Fastest double decker?

[Geordie driver]

Flicking about the net I stumbled across a picture of this
https://www.flickr.com/photos/27204054@N07/12615458285
Northumbria Motor service 303 Leyland Alexander, what a motor.

Got me thinking, what's the top speed of a decker? We once had a driver followed into the depot by the police for speeding in this vehicle, ( rip green grass), he asked the copper why he hadn't stopped him sooner, he replied he couldn't catch him! All in good humour, the polis just gave him a bollocking and that was that, police never used to bother us most of the time. He reckoned the bus was doing well over 80mph in what is a 50 zone for buses. This was before they governed buses down to below 60mph.

The speedometers fitted to buses are notoriously vague, we often had some that didn't work for weeks on end but still got sent out. 303 had a tachograph fitted for private hire work as did many of our deckers, I recall doing Washington services on the A1 to Gosforth park in about 15 mins.

So that's my question, a bus pushes a heck of a lot of air in front of it, what's the fastest decker?

 

[notadriver]

Everything is speed limited to 62 mph maximum now right ? Or do you mean before speed limiters ?

 

[Geordie driver]

Everything is speed limited to 62 mph maximum now right ? Or do you mean before speed limiters ?

Yes, before.

 

[Busaholic]

The Metropolitan was fast - too fast for London!

 

[JonathanH]

The Metropolitan was fast - too fast for London!

When Reading Transport ran to Southend in the very early 1980s, I recall a piece in Buses which stated that Metropolitans were favoured over Metrobuses for the Motorway running as they had a "better turn of speed".

Once cut back to just run between Reading and London, Reading used a succession of what were basically 'town' buses to provide the service to London - first Mark 1 Metrobuses, then Titans, Mark 2 Metrobuses, Olympians and Optare Spectas.

 

[whoosh]

104mph, 3 points and a £30 fine - amongst other anecdotes!

 

[Robertj21a]

The early Optare Spectras were mighty fast and the early Volvo Citybus could certainly move too.

 

[fgwrich]

The early Optare Spectras were mighty fast and the early Volvo Citybus could certainly move too.

I'd certainly agree about the Volvo Citybuses. I'd also put the Volvo Ailsa in this list too - Not only did they scream like hell, but certainly move like a bat out of hell!

Not a Double Decker, but The Volvo B10M used under the Alexander PS could also shift too.

 

[notadriver]

The thing I don’t understand is a modern bus/coach generally has more power and they are faster up hills etc

 

[Busman84]

Scania L113 was one of the fastest buses around certainly for power pulling off from junctions or bus stops. Volvo Citybus, B10M and B10BLEs were close too..

 

[Mikey C]

The thing I don’t understand is a modern bus/coach generally has more power and they are faster up hills etc

Not so much the E400s, but to me the current generation of buses with their smaller engines seem slower, e.g. the various B5s. The hybrid B5LH seems quite slow to accelerate to 30 when compared to the B9TL.

It would be an interesting "Top Gear" style drag race to see the comparative speeds of the conventional E400MMC, a hybrid version and a full electric BDL version!

 

[GaryMcEwan]

When Stagecoach Perth still had the East Lancs MAN Kinetics, 22507 could get up to 68mph without breaking a sweat.

The E400MMC's definitely lose speed going up hills. The branded 18's lose a lot of speed going up the Glasgow Road heading towards East Kilbride.

 

[EvoIV]

In my limited experience, older is definitely faster as they had less, or no, emissions control equipment and bigger engines. It all hinges on the gearbox though.

I can confirm that a Streetlite in whatever guise my former employer ordered is scarily twitchy and sounds like it's almost on the rev limiter when it hit the speed limiter at 62. I certainly wouldn't have done that with passengers on. One they'd be deaf and two they'd be screaming even more than before.

Many of our deckers were limited to 50, some even lower, like 40 something. Some of the older singles, like the solos and one whose name I can't remember struggled to get above 30 without running out of puff, I doubt they'd even get to 40.

 

[RustySpoons]

In my limited experience, older is definitely faster as they had less, or no, emissions control equipment and bigger engines. It all hinges on the gearbox though.

I can confirm that a Streetlite in whatever guise my former employer ordered is scarily twitchy and sounds like it's almost on the rev limiter when it hit the speed limiter at 62. I certainly wouldn't have done that with passengers on. One they'd be deaf and two they'd be screaming even more than before.

Many of our deckers were limited to 50, some even lower, like 40 something. Some of the older singles, like the solos and one whose name I can't remember struggled to get above 30 without running out of puff, I doubt they'd even get to 40.

There are three Streetlites used on a Hospital Shuttle service near me which includes a long stint on the motorway in each direction, not sure if they've been mechanically tweaked in any way but doesn't sound like a pleasant way to travel if not.

 

[Busman84]

These E400MMCs it could be the case gearbox ECU setting is in some sort of Eco mode and that’s why they lose a fair bit of power.. In saying that those buses have Voith gearboxes and they did manage to hold gear pretty well going uphills. The old Volvo Olympians could climb that hill to EK no bother and these were 3 speed Voiths.
As for fastest deckers this again can be down to gearbox settings. Certainly a B9TL if not in Eco mode can be fast with good acceleration, low revs and no issues on hills. I would imagine Hybrids B5LH and E400s will probably be fastest deckers around for acceleration at low speeds.

 

[notadriver]

Generally speaking buses have been artificially restricted in power due to emissions etc I agree but there are some good examples usually on interurban services that are very fast like the X1 from Great Yarmouth to Peterborough. Coaches are certainly more powerful than those in the 70s and 80s.

 

[scosutsut]

Slightly off topic but I remember being told that old B58s with manual boxes could defeat the limiter by staying out of top gear, always wondered if it was true. I'd imagine they had the grunt for it!

 

[computerSaysNo]

Many of our deckers were limited to 50, some even lower, like 40 something. Some of the older singles, like the solos and one whose name I can't remember struggled to get above 30 without running out of puff, I doubt they'd even get to 40.

Aren't all deckers in the UK limited to 50mph? (and for completness, singles are limited to 62mph I think?)

 

[cambsy]

Don’t know what I have clocked on Double-deckers, National Express etc, as normally sat on the top deck, but on single deckers have been up to around 90mph, had a Plaxton Express liner, with no governor working on a Gatwick-Victoria-Birmingham overnight service, it came into Victoria coach station early so thought this may be a fast coach and sure enough it flew up M4 to Heathrow hitting over 80. Then after Heathrow continued up M25-M1 at well over 80mph at times, off the clock, had a later Express liner racing a lorry down hill at 80mph, we won, one run was a Vanhool (M39 HJR) which had no governor working, we left Golders Green on time and next stop Leeds, we arrived 45 mins early, I saw the speedo off the clock before nodded off, the drivers told me were doing 80 plus mph all the way, quite a few 70mph run on that one though officially 62mph at the time, most recent one was a 17 plate Irizar I6 tri axle, Edinburgh coach lines G90, Edinburgh-Inverness and back, on some of the steep hills he let it over run to to 75mph, driver commented that he thought might get done for speeding as had let run downhill too fast, but happened about 3 times, and had few City Link Golds, Plaxton Elites hitting 70mph down hill on Inverness runs, and recently a Plaxton elite doing 70mph down hill on an M92 run to Inverness, had a trip to Poland many years ago, which was a Neoplan double decker out, and coming back a single decker, through Germany etc were doing 70mph plus, coming into Calais 80 mph, running hour early despite leaving over hour late from Poland, so by reckoning the double decker was doing similar as arrived hour early too, now days with speed limited to 62mph on motorways, it tends to be on main roads, mainly overnight runs on National Express, when roads clear, 40 plus in 30 zones, on 404 and 406.

 

[notadriver]

Aren't all deckers in the UK limited to 50mph? (and for completness, singles are limited to 62mph I think?)

No such rule but anything with a powered speed exceeding 60 mph must be fitted with seatbelts. (Trains excepted haha)

 

[Strathclyder]

The Leyland-DAB Lions and Mercedes-Benz O305s operated by Eastern Scottish & Kowloon Motor Bus respectively both had fearsome turns of speed. Both types were assigned to limited-stop/express work in their respective territories if I recall correctly (willing to be corrected on that if need be).

 

[IslandDweller]

The airport express service operated by First between Glasgow city centre and the airport runs down the M8 motorway, parts of which have a 70 limit. I've used it a lot in the last year (before lock down) and that bus doesn't hang around, certainly over 60mph according to the speedcheck GPS app in my phone

 

[hst43102]

What was the top speed of the ex-Hong Kong Olympians used on Megabus services in the early 2000's?

 

[westcoaster]

When younger I knew a friendly driver, one evening on a major A road near to London. Showed me how fast the iveco turbo daily bus (van) went. Tipped the clock at just over 81mph.

 

[Redmike]

I always thought Bristol VRs seemed very fast on inter urban runs. They probably weren't but they used to go like the clappers on the open road.

 

[Busman84]

The airport express service operated by First between Glasgow city centre and the airport runs down the M8 motorway, parts of which have a 70 limit. I've used it a lot in the last year (before lock down) and that bus doesn't hang around, certainly over 60mph according to the speedcheck GPS app in my phone

These buses I think reach 64mph

 

[37114]

Slightly off topic but I remember being told that old B58s with manual boxes could defeat the limiter by staying out of top gear, always wondered if it was true. I'd imagine they had the grunt for it!

Probably true, the earlier limiters were mechanical rather than the electronic ones today. The Limiter also doesn't work going downhill or in neutral.

All sorts of old wives tales to defeat limiters but at the end of the day they it is an offence to break the speed limit and a bigger offence to tamper with it.

 

[ValleyLines142]

I was on the 278 in London a few weeks ago and it felt very nippy! Abellio use a mixture of diesel E400MMCs and E400H MMCs. I was on the latter (which of course states why). But I've been on other hybrids across the country that crawl along!

 

[jp4712]

The Standerwick Bristol VRLL6L coaches of the early 1970s were good for well over 80, considerably faster than some of the contemporary Vauxhall Viva and Austin 1100 cars could do. Their reputation for instability was a bit undeserved, there was a famous overturn incident but it was caused by a violent swerve to avoid a collision that might well have overturned a single decker.

 

[Mikey C]

I've been on Darts which outside of town go on NSL roads (60 mph) and they've no problem at going along at 50odd, but are dreadfully noisy, it would be like cruising in your car in 3rd gear