Fight at St Leonards Warrior Square

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by king_walnut, 2 Jul 2019.

  1. king_walnut

    king_walnut Member

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  3. 3rd rail land

    3rd rail land Member

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    They really need to get arrested for behaviour like that. With the video evidence they should be bang to rights and put in front of a judge for affray at the very least.
     
  4. 175mph

    175mph Member

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    Would the charges be affray?
     
  5. Quakkerillo

    Quakkerillo Member

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    Which "They"? Based upon this video, I can't really see what the guy who was being beaten up did wrong, apart from kicking him after they get dragged out from in-between the carriages. I'm not saying he's innocent, but I certainly can't tell what happened before this recording started. From this video solely, it seems to me the white-shirt one is the main culprit.
    If I ended up randomly being beaten up, then I'd also kick someone back when being 'released' from his grasp. Rest of the video it's also the white-shirt one who keeps trying to go after the other, although I must admit it's a bit taunting.
     
  6. 800002

    800002 Member

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    I'm sorry, but i cant resist:-
    If you call it 'warrior square' you're bound to attract that sort of behaviour.

    On a serious note, that behaviour cannot be tolerated, ever. Could they effectively be done for trespassing on the railway line?
     
  7. king_walnut

    king_walnut Member

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    I think there's a law that covers "obstructing the safe passage of a train" but I'm not sure.
     
  8. Saperstein

    Saperstein Member

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    Lucky not to have been killed or seriously injured!

    I hope the train crew reported it to the police.
     
  9. king_walnut

    king_walnut Member

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    Yeah I don't know much about the 171's but I imagine that exhaust stack isn't too pleasant to touch!
     
  10. 800002

    800002 Member

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    I was thinking about that... I saw the exhaust and immediately thought, oh that's alright then, no electrics to worry about (not that they would be on the platform side). I did rather naively assume that it is a diesel track, not exactly knowing where the particular station is located.
     
  11. Saperstein

    Saperstein Member

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    Same as class 170’s apart from the different coupling. But yes not nice to touch I would imagine.

    I was thinking more though if the train moved (but on watching again the doors were open) and of course there is the very real danger of coming into contact with the conductor rail. (Yes I know it’s on the other side of the running rails at stations but people can panic in confined situations).

    Not a nice incident to witness by any means :(

    Saperstein
     
  12. Need2

    Need2 Member

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    St Leonards Wino square as its better known, absolute hell hole of a station. The gatweway to the even better Hastings :D
     
  13. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    Shall we retain some perspective here? It is a simple public order issue of the type the police deal with up and down the country all the time and especially at weekends and have done since Adam was a lad.

    There was no risk to anyone else in that station (shown by the crowd and the fact it was filmed in part) and I would expect those invovled to be identified and prosecuted quickly.

    The most dangerous moment was them falling between the train. That was the only moment of risk.

    Otherwise i saw two drunk chavs dancing about failing to to land a decent punch. I did like the snidy kick mind!

    OBVIOUSLY such behaviour is unacceptable. OBVIOUSLY they need to be dealt with. That should be clear!

    Btw the comment about the "state of some areas" is textbook daily mail. If only we could blame Mayor Khan........
     
  14. Darandio

    Darandio Established Member

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    I couldn't get over the fella with the carrier bag. Must have been an empty bottle of Lambrini in there, surely?
     
  15. Mag_seven

    Mag_seven Established Member

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    No doubt someone in the darkest corners of social media is!
     
  16. Peter C

    Peter C Established Member

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    The following is from the Railway Byelaws:
    (Section 11, Part 1) (Railway Byelaws made under Section 219 of the Transport Act 2000 by the Strategic Rail Authority)

    Also this:
    (Section 6, Part 2) (Railway Byelaws made under Section 219 of the Transport Act 2000 by the Strategic Rail Authority)


    Just thought I might as well note these here. These people definitely obstructed the train. They were definitely disorderly. These are two charges they can be done for.
    And yes, I have a copy of the Railway Byelaws.

    -Peter
     
  17. yorkie

    yorkie Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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    Indeed the person in the white top is clearly the aggressor.
     
  18. AlterEgo

    AlterEgo Veteran Member

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    Reading the comments on that Instagram post lowered my IQ by a few points.
     
  19. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    You dont need an esoteric by law offence here. You need a public order offence.
     
  20. 800002

    800002 Member

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    Do they have public order offences under the railway byelaws / Railways act (or whatever it is called?
     
  21. AlterEgo

    AlterEgo Veteran Member

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    Why would you need one?
     
  22. cactustwirly

    cactustwirly Established Member

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    Like the offences against the person's act?
     
  23. 800002

    800002 Member

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    Not saying one does.
    Was enquiring as to if the acts contain said items.
    It's on the railway, so railway law applies.
     
  24. Darandio

    Darandio Established Member

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    Are you suggesting that UK law doesn't apply on the railway?
     
  25. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    It will be affray I suspect. Easy to prove.
     
  26. DarloRich

    DarloRich Veteran Member

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    That is not correct. You dont need special railway laws for this kind of situation
     
  27. yorkie

    yorkie Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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    But you only need byelaws for specific situations that don't occur elsewhere; is there any need for railway-specific legislation in a case like this?

    It just happens to have occurred at a railway station.
     
  28. hooverboy

    hooverboy Member

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    yup, fighting anywhere is affray/common assault/ABH/GBH(depending on level of injury), irrespective of whether it's on railway property or not.
     
  29. 800002

    800002 Member

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    Erm, no - not at all. Railway byelaws et Al are UK laws / is UK law. Arn't they?


    I didn't mean to imply otherwise. Perhaps I should have re-worded to:- it's on the railway, so railway law should be applied.


    That's is true - I thank you for mentioning your first point there.
    I believe there is a need, yes.
    It is not quite the same as a fight on the footpath spilling onto a road - where vehicular traffic would need to take avoiding action.

    In this particular case, if the train had been on the move / departing, they would have stood next-to-no chance of coming out of that situation without severe injuries (in my own opinion, of which I am unanimous in that). Yes, it's different to being on a roadside - which is why I feel railway specific offences should be considered.

    However, having said that though, i would suggest that effectively duplicating current legislation is ever so slightly needless.

    To summarise:- I was asking if the law has already been duplicated, in whichever format, under the railway law(s) / byelaws.
     
  30. cactustwirly

    cactustwirly Established Member

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    Yeah I agree (all covered under the Offences Against the Person Act 1871)
    Probably would be ABH IMO here
     
  31. cactustwirly

    cactustwirly Established Member

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    No that isn't how Railway Byelaws work, the offences mentioned are likely to be too serious to be punishable through Byelaws, and would need to be tried in the Crown Court
     

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