Favourite ScotRail class of EMU?

[westralian]

My usual commute is on the Argyle line so I'm regularly on 318s and 320s and I do not like them at all. The narrow aisles mean that when it is at standing capacity people are hesitant to move into them away from the vestibules, which in turn delays boarding and makes the vestibule areas packed when there is sufficient aisle space along the carriage. Thankfully I can time my commute to get one of the low level Carstairs or one of the 'express' Larkhall services which skips both stations between my local and Argyle Street.

The sooner they are gone, the better! The occasional 334 is such a luxury as it's far more spacious.

 

[Scotrail12]

My usual commute is on the Argyle line so I'm regularly on 318s and 320s and I do not like them at all. The narrow aisles mean that when it is at standing capacity people are hesitant to move into them away from the vestibules, which in turn delays boarding and makes the vestibule areas packed when there is sufficient aisle space along the carriage. Thankfully I can time my commute to get one of the low level Carstairs or one of the 'express' Larkhall services which skips both stations between my local and Argyle Street.

The sooner they are gone, the better! The occasional 334 is such a luxury as it's far more spacious.

I believe that there are 2 334 diagrams on the Argyle - one of them is on here somewhere.

As for the 318's and 320's on rush hour Argyle routes, I can definitely agree with you there. Aside from the issue of people not moving into the aisles, those services are just so busy and not well suited at all for a 318 or 320. I took the 1608 out of Argyle Street a handful of times which is the beginning of rush hour. Only 3 carriages and totally rammed each time, was not at all pleased to see how busy it was as I was travelling to Coatbridge Central. Barely any standing space, was really crammed in until Newton.

 

[snookertam]

When ScotRail make their next procurement of electric units they would do worse than to have a modern version of the 314 and similar variants down in England. I've always liked the idea of the 379 units that London Overground have with the wide and open internal gangway style with inward facing seating, and could be ideal for the Cathcart and Paisley Canal lines, but ScotRail are unlikely to order a dedicated sub fleet for that purpose.

When the Class 318s and 320s are replaced, they will likely order a fleet for the whole of the Argyle line and North Clyde routes (inc. Bathgate), resulting in class 334 units returning south of the river to cover the Cathcart & Canal routes.

 

[Scotrail12]

When ScotRail make their next procurement of electric units they would do worse than to have a modern version of the 314 and similar variants down in England. I've always liked the idea of the 379 units that London Overground have with the wide and open internal gangway style with inward facing seating, and could be ideal for the Cathcart and Paisley Canal lines, but ScotRail are unlikely to order a dedicated sub fleet for that purpose.

When the Class 318s and 320s are replaced, they will likely order a fleet for the whole of the Argyle line and North Clyde routes (inc. Bathgate), resulting in class 334 units returning south of the river to cover the Cathcart & Canal routes.

Would be nice to finally see a new rolling stock on the Argyle & North Clyde routes rather than them always going to Ayrshire. That said, there was a document from 2005 which stated that 334's would overheat if on Cathcart all day. Maybe they will need to diagram them alongside Inverclyde and hopefully EK & Barrhead which would allow them a bit of time to go faster.

I wonder if a metro style train would work better for Cathcart. The Overground and S-stock type trains could actually work quite well IMO. I can't see why they wouldn't order a fleet for that area though, they need something to operate it and it would be better to have custom built trains to serve that route rather than using various leftover trains from other lines or wasting the likes of 334's, 380's and 385's on it which are far better suited to longer distance journeys.

 

[cj_1985]

I used to love travelling on 334s to Glasgow and Edinburgh when on the lanark/motherwell services.... they were modern, spacious and comfortable.

But now, I'll happily settle for a 318/320 over a 380 or 385 any day.

 

[cj_1985]

When ScotRail make their next procurement of electric units they would do worse than to have a modern version of the 314 and similar variants down in England. I've always liked the idea of the 379 units that London Overground have with the wide and open internal gangway style with inward facing seating, and could be ideal for the Cathcart and Paisley Canal lines, but ScotRail are unlikely to order a dedicated sub fleet for that purpose.

Not to be too pernickety, but I think you mean the 378s... the 379s are almost identical to the SE/Southern 375 and 377 fleets. Save for them only (so far) having a pantograph

The 376s are pretty good at swallowing passengers. Even if a bit older than the 378s

 

[Royston Vasey]

365s

 

[GlitterUnicorn]

I wonder if a metro style train would work better for Cathcart. The Overground and S-stock type trains could actually work quite well IMO. I can't see why they wouldn't order a fleet for that area though, they need something to operate it and it would be better to have custom built trains to serve that route rather than using various leftover trains from other lines or wasting the likes of 334's, 380's and 385's on it which are far better suited to longer distance journeys.

Problem is that they'd inevitably end up being used on longer routes where they're not really suitable?

 

[380101]

The inverter electronics - converts 750V DC to three phase AC for the motors.

25kV AC for a 380 not 750V DC

 

[jopsuk]

25kV AC for a 380 not 750V DC

ah, no. It is from 750DC. There's a rectifier converts the 25kV 50Hz single phase AC into 750V smoothed DC (all voltages nominal), and then a rectifier turns that into variable voltage variable frequency for the three phase AC traction motors

 

[380101]

ah, no. It is from 750DC. There's a rectifier converts the 25kV 50Hz single phase AC into 750V smoothed DC (all voltages nominal), and then a rectifier turns that into variable voltage variable frequency for the three phase AC traction motors

I see. Never knew that and I've been driving the things for 8 years! Did know it was three phase AC that causes the motor noise with the frequencies changing as it accelerates/brakes.

 

[jopsuk]

I see. Never knew that and I've been driving the things for 8 years! Did know it was three phase AC that causes the motor noise with the frequencies changing as it accelerates/brakes.

very difficult to directly convert a single phase supply to three phase smoothly and directly, thus the DC link. 750DC because it means the power electronics can be standard across all UK classes and thus wiring in dual voltage is easy

 

[37057]

ah, no. It is from 750DC. There's a rectifier converts the 25kV 50Hz single phase AC into 750V smoothed DC (all voltages nominal), and then a rectifier turns that into variable voltage variable frequency for the three phase AC traction motors

Almost, the 25kV goes through the main transformer primary winding then straight to the rail head via axle brushes. The secondary windings feed the traction converters with around 460Vac. Inside the traction converter, the four quadrant chopper gives you the 750Vdc which feeds the inverter, which then powers each three phase traction motor (four on each motor car) upto around 600v, if I remember correctly.

The classic Desiro EMU traction converter is probably the only decent thing on the unit. Certainly very clean inside being liquid cooled.

 

[route101]

318s and 320s are very cramped when full!

 

[Aictos]

I prefer the Class 380 bear in mind I've not used a Class 318/320 simply because I find them comfy, they do the job pretty well and they fly like manure off a shovel well they did when first introduced do not sure if still case.

The Class 385s have the luxury of USB sockets, power sockets and WiFi but I think most units have that anyway? Indeed the Class 158 I saw last year was so fitted. One idea I do like about the Class 385s is the priority seats have a different seat covering so it's obvious with the rest of the seating in Saltire colours.

 

[Jamesrob637]

Ha. It seems like I went with the majority on the 380. However I did like the 385 too. The 334 was okay structurally but had a slightly tatty interior. BR-era units should be starting to go to the scrappers à la 314.

 

[route101]

365s

I did like them , good seating layout too

 

[D365]

365s

I did like them , good seating layout too

Long may they last on the Great Northern!

 

[delt1c]

Why Not include the 303 ( pre and post refurb)and 311, after all the 314's were withdrawn before this poll, I am sure the result would be different

 

[fgwrich]

365s

Actually I've got to agree with you there. Would have been perfect with a ScotRail refurb for the Dunblane and Edinburgh / Glasgow via Cumbernauld services. Shame to see them parked up in Crewe now with no certain future.

 

[thenorthern]

I know they haven't been in service for 18 years but it has to be the Class 303 "Blue Train" sure they haven't been in service for 18 years now and they were old and full of Asbestos but they were a classic feature of Glasgow life.

 

[reddragon]

Class 303 wins, poll fails!

 

[Neptune]

Why Not include the 303 ( pre and post refurb)and 311, after all the 314's were withdrawn before this poll, I am sure the result would be different

In that case you can add 305’s and 322’s into it too.

 

[delt1c]

In that case you can add 305’s and 322’s into it too.

Quite true forgot about them

 

[reddragon]

In that case you can add 305’s and 322’s into it too.

Technically 305s were Great Eastern Units and 322s Stansted express units just borrowed by Scotrail.

 

[Neptune]

Technically 305s were Great Eastern Units and 322s Stansted express units just borrowed by Scotrail.

Really?

305’s were taken on by Regional Railways Scotrail for the North Berwick electrification in the same way the 308’s were taken on by RRNE for Leeds NW electrification pending replacement. Both classes had been displaced by newer units in East Anglia And would have been scrapped otherwise.

The 322’s were likewise taken initially on loan from WAGN (to enable withdrawal of the 305’s) then eventually came back permanently after the class 90 + mk3 period. They were even refurbished and repainted by FSR until replacement by the 380’s. Certainly the 322’s had been replaced by 317/7’s on Stansted by then.

Id say both classes were permanent members of the Scotrail fleet, albeit for a shorter period than most.

 

[reddragon]

Really?

305’s were taken on by Regional Railways Scotrail for the North Berwick electrification in the same way the 308’s were taken on by RRNE for Leeds NW electrification pending replacement. Both classes had been displaced by newer units in East Anglia And would have been scrapped otherwise.

The 322’s were likewise taken initially on loan from WAGN (to enable withdrawal of the 305’s) then eventually came back permanently after the class 90 + mk3 period. They were even refurbished and repainted by FSR until replacement by the 380’s. Certainly the 322’s had been replaced by 317/7’s on Stansted by then.

Id say both classes were permanent members of the Scotrail fleet, albeit for a shorter period than most.

Class 305s, 71 3/4 car units Great Eastern 1960-1990s, small batch to Manchester fora few years, tiny handful to Scotrail for a few years. They are still Great Eastern units of which a small number spend a couple of years in Scotland at the end.

 

[Neptune]

Class 305s, 71 3/4 car units Great Eastern 1960-1990s, small batch to Manchester fora few years, tiny handful to Scotrail for a few years. They are still Great Eastern units of which a small number spend a couple of years in Scotland at the end.

Exactly the same situation as the 320/4’s in the original poll then.

 

[D365]

Exactly the same situation as the 320/4’s in the original poll then.

Not quite, the 321/4s were (for the majority) built new for the WCML. If the ScotRail 320/4s spent any time on the Great Eastern, it was temporary at best.

 

[Neptune]

Not quite, the 321/4s were (for the majority) built new for the WCML. If the ScotRail 320/4s spent any time on the Great Eastern, it was temporary at best.

I wasn’t saying that the SR 320/4’s as built were for the GE in the same way that the 322’s weren’t built for the GE but for the Stansted services on the West Anglia main line.

I was comparing them as ‘not being built for SR services but ending up there’.