First class standards worsening on new trains

[gordonthemoron]

I quite like standard on the GWR IEPs, however I walked through 1st to get to the kitchen and it was awful

 

[sw1ller]

Old news done to death. Old rolling stock = lovely, comfort, sophisticated etc. New stock = backward, uncomfortable, crap.

Next.

This type of response on this forum annoys the hell out of me. So what if it’s been done to death as you say. If the thread doesn’t interest you, move along!

 

[Bletchleyite]

It got worse since capital connect is my point. I’d wouldn’t enjoy those seats in standard let alone first. The mersyrail standard is as good as the thameslink first.View attachment 50732

It is, but Merseyrail is used well below capacity most of the time so it needn't cram seats in.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I quite like standard on the GWR IEPs, however I walked through 1st to get to the kitchen and it was awful

I think the Standard "fake wood" is nicer, but the seats are rubbish and that green stripe gives it all the ambiance of a 1990s bus. All in all a civil servant specified interior.

 

[InterCity:125]

I think the Standard "fake wood" is nicer, but the seats are rubbish and that green stripe gives it all the ambiance of a 1990s bus. All in all a civil servant specified interior.

The seats are ‘ergonomically designed’ which is just a fancy way of saying their ironing boards.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The seats are ‘ergonomically designed’ which is just a fancy way of saying their ironing boards.

They aren't ironing boards, which are relatively flat and I don't mind them. They are ergonomically shaped to someone of average height - and actively painful to someone tall.

 

[DarloRich]

yes they are falling. Just the other day I had to share my first class compartment with some dirty proletarian type. In the past I would have had my man thrash within an inch of his life for his impertinence and frankly subversive look. The man was eating some kind of hideous meal in a bag. The savage. Furthermore the communistic guard refused to have the oik removed from my sight. I long for the old days.

Yes standards have gone downhill. Passengers are very low down ( if shown at all) on the list of internal furnishing stakeholders! BTW If you think first is bad come down the back with us mere mortals.

 

[SWTrainspottin]

An issue is they're not allowed to put leather seats in more modern rolling stock because of newer fire regulations.

 

[Fincra5]

When thameslink was take over by govia didn’t know how this could get any worse:
View attachment 50725
But govia found a way:
View attachment 50726

Wasn't the 700 a DaFT Spec?

 

[43096]

An issue is they're not allowed to put leather seats in more modern rolling stock because of newer fire regulations.

You don't need leather seats to make a high quality interior.

 

[gordonthemoron]

An issue is they're not allowed to put leather seats in more modern rolling stock because of newer fire regulations.

how is leather particularly likely to catch fire?

 

[route101]

You don't need leather seats to make a high quality interior.

Dislike leather seats , on LNER/VTEC they changed to leather , you slip and slide .

 

[SWTrainspottin]

You don't need leather seats to make a high quality interior.

I didn't say that. However in this case, a big downside to the first class downgrade is because of the seats.

 

[Bletchleyite]

You don't need leather seats to make a high quality interior.

It's also false; the new TPE units and LHCS will have leather in 1st.

Most "you can't do X in modern stock" turns out to be false;
"You can't have gangways" -> Class 385 etc
"You can't have proper sized luggage racks" -> Desiro and almost everything since
"You can't build new DMUs" -> CAF
Etc etc etc. It's an excuse and nothing but one.

That said, I prefer moquette anyway, ideally with a leather headrest (I find this looks VERY classy).

 

[class26]

You don't need leather seats to make a high quality interior.

and you do not need leather to make seats comfortable. Fire regs is a red herring. The cheapest seat possible has been chosen -simple
What i don`t understand is cars get more and more comfortable and trains go the opposite direction. What motivation is there to get me to leave my jag in the station car park and sit on a park bench and often pay a large sum of money for the privilege ?
The only way these dreadful seats will get changed is if passengers go on strike

 

[Agent_Squash]

When thameslink was take over by govia didn’t know how this could get any worse:
View attachment 50725
But govia found a way:
View attachment 50726

With respect, have you ever actually been in First on the 700s? Plug sockets, and the seats are much better than standard. It's a commuter train, not a Pullman.

It seems you are only here for a moan against privatisation - and you're using a DfT specced train to do it.

 

[Mag_seven]

the new TPE units and LHCS will have leather in 1st.

Oh will they.

 

[sftfan1909]

The problem I see with first class is that some people think it should be a luxury service with others thinking it's a business class/small upgrade from standard. I think these are represented by the difference in the HST and IET first classes. It comes down to your definition of what first class should be.

 

[Doomotron]

To be honest, at this point there is no reason to have first class. Trains are getting fuller and fuller and there aren't enough seats for the extra passengers. Having the extra standard class seats would definitely help out. For example, on my train back from Exeter to London, the first class area was nearly empty. There were about 8 people in it. Standard class on the other hand was full and standing. Those extra seats would have been so useful then. And also, if Britain's government wants equality and all that, why do we have it anyway?

 

[Hadders]

With respect, have you ever actually been in First on the 700s? Plug sockets, and the seats are much better than standard. It's a commuter train, not a Pullman.

It seems you are only here for a moan against privatisation - and you're using a DfT specced train to do it.

1st class in the 700s is acceptable. Standard class most definitely is not.

 

[theking]

As has been said above I think the dumbing down of first class is a way to slowly erode the need for it and when the numbers deminish then turn it into standard.

The railways are busy and there is a finite amount of paths capacity increases and new lines cost money improving the capacity of trains doesn't.

 

[Hadders]

As has been said above I think the dumbing down of first class is a way to slowly erode the need for it and when the numbers deminish then turn it into standard.

The railways are busy and there is a finite amount of paths capacity increases and new lines cost money improving the capacity of trains doesn't.

On the other hand when the 700s were introduced on Great Northern I overheard many commuters commenting that standard had been made so bad to encourage passengers to purchase 1st class tickets!

 

[Ashley Lewis]

If you want to moan about first class, I've never much of a difference between a cross country voyager seat in standard and first class.

 

[Hadders]

If you want to moan about first class, I've never much of a difference between a cross country voyager seat in standard and first class.

Even better - GTR's 387s. 1st class and standard class seats are exactly the same. And ironing boards as well to add insult to injury.

 

[cactustwirly]

Even better - GTR's 387s. 1st class and standard class seats are exactly the same. And ironing boards as well to add insult to injury.

But you get the bonus of an antimacassar and a reading light

 

[cactustwirly]

Personally I prefer leather over moquette, because it's more comfortable and more luxurious.

The 800s are fine, all they need is more padding in the seats, and leather in first class.

 

[greyman42]

To be honest, at this point there is no reason to have first class. Trains are getting fuller and fuller and there aren't enough seats for the extra passengers. Having the extra standard class seats would definitely help out. For example, on my train back from Exeter to London, the first class area was nearly empty. There were about 8 people in it. Standard class on the other hand was full and standing. Those extra seats would have been so useful then. And also, if Britain's government wants equality and all that, why do we have it anyway?

The reason for first class is to raise a lot of extra revenue for the TOC.

 

[Ashley Lewis]

Even better - GTR's 387s. 1st class and standard class seats are exactly the same. And ironing boards as well to add insiult to injury.

I'm pretty sure the XC Voyagers have the same seats.

 

[Hadders]

I'm pretty sure the XC Voyagers have the same seats.

I don't think they do although Virgin have a coach with a 2+2 layout which sometimes is used as an additional 1st class coach at certain times. Not sure if this applies to XC too.

 

[ChilternTurbo]

and you do not need leather to make seats comfortable. Fire regs is a red herring. The cheapest seat possible has been chosen -simple
What i don`t understand is cars get more and more comfortable and trains go the opposite direction. What motivation is there to get me to leave my jag in the station car park and sit on a park bench and often pay a large sum of money for the privilege ?
The only way these dreadful seats will get changed is if passengers go on strike

I totally agree. When the Cornish routes go over to the IET stock, I for one will be driving to Penzance in comfort rather than paying the thick end of £150 each way to sit on a glorified office chair!
Perhaps the downgrading of first class on these routes is actually a ploy to discourage people from booking it by making the offer so poor that nobody bothers to pay the premium anymore. This would then lead to the removal of first class because, well, nobody books it...