FCC sent me notice of intention to prosecute

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SteveJ444

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Hi..I've just received a notice of intention to prosecute from First Capital Connect threatening all sorts of penalties and I'm just wondering what my options (if any) are...The facts are that I had to run for the train and jumped on it at Preston Park station travelling to Haywards Heath (without a ticket) as the train was departing that second with the intention of buying one on the train as I have before with Southern. I remember as I jumped on the train an official looking guy standing at the station was staring at me and jumped on the train himself at the same time. I walked up and down the train looking for an inspector but couldn't find one and then saw the same guy (who I took to be an inspector) talking to three other passengers...I then walked up to him with the intention of buying a ticket. It was obvious when I reached him that he was taking the details of these other passengers so I stood patiently and waited for him to finish. When he finished I asked him if I could buy a ticket from him and he said that they don't sell tickets on the train. I mentioned that I had to jump on the train at the last second and he admitted that he'd seen me. I also mentioned that in similar circumstances before Id bought tickets on southern trains with no problems but he mentioned that this was not possible on FCC and then pointed out the sticker to that effect on the window. When he was taking my details he kind of gave me the impression that he was sympathetic to what had happened as he'd seen me jump on the train at the last second, but obviously this hasn't been case. FCC have sent me an A4 sheet to write down what happened. Is there anything else I can add to the facts which may help in this case or is this likely to end up in court? Thanks in advance for any help. S
 
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LexyBoy

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Welcome to the forum. Please have a look at these other threads where people have received such letters (usually from FCC), you will find the advice there relevant to your situation.

If you could also let us know which acts FCC intends to prosecute under that would be of use to our resident experts. When did the incident occur, and when did you receive the letter? Have you had any legal trouble or Penalty Fares from the railway before?

It is most likely to be a Byelaw 18 notice, which you are guilty of by your own account. This charge carries no suggestion that you were intending to avoid payment, so there is no defence in your statement that you attempted to buy a ticket from the RPI. Assuming it is a first offence, FCC are likely to accept an out of court settlement - the helpful folk here will be able to assist, but first we'll need further details.
 

lyndhurst25

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The rules as to whether or not you are allowed to buy a ticket on the train or not, and how rigidly they are enforced, vary from one part of the National Rail network to another. The network may be National but the rules aren't and as a consequence passengers are often caught out. What is the norm on Northern may well get you issued with an Intention to Prosecute on FCC. Pointing out a notice on the train after you have boarded isn't really fair. Were there adequate notices at Preston Park station stating that it is in a Penalty Fare zone and that tickets are not sold on trains?
 

ralphchadkirk

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He wasn't given a penalty fare so
I can't see how that is relevant?

It seems to me to be a clear byelaw 18 breach.


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SteveJ444

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Thanks for the replies...the incident occured on 31st March in the evening and I got the letter today. The letter makes no mention of any act just that the alleged offence is 'failing to hand over a rail ticket for inspection'. I have no previous penalty fares issues or legal history at all with the railways. With regards to signs etc at Preston Park I literally ran up the steps onto the platform and straight on the train so didnt have time to look...wish I'd just missed it now...
 

lyndhurst25

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I am aware that Byelaw 18 exists but can someone explain in what circumstances it can be used? The National Rail Conditions of Carriage section on tickets states -

2. Requirement to hold a ticket
Before you travel you must have a ticket or other authority to travel which is valid for the train(s) you intend to use and for the journey you intend to make.
If you travel in a train: (a) without a ticket; or (b) the circumstances described in any of Conditions 10, 11, 12, 18, 19, 22, 30, 35 and 39 apply;
you will be liable to pay the full single fare or full return fare or, if appropriate, a Penalty Fare (see Condition 4) for your journey. You will not be entitled to any discounts or special terms unless either:.......


Doesn't this cover the OP's circumstances exactly and consequently shouldn't he be liable for the cost of an undiscounted ticket to his destination of a Penalty Fare?
If I wanted to know what is and isn't allowed regarding buying train tickets then I'd consult the NRCoC and that would be the end of it. I wouldn't know how to go searching for byelaws that may trump what the NRCoC says.
 
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LexyBoy

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The letter makes no mention of any act just that the alleged offence is 'failing to hand over a rail ticket for inspection'.
That will be Byelaw 18(2) then.

I am aware that Byelaw 18 exists but can someone explain in what circumstances it can be used? The National Rail Conditions of Carriage section on tickets states [...]
The trouble here is that no contract has been entered into, so the NRCoC doesn't apply. I couldn't say whether Byelaw 18 could be used if a valid ticket cannot be shown but where a ticket has been purchased (and thus contract involving NRCoC entered into), for example in deviating from a Permitted Route or travelling beyond your destination.
 

island

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Unfortunately this is an open and shut case. You have very clearly violated the above-mentioned byelaw. Being late is not an excuse for choosing not to purchase a ticket before travelling, like most other passengers on the train have done.

Others will be here soon to better inform you of the next steps, but if you haven't been previously involved in similar activities then it is usually possible to offer a sum of money towards FCC's administrative expenses and lost revenue in the matter and it will not be taken further.
 

jon0844

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Why doesn't FCC stop issuing PFs completely and just use this byelaw, as it must get them quite a lot more money.
 

lyndhurst25

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Why doesn't FCC stop issuing PFs completely and just use this byelaw, as it must get them quite a lot more money.
Don't give them ideas!

If LexyBoy's point about no contract having been entered into is correct then I'd say that the wording NRCoC is misleading people into a false sense of security about being able to buy on-board or at their destination.

In my experience Northern guards are quite happy to sell tickets on-board (and sometimes offer discounted fares too) despite boarding at a station with a ticket-office or machine. A northerner travelling down south and expecting the same treatment then risks being prosecuted under Byelaw 18 for doing exactly the same thing on FCC.
 

DaveNewcastle

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I agree with island that the Byelaw 18 Offence has technically been detected and that you are now being asked to supply any further Evidence to assist the Company in deciding how to progress its investigation following the Inspector's report.

It is also correct that if there is no prior record of Fare Evasion (or other offence) then there is scope for a settlement being agreed.
It would be appropriate for you to reply with an honest report of the matter and, if it is true, an apology for being so hasty and unwittingly violated the Railway's Laws and that you have certainly learned a lesson from the experience. You should add any explanation of any particular special circumstances.

You may add that you would be pleased to compensate the Company for its administrative effort and you could follow up that proposal with a phone call in a couple of weeks.

I advise you not to be confused by lyndhurst25's references to the policy of Northern Rail (and other operators and/or at other locations) as reference to those policies simply will not assist the assessment of your incident unless (and I'm sure this is not applicable) you were a regular traveller on Northern Rail and this was your first time in FCC land.
 

lyndhurst25

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I wasn't suggesting that the OP used Northern's policy to try and appease FCC and I know that what FCC are doing is to the letter of the law. I'm just trying to point out that it is very easy to be caught out if you aren't familiar with different TOC's local policies.

I still think that the NRCoC could be misleading (paraphrasing): "If you travel without a ticket then you will have to pay the full single fare or a Penalty Fare" BUT since you haven't bought a ticket than you aren't covered by this condition and you could (depending on the TOC's unwritten local policy / the mood of the RPI) be prosecuted under a byelaw that is written elsewhere and not mentioned in the NRCoC.

I can only think that this clause would help someone who bought a ticket, lost it and could not show it on board, got prosecuted under Byelaw 18, and later found the ticket. Is that the idea?
 

SteveJ444

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Hi...thanks for all the replies, you've been very helpfull. I suppose one of my biggest concerns is, is this intention to prosecute going to be recorded anywhere? I suppose that hangs on what course of action FCC decide to take though and the outcome?
 

DaveNewcastle

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The "Intention to Prosecute" will be recorded only internally (i.e. within the Company's own records and will tie up with this incident if you are detected in a comparable situation in future).

If you achieve a settlement with the Company, then again, it will only be on the Company's internal files.

If you fail to reach a settlement and it proceeds to a Court, it will surely succeed (due to the 'strict liability' nature of a Byelaw Offence) but it should not appear on any Criminal Record or on the Police National Computer (PNC). I say 'should not' though on occasion, these prosecutions have inadvertently done so.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
. . . a byelaw that is written elsewhere and not mentioned in the NRCoC. . . .
The NRCoC refers to the Byelaws right at the beginning. See Section 1, A. 1 Your Contract:
Each ticket is issued subject to:
(a) these Conditions;
(b) the applicable byelaws;
(c) the conditions which apply to Electronic Tickets, Smartcards, other
devices used for storing Electronic Tickets . . . etc
And then, the effect of Byelaw 18 (to which we are referring) is paraphased in Section 1, A. 2 Requirement to Hold a Ticket
Before you travel you must have a ticket or other authority to travel which is valid for the
train(s) you intend to use and for the journey you intend to make.
 
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jon0844

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I think most people would, if reading the warning signs, expect to have to pay twice the single fare or a penalty fare if caught.

Now if you were in a real rush, you might be prepared to pay this in order to not miss a train. You might seek out a RPI/guard or stop to pay at the destination. At this point, there's not necessarily any intent to defraud.

But if there's a catch-all offence that allows for a prosecution, why have penalty fares at all? Simply prosecute everyone unless they can prove they didn't have any opportunity to buy a ticket (ticket machine broken, station closed etc).
 

lyndhurst25

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Section 1, A. 1 Your Contract:
Each ticket is issued subject to:
(a) these Conditions;
(b) the applicable byelaws;
(c) the conditions which apply to Electronic Tickets, Smartcards, other
devices used for storing Electronic Tickets . . . etc


In this case no ticket has been issued and where to find these byelaws is not divulged.


Section 1, A. 2 Requirement to Hold a Ticket
Before you travel you must have a ticket or other authority to travel which is valid for the train(s) you intend to use and for the journey you intend to make.


And the very next sentence says that -

If you travel in a train:
(a)without a ticket; or
(b)the circumstances described in any of Conditions 10, 11, 12, 18, 19, 22,
30, 35 and 39 apply;
you will be liable to pay the full single fare or full return fare or, if appropriate, a Penalty Fare (see Condition 4) for your journey.


I'd still say that the NRCoC are misleading. Maybe we need to call a lawyer....;)
 

SteveJ444

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I did ask the guy at the first opportunity on the train if I could buy a ticket, but that was not possible...from memory nothing was mentioned about penalty fares...he just took my details
 

jon0844

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Yes, I think they better, and quite quickly as I'm sure someone will use this as a defence sooner or later. You'd expect that a website operated by a TOC is a good place to seek out such rules, beyond other things that might not be instantly or easily available to read.

It seems like they're going for a lot more prosecutions using this byelaw, going by the number of similar threads on this forum. As a result, they really should make it clear that a penalty fare is not the only thing you can expect.

It makes things even more crazy that someone on a train I was on was asked why they didn't buy a ticket and given a PF even after saying they didn't buy a ticket because the gates were open and they didn't think they'd get caught! To me that was clear intent to avoid paying.

In case they do amend any text, this is what is posted as of today:

We run a Penalty Fares Scheme on First Capital Connect routes. You must buy a valid train ticket (or Permit to Travel) for the whole journey you are making before you get on a train at any rail station served by First Capital Connect.

If you do not have a valid ticket or Permit to Travel, you may have to pay a Penalty Fare of £20 or twice the full single fare to the next stop, whichever is the greater, plus the full single fare to complete your journey. Penalty Fares do not apply from Crews Hill station.

First Capital Connect has been authorised to charge Penalty Fares by the Strategic Rail Authority in line with the Railways Act 1993 (as amended by the Transport Act 2000, the Penalty Fares Regulations 1994 and the Penalty Fares Rules 2002). The aim of the Penalty Fares Scheme is to reduce the number of passengers who travel without train tickets.

Why is a Penalty Fare Scheme necessary?
Penalty Fares are in place to encourage passengers to buy their train tickets before travelling. Even if only a small percentage of passengers travel without paying, substantial sums of money are put at risk. Reducing the number of passengers who do not pay is not only in the interest of First Capital Connect, but also for our fare paying passengers.

What methods of payment can I use to pay a Penalty Fare?
You can use cash, a cheque (supported by a cheque guarantee card), Visa, MasterCard, American Express, Diners Club, Switch or Delta. However, we do not accept Solo or Electron cards.

If I do not buy a train ticket before travelling, is it an automatic Penalty Fare?
You are responsible for ensuring that you buy a train ticket that is valid for your entire journey before travelling, otherwise you may have to pay a Penalty Fare.

If there is a queue at the ticket office can I board the train without a valid ticket?
No. It is your responsibility to allow yourself sufficient time to buy a ticket before travelling. Automatic self-service ticket machines are provided at all stations as an additional method of buying a train ticket. Tickets can also be bought in advance of travel from ticket offices or online.

Can I pay at my destination if I am in a rush?
No. If you board a train without a valid ticket, then you may have to pay a Penalty Fare.

What if the ticket office is closed, or the station does not have a ticket office and the automatic self-service ticket machines are out of order?
At most locations there is more than one self-service ticket machine and these are regularly maintained so it would be unusual for there to be no self-service ticket machines available for you to use.

At stations where there is only one self-service ticket machine there is a further automatic machine called a Permit to Travel machine. This is normally located near the station entrance / exit or beside other self-service machines. You should insert the maximum number of coins you have with you into the Permit to Travel machine, up to the value of your journey. Press the button and you will be issued with a Permit to Travel.

This permit must be exchanged for a valid train ticket at your first opportunity, be that on the train or at your destination and in any case within two hours. You will be given credit for the amount you paid for the permit when you exchange it for a valid ticket. If the ticket office is closed or not available and the self-service ticket machines or the Permit to Travel machine is not working then you will not be charged a Penalty Fare.

What if I want to buy a Season Ticket and the ticket office is closed?
Provided that you have a photocard, you can buy a Weekly Season Ticket from the automatic self-service ticket machines. However, if you wish to buy a monthly or longer Season Ticket, you should buy a single ticket for your destination or a Permit to Travel and then buy your Season Ticket at your destination. The cost of your single ticket or Permit to Travel will be deducted from the cost of your Season Ticket.

What should I do if I have forgotten my Season Ticket and / or photocard?
There are times when customers do leave their season tickets at home, at FCC we understand the frustration this can cause.

When you arrive at the station you should (before boarding a train) purchase a ticket for the journey you are undertaking. Keep the tickets because you can claim a full refund on production of your valid season ticket, at the ticket office where you purchased your season ticket.

Note: Only two such refund applications will be considered in a 12 month period and you may be charged an administration fee.

What if I discover that I have forgotten my Season Ticket and / or photocard once I have boarded the train?
If you board a train without a valid ticket and are approached by one of our Revenue Protection Inspectors you will be asked to provide your personal details i.e. name, address etc - which will be verified with a quick telephone call.

You will then be asked to either pay the standard single fare for your journey (which will be refunded on production of your valid season ticket), if you have no money then it will be a 'nil paid' penalty fare.

You must then send a copy of your valid season ticket to the address shown on the penalty fare. If you fail to do this within 21 days of receipt of the penalty fare you will be asked to pay the full amount (which will be twice the standard day single or £20, whichever is the greater) for the journey undertaken.

What if I have bought a discounted ticket with a Railcard, but cannot produce the Railcard on the actual journey?
You are liable to pay a Penalty Fare, as the discounted ticket is only valid on production of the Railcard.

What happens if I travel beyond my normal destination?
It is your responsibility to buy any additional train tickets required to make your original ticket valid for your entire journey before travelling; otherwise you may have to pay a Penalty Fare.

If I have a Standard Class ticket, but sit in First Class, as the train is busy, will I receive a Penalty Fare?
As your ticket is not valid in First Class accommodation you may have to pay a Penalty Fare of £20 or twice the First Class Single fare to the next stop (whichever is the greater), plus a First Class Single from there to your destination.

However, depending on the circumstances, you may be liable to prosecution instead. If you wish to travel in First Class, then you must buy a valid First Class ticket or an upgrade before travelling.

Who can issue a Penalty Fare?
Any member of staff who has been trained as an Authorised Collector and is carrying an Authorised Collector's ID badge can charge Penalty Fares.

What if I am unable to pay the full amount of the Penalty Fare on the spot?
If you do not have the full amount, then you will be allowed to make a part payment. You are required by law to provide your full name and address at this time. You then have 21 days to pay the remaining amount of the Penalty Fare.

This can be done at any First Capital Connect ticket office or by sending a cheque or postal order to the payment address on the Penalty Fare Notice.

Please include the Penalty Fare Notice with your payment and do not send cash through the post. Failure to provide an Authorised Collector, when asked to do so, with your current name and address, or give a false name and address, is a criminal offence and will lead to prosecution.

Is there a right of appeal against a Penalty Fare?
If you wish to appeal against a Penalty Fare you must put this in writing within 21 days of the issue date and send it to the appeals address shown on the Penalty Fare Notice. The appeals service is independent of the train operating companies and will consider your appeal based on the facts of the case.

Further information

For further information about Penalty Fares on First Capital Connect Limited please contact us via the feedback form.

The above information is intended as a guide only and should not be regarded as a complete or authoritative statement of the law or regulations. Other train operators may have their own Penalty Fares scheme; the above information only covers the stations served by First Capital Connect.
I suppose the last paragraph is the 'get out clause' - although I'd argue that they can't publish all of that and then say 'oh, but it might be wrong' later on. Well, they can but I am sure someone with some legal knowledge would have something to say about it.
 
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DaveNewcastle

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There do appear to be 2 discussions going on simultaneously here.

To lyndhurst25, the regulations have excercised the minds of lawyers for years and are the basis of successful prosecutions in great numbers. Your thoughts on the Regulations perhaps sit more comfortably in this thread : Government and TOCs responsibility wrt PFs, TIRs ,ticketless & invalid ticket travel where criticisms of the Regulations and alternatives are being discussed.

To SteveJ444, the first opportunity to buy would have been one of the opportunities you missed by rushing for the soon-to-depart train. It is a fundamental principle in the detection and prosecution of ticketless travel that an opportunity to pay is not taken - it follows from that that an investigation will follow, which sounds exactly what you experienced.
 

globetrotter

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I've been following this thread and wondering to myself ...

In a situation like that of the OP, supposing for whatever reason I arrive at a penalty fare station and faced with the choice of buying a ticket and waiting (in many cases 30 minutes or even 1 hour) or boarding the train, I decide to board the train and like the OP search the train looking for the conductor so that I can buy a ticket.

What seems to be the consensus here is:
FCC (the TOC in this case) is free to prosecute and the passenger is advised to "compensate the company for its administrative effort"
There is the risk (however small) of the matter somehow ending up as a criminal conviction recorded on the National Police Computer
That although different rail companies have different policies (and some stations have trains operated by three or more TOCs) passengers should somehow be aware of each TOC's exact policy in this regard

My instinct would be, faced with buying a ticket or boarding the train, to get on the train if it was likely, to the best of my knowledge, to be some time before the next train (or meant missing a connection).

Yes, I know we should allow plenty of time (etc.) but we are only human and mistakes, delays, miscalculations happen. And I'd say happen quite often.

So the expert advice is to miss the train, even if it means waiting one hour or missing an onward connection or a meeting or perhaps even a flight? Or face potential prosecution.
 

jon0844

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To SteveJ444, the first opportunity to buy would have been one of the opportunities you missed by rushing for the soon-to-depart train. It is a fundamental principle in the detection and prosecution of ticketless travel that an opportunity to pay is not taken - it follows from that that an investigation will follow, which sounds exactly what you experienced.
Yes. However, people might justifiably get the impression that they'll get a PF or have to pay double, which for certain situations might be preferable to missing the train.

You could argue that intent can only be proven if you waited to see if the person got to the destination, saw nobody there to stop them and walked out. Then you have intent and can prosecute.

Is it easy to prove intent while the journey is still taking place? Probably not, which is why FCC goes for the simple byelaw offence - not producing a ticket. That's fine, but goes against what it says on its own website (and I'd imagine in their penalty fare leaflets given out at stations).

I think it might be a good idea to split this thread up, as I can see a lot of discussion about this that will go beyond helping the OP over what's still a pretty clear cut offence (regardless of the finer details).

So the expert advice is to miss the train, even if it means waiting one hour or missing an onward connection or a meeting or perhaps even a flight? Or face potential prosecution.
Sadly, yes. It seems that with the power to prosecute for a simple case of not producing a ticket, there will be that risk. However, you may have no choice if you absolutely have to be on that train.

What about another possibility? Not a totally unrealistic one either, as it has actually happened (albeit with me having a season ticket, so not affecting me).

You turn up at the station to get a train in plenty of time, but for whatever reason there's disruption and you aren't someone who has checked your National Rail app on your iPhone or signed up for text alerts. The train you planned to get is running late. Very late. Every minute that goes by shows it is as expected one minute later. Will it ever arrive? Will it be cancelled? By the time you get the train, if it does turn up, you're going to be late for that meeting/flight.

But due to the disruption, an earlier train you didn't want to get is also running late and is arriving just now. If you're quick, you might just make it. So you get on without buying a ticket. Would RPIs show discretion here? Well, chances are they would. In many cases, RPIs will act out normal customer service duties - but that's hardly guaranteed. There's no written rules about disruption to suggest you could do anything but buy your ticket as normal and then wait for that delayed train. Now, there's a good chance you'd get prosecuted and not given a penalty fare.
 
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ainsworth74

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I wonder if it wouldn't be prudent to split off some of this discussion to a different thread as I'm not sure it's going to be particularly helpful for the OP and indeed might actually confuse them.
 

SteveJ444

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Hi all...thanks for all the advice above which is really appreciated and has for now answered my main questions. Thanks again S
 

WelshBluebird

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Out of curiosity, I wonder what would happen in a similar situation if it was a station with a much less frequent service (meaning the person would have to wait 2 hours or maybe even more!) or if it was the last train of the day. Would the advice still be to miss the train? Surely common sense should prevail, and if the passenger is trying to pay for a ticket (which apparently the OP was), then they should not be prosecuted?
 

bignosemac

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Yes, I know we should allow plenty of time (etc.) but we are only human and mistakes, delays, miscalculations happen. And I'd say happen quite often.
And many of those mistakes, delays and miscalculations can lead to falling foul of the law in other walks of life. Why should the railways be different?

So the expert advice is to miss the train, even if it means waiting one hour or missing an onward connection or a meeting or perhaps even a flight? Or face potential prosecution.
Yep. The railways are not there to pick up the pieces for your poor planning or any delay that caused you to be late arriving at the station for the train you intended to catch.
 

DaveNewcastle

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There have been several comments on this thread pre-supposing that a passenger arriving at a station just in time to jump on a train without first buying a ticket has only 2 options open to them. i.e. to buy a ticket and wait for the next train (wise), or to jump on board and hope not to be challenged for ticketless-travel (unwise).
There is the 3rd possibility of asking the guard who should be visible on the platform and/or at one end of the train if they may buy on board - it only takes seconds. By asking first, its more likely to be approved and removes the doubt over interpretation. And if refused, puts the passenger in no doubt.
 

jon0844

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And many of those mistakes, delays and miscalculations can lead to falling foul of the law in other walks of life. Why should the railways be different?

The railways are not there to pick up the pieces for your poor planning or any delay that caused you to be late arriving at the station for the train you intended to catch.
Very true, but isn't that what PFs are for? Prosecution is for those deliberately trying to evade paying for their fare.

If using Byelaw 18 is now favoured over penalty fares, then FCC can come out of the PF scheme and just adopt a zero tolerance approach. No ticket > Court (or out of court settlement for £150-200 or whatever). Only those who can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that they couldn't buy a ticket, perhaps showing time stamped and verifiable photos and video to show a TVM didn't accept coins, have paper stock, a malfunctioning screen, or the ticket window was closed with a sign saying 'back in 15 mins'.

If that's the way to go - make it perfectly clear and stop being inconsistent.

There have been several comments on this thread pre-supposing that a passenger arriving at a station just in time to jump on a train without first buying a ticket has only 2 options open to them. i.e. to buy a ticket and wait for the next train (wise), or to jump on board and hope not to be challenged for ticketless-travel (unwise).
There is the 3rd possibility of asking the guard who should be visible on the platform and/or at one end of the train if they may buy on board - it only takes seconds. By asking first, its more likely to be approved and removes the doubt over interpretation. And if refused, puts the passenger in no doubt.
Not possible on FCC though, as there would be no guard and you'd be a fool to ask someone on the platform!
 

MikeWh

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There is the 3rd possibility of asking the guard who should be visible on the platform and/or at one end of the train if they may buy on board - it only takes seconds. By asking first, its more likely to be approved and removes the doubt over interpretation. And if refused, puts the passenger in no doubt.
Although the trains in question are DOO and may only have RPIs as additional staff. If the doors had started beeping then the RPI would not be in a position to stop the process as that is controlled by the driver.
 

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There is the 3rd possibility of asking the guard who should be visible on the platform and/or at one end of the train if they may buy on board -.
Most FCC services are DOO.

Also, are staff who hold PRIV cards in breach of the FCC "rules" when the type of ticket they require is not available form ticket machines (in cases where the ticket office is closed that is).
 
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