear. That rules out bus travel in a fairly large portion of the country.

 

[185143]

Oh dear. That rules out bus travel in a fairly large portion of the country.

Indeed. No TrawsCymru in North Wales anymore!

 

[higthomas]

Part of an e mail I’ve just received.


9. The Explore Wales pass can be used in with the following bus operators in Wales; First Group, Cardiff Bus, Arriva Bus Wales and Stagecoach Bus.

10. Prices are valid until 19/05/2018.

It now says as such on the website as well. Seems ridiculous given that it doesn't include the TrawsCymru services or as said most services across much of Wales.

 

[glenbogle]

I went on a few of the Traws Cymru services and never had a problem. Used the Wrexham to Barmouth service 3 times and then to Aberystwyth and Haverfordwest.
Also used Lloyd’s coaches and again no problems.

 

[glenbogle]

Just a reminder all the Traws Cymru services are free at the weekends.

 

[Parallel]

Does anyone know when this ticket starts validity? I was told at Bristol that it is 9.30am which the guy pulled up from a National Rail page. I wasn’t sure if that was correct but didn’t say anything.

 

[glenbogle]

Does anyone know when this ticket starts validity? I was told at Bristol that it is 9.30am which the guy pulled up from a National Rail page. I wasn’t sure if that was correct but didn’t say anything.

time restrictions
Mon to Fri: valid from 09:30

Valid anytime between Llandudno and Blaneau Ffestiniog on Conwy Valley services; Swansea and Shrewsbury via Llandrindod Wells; between Aberystwyth, Machynlleth and Pwllheli, between Fishguard Harbour, Milford Haven, Pembroke Dock and Carmarthen and between Wrexham Central and Bidston

No restrictions at weekends, bank holidays or on buses .

 

[185143]

time restrictions
Mon to Fri: valid from 09:30

Valid anytime between Llandudno and Blaneau Ffestiniog on Conwy Valley services; Swansea and Shrewsbury via Llandrindod Wells; between Aberystwyth, Machynlleth and Pwllheli, between Fishguard Harbour, Milford Haven, Pembroke Dock and Carmarthen and between Wrexham Central and Bidston

No restrictions at weekends, bank holidays or on buses .

Is that a recent change?

No one mentioned restrictions to me-and I couldn't see anything on ATW's site last summer. I used it a few times before 09:30 and had no problems, including on the WAG and the 08:35 Euston.

 

[glenbogle]

Is that a recent change?

No one mentioned restrictions to me-and I couldn't see anything on ATW's site last summer. I used it a few times before 09:30 and had no problems, including on the WAG and the 08:35 Euston.

To be honest I’ve never had a problem using it in the North - even on the WAG from Holyhead at just after 05:00!!