Fastest Accelerating EMU and DMU ?

[sprinterguy]

Either a 395 with its 2/3rds axled motors or a 500 Series Shinkansen if we are allowed foreign trains, as that is entirely motored and has far more power than a UK train could ever dream of.

395 should win easily, it has loads of power and more motors than any other train I can thihnk of.

A 350/2 has eight powered axles providing a total of 2000kW. The total weight of a four car unit is 166.1t. That's a power to weight ratio of 12.04kW/tonne (16.15hp/t).

A 395 has sixteen powered axles, each fitted with a 210kW traction motor, giving a total power of 3360kW. A complete 6-car unit weighs 274.6t. That gives a power to weight ratio of 12.23kW/tonne (16.4hp/t).

So overall, they're pretty evenly matched, with the 395 slightly having the upper hand, though undoubtedly a 350 will be geared towards a faster acceleration at lower speeds.

 

[exile]

On the same basis
- pacers - 450 bhp - 48 tonnes - 9 bhp/tonne
- 185 - 2250 bhp - 166 tonnes - 14 bhp/tonne

however - can bhp/tonne be converted to an approximate 0-30mph time?

 

[swt_passenger]

A 350/2 has eight powered axles providing a total of 2000kW. The total weight of a four car unit is 166.1t. That's a power to weight ratio of 12.04kW/tonne (16.15hp/t).

The DC version, the 450, ought to be a bit quicker off the mark as it is lighter by the weight of the transformer - if only they weren't derated due to the poor power supply system in the area...

 

[Barrett M95]

Either a 395 with its 2/3rds axled motors or a 500 Series Shinkansen if we are allowed foreign trains, as that is entirely motored and has far more power than a UK train could ever dream of.

395 should win easily, it has loads of power and more motors than any other train I can thihnk of.

Series 5 shinkansen:
Weight = 455t
Power = 13,360hp
Ratio = 29hp/t

North of London 373
Weight = 665t
Power = 16,400hp
Ratio = 25hp/t

ICE3
Weight = 409t
Power = 10,725hp
Ratio = 26hp/t

TGV-R
Weight = 383t
Power = 11,800hp
Ratio = 31hp/t

I can't think of anything in the UK that has come anywhere near a 373/2 at 25hp/t, and it has 3000hp (or nearly a full class 66!) more than the Shinkansen. That TGV-R figure of 31hp/t is bloody impressive.

 

[millemille]

You need to define "Fastest Accelerating"....

Peak Delta V or average Delta V to unit's maximum speed or a time from standstill to a given speed.

For an EMU it all depends on gearing. In terms of average Delta V I'd nominate class 376's as a winner for mainline stock, 0.92ms2.

465's are 0.88ms2, 365's are 0.77ms2, 395's are 0.84ms2.

 

[exile]

The normal definition would be 0-30 (or whatever). Apparently the "Decapod" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GER_Decapod could do 0-30 in 30 seconds!
0.9ms2 sustained for 30 seconds would give a speed of 58 mph but of course the delta-v would actually decrease as speed increased.
A typical family car can manage 0-30 in about 3 seconds and 0-60 in 10 with a bhp/tonne of about 100.

 

[Woody]

Here is a Cab ride - Meridian class 222 0-110 mph from U Tube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBy4ncMqjm8
Pretty impressive excelleration.

 

[BrummyBoy]

My moneys on the 350 for the fastest EMU. Really quick off the mark.

 

[matchmaker]

Clearly it's a eurostar... Nothing beats it from 150 to 180....



Pedants relax, it is supposed to be a joke.

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Subjectively, hard to judge. If you travel on a Metro-Vick Glasgow Subway unit in the tight confines of the system, you might think you are attached to a Saturn 5!

 

[Bevan Price]

For intial acceleration of dmu's, the following comparison may be of interest:
From Newton Le Willows (start) to passing the relay room at Parkside Junction (about 0.9 miles), a quick selection of better passing times & speeds from my notebooks. Of course, you get slower times if the unit is not in best condition, or due to driver "variability".

Class 142: 1m 27s at 55 mph
Class 150: 1m 28s at 54 mph
Class 156: 1m 27s at 55 mph
Class 158: 1m 25s at 57 mph
Class 175: 1m 24 s at 60 mph
Class 185: 1m 16s at 70 mph

and for further interest:
57302 + 6 Mk.2: 1m 25s at 59 mph
47734 + 4 Mk. 2: 1m 27s at 57 mph
37412 + 4 Mk. 2: 1m 31s at 52 mph

Not had any Class 170 over this section.

 

[notadriver]

A 350/2 has eight powered axles providing a total of 2000kW. The total weight of a four car unit is 166.1t. That's a power to weight ratio of 12.04kW/tonne (16.15hp/t).

A 395 has sixteen powered axles, each fitted with a 210kW traction motor, giving a total power of 3360kW. A complete 6-car unit weighs 274.6t. That gives a power to weight ratio of 12.23kW/tonne (16.4hp/t).

So overall, they're pretty evenly matched, with the 395 slightly having the upper hand, though undoubtedly a 350 will be geared towards a faster acceleration at lower speeds.

http://www.worldlingo.com/ma/dewiki/en/TOPS-Klasse_360

shows power as being 1550 kw not 2000 for 360s which are nearly identical to 350s.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

You need to define "Fastest Accelerating"....

Peak Delta V or average Delta V to unit's maximum speed or a time from standstill to a given speed.

For an EMU it all depends on gearing. In terms of average Delta V I'd nominate class 376's as a winner for mainline stock, 0.92ms2.

465's are 0.88ms2, 365's are 0.77ms2, 395's are 0.84ms2.

To be honest I think 376s and 465s are quite slow taking 50 seconds to reach 50 mph approx

 

[sprinterguy]

http://www.worldlingo.com/ma/dewiki/en/TOPS-Klasse_360

shows power as being 1550 kw not 2000 for 360s which are nearly identical to 350s.

I hope that the technical data on that site is more accurate than the English translations! If that is the case, then the figures detailed in the Platform 5 Combined Volume must be erroneous.

 

[87015]

My moneys on the 350 for the fastest EMU. Really quick off the mark.

But irrelevant as most of the timings they use are slower than they were with 321s and a 75mph slow line speed!!!

 

[apk55]

What about the Sheffield trams. With all axles motored and the ability to climb 1 in 10 hills the initial acceleration on the level would be better than anything here. OK they will soon hit the power limit and the maximum speed is 50MPH, and power weight ratio is 24KW/T.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siemens-Duewag_Supertram

 

[notadriver]

Oh yes trams have amazing acceleration but for me as they are limited to 50 mph are not proper mainline trains.

 

[apk55]

Oh yes trams have amazing acceleration but for me as they are limited to 50 mph are not proper mainline trains.

I presume the same applies to metro and rapid transport trains both here and abroad. Some of the London tube trains and surface stock has all axles motored and high initial acceleration, but a relatively low top speed of 50 or 60mph.

 

[starrymarkb]

Taurus...

[youtube]cdy3G_an65s[/youtube]

 

[HSTEd]

Is that Taurus light engine or hauling a Railjet?

 

[starrymarkb]

Is that Taurus light engine or hauling a Railjet?

Light - though I have seen vids of them accelerating a load 12 at some rate!

 

[Beveridges]

Fastest accelerating train in the UK?? Has to be a Class 90 running light engine? Seen a 90 come in to a platform at slow speed about 5mph, then it 'opened up' and must have been doing at least 70mph before it got past the other end of the platform!
Fastest accelerating train I've seen by far anway!

--OLD POST ABOVE --- NEW POST BELOW

Now as for fastest accelerating DIESEL trains, about the Grand Central HSTs? I've seen them in 4 coach formation at times and with 4500HP thats 1125HP PER CARRIAGE now thats more than enough

 

[sprinterguy]

Now as for fastest accelerating DIESEL trains, about the Grand Central HSTs? I've seen them in 4 coach formation at times and with 4500HP thats 1125HP PER CARRIAGE now thats more than enough

That would be 16.2hp/tonne, which certainly beats the power to weight ratio of a Voyager (Virgin XCs' shortened 2+5 HSTs that they used for a short while before they were replaced had a comparable power to weight ratio to a 220 to allow them to run to Voyager timings), though with only half the number of powered axles.

 

[ainsworth74]

That would be 16.2hp/tonne, which certainly beats the power to weight ratio of a Voyager (Virgin XCs' shortened 2+5 HSTs that they used for a short while before they were replaced had a comparable power to weight ratio to a 220 to allow them to run to Voyager timings), though with only half the number of powered axles.

Yes that's the key issue really, they might have a high hp/tonne ratio but if they can't put that all that power down on the rail then it doesn't really matter. I suspect one of the reasons Voyagers accelerate so quickly is the fact that they have two axles per vehicle powered meaning they can put all their power down much quicker without so much danger of wheelslip.

 

[mappman1000]

Probably been mentioned but 314's and 315's are really good, despite their age!

 

[thachieman350]

For me the 350 is the king. coupled with its amazing traction sound makes it a magnificant train

 

[Beveridges]

I have to disagree and dislike it's traction sound. 323s also do not sound good.
Class 92's easily the best sounding electric especially when they got the fans roaring when they are slowing down.

 

[222007]

I agree the 350's go like s*** of a shovel from a standing start and easily pass our 170's out of new street

 

[whhistle]

Surely some of the Underground stock are the quickest from 0-30?

 

[185]

From a dead stop, a 323 utterly battered a Pendo if I remember right, in a hastily organised scrap near Slade Lane in South Manchester - both are ex North Western Trains drivers.

Kids!

 

[thachieman350]

On the subject of tube stock im pretty sure the 09 stock would kill everything else on acceleration, its scary how quick they get up to speed

 

[Eng274]

Probably been mentioned but 314's and 315's are really good, despite their age!

I was thinking the same!

314s out of Glasgow Central get up to the platform speed (15mph?) in no time at all, and can fairly shift once they're out in the open. Not sure how they compare between 50-75mph against other units, but with eight traction motors - one on each driving car axle - they can put the power down with little problem.