FCC Notice of intention to prosecute

[cessna]

The other week I took a First Capital Connect train from Kings Cross to Peterborough, the 00:36 service. I had a standard class ticket and as I boarded the train I grabbed the first seat that came to view, a first class seat. I knew it was first class and I know I was in the wrong but often taking late trains I didn't expect a ticket inspector to come through the train. Well he did, with a few British Transport cops. I was told I would be issued a penalty fare in the region of £82 (I can't remember the exact amount). I initially said I wouldn't pay but after hearing my options of either going to court or paying the fine I choose to pay the fine.

I was told that I would have three weeks to pay the fine and the copper and inspector took down my details. Now I've just receieved a letter telling me FCC intend to take me to court.

What the hell is going on here? I phoned them up straight away and was told penalty fares are normally paid on the spot. Why was I not informed of this on the train.

I've sent the enclosed form back telling them my side of the story.

Does anyone know what the likely otcome is? The last thing I wanted was for this to go to court.

Cheers

 

[ainsworth74]

Does anyone know what the likely otcome is? The last thing I wanted was for this to go to court.

You don't have a leg to stand on sorry! You had a standard class ticket in first, if they want to prosecute you then that's their prerogative. Harsh perhaps (seeing as you could have just been penalty fared) but those is the rules.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

So did you pay the fine? tbh if you knowingly sit in a designated 1st class area, you are inviting this upon your self. You cannot take the risk of 'there may be a RPi onboard, there may be not' attitude.

 

[cessna]

I know I was in the wrong, I'm not denying that. However, I was given an option of taking the matter to court or paying the penalty fare. I didn't realise you pay the fine on the spot as the inspector never told me this. I assumed I would recieve a letter in the post and then have the option to either go to court or pay the fine.

 

[scotsman]

They have every right to prosecute you, you were very naive and, dare I say it, stupid to sit in a 1st Class seat and not expect a ticket inspector to check your ticket.

What makes you think you are different from everyone else anyway, is standing too good for you?

 

[MidnightFlyer]

^^^^^^^^^^^ Would you have to stand on the 0036 KGX-PBO?

 

[mumrar]

If you were fined, and subsequently have not paid it, having known you were in wrong all along, and also knowing why you were given the fine, what are you compaining about? You've been legitimately fined, and after 21 days of failing to pay, FCC are going to take you to court for the money. Pretty cut and dry really, do pop back to let us know how much your laziness has cost you when it's all finished though.

 

[cessna]

Mate, I know I was stupid for sitting there. It was late, I was tired and I took the first seat I came too. I don't think I'm better than anyone, I take the train fairly often unfortunately and nearly always stand. This was a stupid little mistake.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

If you were fined, and subsequently have not paid it, having known you were in wrong all along, and also knowing why you were given the fine, what are you compaining about? You've been legitimately fined, and after 21 days of failing to pay, FCC are going to take you to court for the money. Pretty cut and dry really, do pop back to let us know how much your laziness has cost you when it's all finished though.

This happened a week ago. I was never given the opportunity to pay the fine.

 

[cessna]

But you had 21 days to pay it. Of course they will take legal action...

NO I DIDN'T. This happened a week ago.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Let's look at the facts:
You sat in a first class seat with a standard ticket, taking the risk that an RPI wouldn't come through.
They did, and with 2 policemen, you got caught
You were offered a penalty fare, or court straight away.
You choose the penalty fare, but didn't pay it within the required time.
Now you are being prosecuted.

I don't really see what FCC did wrong here?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
To be honest, whatever the time limit I doubt they will listen to you. It's their prerogative to take you to court, and they have.

 

[cessna]

Because I was told I had THREE WEEKS to pay the penalty fare.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

You choose the penalty fare, but didn't pay it within the required time.

I'll say it, avoid him/her typing it again: this happened a week ago.

EDIT AFTER POSTING - too late

No need to type in block caps to me, you stated initailly that this had only happened a week ago at the same time I posted my post, so I never actually read it.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Because I was told I had THREE WEEKS to pay the penalty fare.

See my second post. If FCC want to take you to court, they can.

 

[cessna]

So why did they tell me I had an option?

Anyone know what the potential outcome of this will be? Fine? Criminal record?

 

[MidnightFlyer]

So why did they tell me I had an option?

Anyone know what the potential outcome of this will be? Fine? Criminal record?

Both of those you listed I think, I forget the third one, if it exists.........

 

[ralphchadkirk]

So why did they tell me I had an option?

Anyone know what the potential outcome of this will be? Fine? Criminal record?

I don't know, that is possibly the bit that could get you out a court appearance.

 

[cessna]

The last thing I want is a criminal record that will stop me getting a job in the future over something so petty.

 

[cessna]

Thanks, I'll try that. I'm not denying I was at fault. What I do think is wrong though is the fact I was given the option, I said I wouldpay the fine and then a few days letter they tell me they want to take me to court. If they had said I was going to court all along I wouldn't have a problem.

 

[Mojo]

I believe the main issue at hand here is the fact that you were told that you could pay a Penalty Fare.

Were you given a Penalty Fare notice or any other documentation?

 

[scotsman]

It may appear that I have no sympathy for fare evaders, quite simply, because I don't. I've had enough with people sitting in 1st Class and feigning ignorance when it's blatantly obvious it's 1st Class.

 

[90019]

One thing jumps out at me having read through all the posts so far, something that seems to have been completely ignored.

You've been legitimately fined, and after 21 days of failing to pay, FCC are going to take you to court for the money.

But you had 21 days to pay it. Of course they will take legal action...

Really?

This happened a week ago.

Maybe it's just me, but last time i checked, a week wasn't 21 days long.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

This was a mistake, a stupid one I admit. Pleasant with members? Have I been rude? As opposed to some people's attitudes here of "good, hope you go down and suffer".

Did I say you had to be all three? The 'caring bunch you lot are comment' I take as unpleasent FYI

 

[cessna]

Thank you 90019, I thought it was just me.

 

[swt_passenger]

So did you pay the fine?

You can't 'pay the fine' at the time. It is a Penalty Fare at that stage of the procedure.

To pay a fine the case has to involve a court, even if you don't actually attend.

It may seem pedantic, but it makes it clearer if posts refer to Penalty Fares if that's what they mean.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

You can't 'pay the fine' at the time. It is a Penalty Fare at that stage of the procedure.

To pay a fine the case has to involve a court, even if you don't actually attend.

It may seem pedantic, but it makes it clearer if posts refer to Penalty Fares if that's what they mean.

Soory, I meant 'fare', I stand corrected

 

[cessna]

What's the difference between a penalty fare and a penalty fine then, if any?

 

[MidnightFlyer]

What's the difference between a penalty fare and a penalty fine then, if any?

None, me getting a penalty fare, the thing you were issued with on the train, and a fina, which you would be given in court, mixed up

My 1,500th post

 

[ralphchadkirk]

They never mentioned it was only 1 week ago at the time of both posts you highlighted

It was in the first post.

 

[nedchester]

Seems quite a few unsympathetic people here.

Let's look at things, OP gets gripped (correctly) for sitting in FC. He is tired, maybe a little 'under the influence'. He refuses to pay the Penalty Far possible because he doesn't have the money. Inspectors issue him with a Penalty notice (as they should??) I think you are given three weeks to pay? So why has the threat of court action happened so quickly??

Or he refused to pay and was issued with a unpaid fare notice? Again surely three weeks to pay?

Or am I missing something???

Have to say some people on here are a right 'self righteous' lot. I wish I was as perfect as you?!!!

 

[Mojo]

What's the difference between a penalty fare and a penalty fine then, if any?

There is no such thing as a penalty fine. The two words do not go together.

Fines are issued by courts for those found guilty of a criminal offence. Penalty Fares are issued by Authorised Penalty Fare Collectors for those found without a valid ticket in certain circumstances, in a Penalty Fares area and on a Penalty Fares train, or in a Compulsory Ticket Area.

I can't really help you until you answer my question above. Were you given a Penalty Fares Notice or any other documentation at the time? What was it?