Fares (yet again!)

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eezypeazy

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I shall be using the Lincoln-Sheffield line between Gainsborough Lea Road and Kiveton Bridge on Sunday. The fare for this 38 minute ride is £9.35. However, I intend to buy a ticket from Gainsborough to Barnsley, a ride that is 55 minutes longer, on the same through train (to Leeds), yet the fare is only £5.95, a whole £3.40 cheaper!

I know there are rules against over-riding, but are there any rules which prohibit deliberate under-riding on your ticket?

And, how many other examples are there like this, where longer distance tickets are much, much cheaper than shorter distance tickets? (eg, a MetroCentre to Whitby Cheap Day Return is cheaper than a MetroCentre to Middlesbrough CDR!).

And, is there any way to find out, other than to do comparisons on the on line ticket services?

eezypeazy
 
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Lewisham2221

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With regards to whether or not such a rule exists, I don't know. However, I can't actually see how such a rule could be enforced, especially where a break of journey is permitted.
 

Table 52

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I wouldn't buy the £5.95 ticket, it's a single.
But yeah, it's £8.30 I think for a return. So still cheaper.

Anyway, getting off early is simply break of journey. So if that's allowed, you're fine.
 

eezypeazy

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Here's another one... GNER's single NCL to Berwick is £15.60; but a single NCL-Morpeth is £2.80, and Morpeth-Berwick £7.20, saving £5.60... now, I'm going to cycle Berwick-Morpeth, and catch a train back to Blaydon, the single fare being £5.40 - but a RTN Blaydon-Morpeth is £5.80.. so, I'll get my train travel for £13 in total, as opposed to £21.40....

There must be thousands of these across the Railway - has anybody put together a website with a program on it which splits journeys into their constituent parts? If can achieve savings of 33% plus, it must be worth doing...

eezypeazy
 

Table 52

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To put together such a website, I imagine one would have to use some sort of fares system already in existence (typing in every fare manually would take so long, the price would be reviewed by the time you did it)

I believe all pricing systems have to be ATOC approved. On the basis that i imagine ATOC would not approve of such a cost cutting website, I dare say that any pricing system that lends itself to such a task would find itself unapproved. As such, it ain't going to happen.
 
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Tom

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The pricing system that would be shown is already in use though!
 

yorkie

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eezypeazy said:
I shall be using the Lincoln-Sheffield line between Gainsborough Lea Road and Kiveton Bridge on Sunday. The fare for this 38 minute ride is £9.35. However, I intend to buy a ticket from Gainsborough to Barnsley, a ride that is 55 minutes longer, on the same through train (to Leeds), yet the fare is only £5.95, a whole £3.40 cheaper!

I know there are rules against over-riding, but are there any rules which prohibit deliberate under-riding on your ticket?
Break of journey is valid on a Cheap Day Return or Standard Day Return. If you get a jobsworth (such as a certain individual who works for Chiltern) who claims otherwise, simply ask them to look it up in the fares manual (or insist until they do, in the case of Chiltern).
eezypeazy said:
And, how many other examples are there like this, where longer distance tickets are much, much cheaper than shorter distance tickets? (eg, a MetroCentre to Whitby Cheap Day Return is cheaper than a MetroCentre to Middlesbrough CDR!).
Impossible to quantify unless you had a live feed into all the fares and online routeing guide and an algorithm to figure it out. But in short: loads!!!!
eezypeazy said:
And, is there any way to find out, other than to do comparisons on the on line ticket services?
That is the only way, other than buying a copy of the fares manual or making hundreds of phone calls to NRES ;)
eezypeazy said:
Here's another one... GNER's single NCL to Berwick is £15.60; but a single NCL-Morpeth is £2.80, and Morpeth-Berwick £7.20, saving £5.60... now, I'm going to cycle Berwick-Morpeth, and catch a train back to Blaydon, the single fare being £5.40 - but a RTN Blaydon-Morpeth is £5.80.. so, I'll get my train travel for £13 in total, as opposed to £21.40....
hehe ;)
eezypeazy said:
There must be thousands of these across the Railway - has anybody put together a website with a program on it which splits journeys into their constituent parts? If can achieve savings of 33% plus, it must be worth doing...

eezypeazy

This has been raised many times over at uk.r, here's my response when someone (unsuccessfully) tried it...
Nathan wrote:
> I was just looking for a cheap combination of tickets for an upcoming
> journey, with the usual sheets of paper with scribbles all over, and I was
> wondering whether anyone would come up with a website to do it and I found
> one on Google, and I looked on Google groups and it hasn't been mentioned
> here that I could find, so here it is

> http://www.ma.ic.ac.uk/~finn/Train/
> Its definitely real time, as it takes ages, but it doesn't half save all the
> scribbles!



I don't think the person behind it realises just how huge an
undertaking this is, or the costs involved.


I doubt it's legal to query thetrainline.com in the way he appears to
be doing, and then using the information on his site.

There are just too many variables.

To be accurate, it would need a live feed to the NFM data (including
ticket restrictions), and also consult the Routeing Guide, and also
access to timetable data.

For example, there is no point in offering a combination of CDRs that
offers no useable journey opportunities.

How would it cope with a York-Leeds journey at peak time for a Y-P
holder? Would it be able to figure out that using a Saver return to
somewhere *further* like Hebden Bridge is cheaper than a York-Leeds
Standard day return? I doubt it!
It's an absolutely *huge* undertaking, and I see no evidence to suggest
that this site is able to do what would be required.
 

eezypeazy

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At least the guy doing the website is in a Mathematics department of a university... he probably stands a better chance of achieveing it than us lesser mortals!!

eezypeazy
 
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