• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

First Greater Glasgow

Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Gingerbus1991

Member
Joined
30 Jul 2018
Messages
992
The airport buses are no good to Glasgow due to being fitted with luggage racks the same as the last lot weren’t you also need to remember that when an opco receives new buses others are surplus and it is groups decision what happens to them. Glasgow is getting plenty new buses in the coming years to meet the LEZ and yet we have people moaning about losing a few!
So will they be used on another airport route elsewhere? If not then I can't see any good reason why they should leave FiG.
This seems to be Glasgow at its best.

Instead of putting them on other routes within Glasgow that probably need them, and need them badly, they send them elsewhere in exchange of Darts that have probably seen better days.
My thoughts exactly, or perhaps for any group that's too large. Leaving them in glasgow would be the logical thing to do or at least until more of the 300s could've been Refurbed.

Which bring me on to say yet again, everything first do is a half hearted job done semi-professionally
 

overthewater

Established Member
Joined
16 Apr 2012
Messages
8,155
The last Airport buses went to Somerset for use on the 28? and there did provide very useful Luggage rack for the people traveling to Holiday camps etc
 

goldisgood

Member
Joined
5 Mar 2018
Messages
408
Glasgow isn't the centre of the known universe... As with pretty much any other First subisidary it recieved minimal investment and now, like other areas recieving investment, is seeing some newer buses leave alongside the older buses to areas which have had even less investment.
Which bring me on to say yet again, everything first do is a half hearted job done semi-professionally
The relaunched routes at First WoE (Discover, Excel, South Gloucestershire Lynx), massive improvements at Kernow, well publicised investment such as the bus in a box, other brands introduced in areas eg Wales, Worcester... I fail to see how any of this is half-hearted. This seems like you trying to make a dig at First moving a few specialised buses away from an area that is seeing lots of an investment to an area which is seeing less where the buses could be used better.
 

Jordan Adam

Established Member
Joined
12 Sep 2017
Messages
5,514
Location
Aberdeen
>Complains First aren't investing in Glasgow
>First announce huge investment in new ADL buses
>Still complains

I honestly don't understand bus enthusiasts sometimes...

This is what we've came to expect from a few certain members... You just cannae win!
 

GaryMcEwan

Established Member
Joined
20 Aug 2013
Messages
1,604
Location
Bridgeton, Glasgow
Wouldnt surprize me if most of the negatives come directly from those who live in glasgow.

It irks me is that First as of late have expected us to accept crap for a fleet. Fares have been increasing year on year and passengers get nothing in return.

I use the 263 on a daily basis and for them to use nearly 18 year old B10BLEs is mind boggling. Inside they are absolutely filthy and the worst type of vehicle to travel on.

It is good to see them finally invest, but it should have been done years ago.
 

Gingerbus1991

Member
Joined
30 Jul 2018
Messages
992
It irks me is that First as of late have expected us to accept crap for a fleet. Fares have been increasing year on year and passengers get nothing in return.

I use the 263 on a daily basis and for them to use nearly 18 year old B10BLEs is mind boggling. Inside they are absolutely filthy and the worst type of vehicle to travel on.

It is good to see them finally invest, but it should have been done years ago.

......
 

JumpinTrainz

Established Member
Joined
30 Jul 2018
Messages
1,654
If the full of the 38 is to be covered by E400MMCs then I think we’ll see quite a considerable change in the fleet. The 38 has a number of variations so it’ll release a lot of Gemini’s and tridents. It should allow a good number of ex-London tridents to be withdrawn and also Gemini’s to be refurbished. I don’t think the full of the 38 needs deckers they could probably run the 38B and 38E variations as E200MMCs.
 

Gingerbus1991

Member
Joined
30 Jul 2018
Messages
992
If the full of the 38 is to be covered by E400MMCs then I think we’ll see quite a considerable change in the fleet. The 38 has a number of variations so it’ll release a lot of Gemini’s and tridents. It should allow a good number of ex-London tridents to be withdrawn and also Gemini’s to be refurbished. I don’t think the full of the 38 needs deckers they could probably run the 38B and 38E variations as E200MMCs.
I dont imagen the 38E to be that busy from ballieston when the 2 is every 10 minutes at least.

Any idea what a PVR number for the 38 and its variations is?
 

JumpinTrainz

Established Member
Joined
30 Jul 2018
Messages
1,654
The who
I dont imagen the 38E to be that busy from ballieston when the 2 is every 10 minutes at least.

Any idea what a PVR number for the 38 and its variations is?

The 38E sees good numbers in the morning but it’s not the busiest service. The old 213 was the same. It’s great for people going to the Royal Infirmary from Baillieston way or the City Centre but the numbers fade at night. The 38B is fairly quiet through Springboig etc also. The 60 is very frequent and the 41 goes throughout Carntyne etc so single deckers could probably do this routes. They get busier on the other side and into the City Centre I believe but if the other variations are running behind more frequent with E400MMCs that’ll pick up the load.

I’m not sure of the PVR of the 38 but I imagine it’s high. Does anyone know the PVR of the 60? The reminder of E400MMCs may be going there?
 

TheGrandWazoo

Veteran Member
Joined
18 Feb 2013
Messages
19,969
Location
Somerset with international travel (e.g. across th
It irks me is that First as of late have expected us to accept crap for a fleet. Fares have been increasing year on year and passengers get nothing in return.

I use the 263 on a daily basis and for them to use nearly 18 year old B10BLEs is mind boggling. Inside they are absolutely filthy and the worst type of vehicle to travel on.

It is good to see them finally invest, but it should have been done years ago.

I recognise what you say but costs have continued to increase over that time. Fuel prices have increased over the last 10 years (though lower now than the historic highs of 2013). Drivers' wages have obviously increased year on year and they constitute a significant part of the overall costs.

Obviously, they have invested some money in the past - there's been batches of e400s, e300s, e200mmcs and Streetlites in recent years but no one can argue that it has been sufficient and that's sadly repeated in other OpCos. Down here in West of England, we still have plenty of B7TLs dating from 2000/1 - in fact, we're updating the fleet with 2004 B7TLs from Glasgow! We all know the issues of First and how there was precious little investment in the UK bus fleet in 2007-2012, either in new buses or refurbishing others; consistent years of insufficient spending and in later years, that was squeezed even further as London got the lions' share of the cash. However, we've had a few years of the Freeman revolution in FWoE (new vehicles, service trimming but also enhancements and improved marketing); you can see the changes for the better and hopefully, we're getting more new vehicles this year. Likewise, let's hope that Mr Jarvis' plan for Glasgow and Scotland generally will continue to address the challenges (LEZ, macro-economic factors) and result in better services and improved patronage.
 

TheGrandWazoo

Veteran Member
Joined
18 Feb 2013
Messages
19,969
Location
Somerset with international travel (e.g. across th
Glasgow isn't the centre of the known universe... As with pretty much any other First subisidary it recieved minimal investment and now, like other areas recieving investment, is seeing some newer buses leave alongside the older buses to areas which have had even less investment.

The relaunched routes at First WoE (Discover, Excel, South Gloucestershire Lynx), massive improvements at Kernow, well publicised investment such as the bus in a box, other brands introduced in areas eg Wales, Worcester... I fail to see how any of this is half-hearted. This seems like you trying to make a dig at First moving a few specialised buses away from an area that is seeing lots of an investment to an area which is seeing less where the buses could be used better.

You get the feeling from a certain individual that, irrespective of what First do, they will stubbornly refuse to acknowledge what is being done. That they reckon that Andrew Jarvis isn't "a real bus man" probably indicates how accurate their perception of what makes a professional (or semi-professional) job....
 

Gingerbus1991

Member
Joined
30 Jul 2018
Messages
992
I recognise what you say but costs have continued to increase over that time. Fuel prices have increased over the last 10 years (though lower now than the historic highs of 2013). Drivers' wages have obviously increased year on year and they constitute a significant part of the overall costs.

Obviously, they have invested some money in the past - there's been batches of e400s, e300s, e200mmcs and Streetlites in recent years but no one can argue that it has been sufficient and that's sadly repeated in other OpCos. Down here in West of England, we still have plenty of B7TLs dating from 2000/1 - in fact, we're updating the fleet with 2004 B7TLs from Glasgow! We all know the issues of First and how there was precious little investment in the UK bus fleet in 2007-2012, either in new buses or refurbishing others; consistent years of insufficient spending and in later years, that was squeezed even further as London got the lions' share of the cash. However, we've had a few years of the Freeman revolution in FWoE (new vehicles, service trimming but also enhancements and improved marketing); you can see the changes for the better and hopefully, we're getting more new vehicles this year. Likewise, let's hope that Mr Jarvis' plan for Glasgow and Scotland generally will continue to address the challenges (LEZ, macro-economic factors) and result in better services and improved patronage.
Generally speaking Glasgows 2004 B7TLs are still pretty good and sturdy, studying the extent to which Wrights, ADL or Thorntons can refurbish a bus they could be like new again if first had the capital to do that before they went south as they are mingin to look at.
 
Last edited:

SarahDFIG

Member
Joined
9 Jan 2019
Messages
381
The who


The 38E sees good numbers in the morning but it’s not the busiest service. The old 213 was the same. It’s great for people going to the Royal Infirmary from Baillieston way or the City Centre but the numbers fade at night. The 38B is fairly quiet through Springboig etc also. The 60 is very frequent and the 41 goes throughout Carntyne etc so single deckers could probably do this routes. They get busier on the other side and into the City Centre I believe but if the other variations are running behind more frequent with E400MMCs that’ll pick up the load.

I’m not sure of the PVR of the 38 but I imagine it’s high. Does anyone know the PVR of the 60? The reminder of E400MMCs may be going there?

38 needs 39 to cover all. If the full service gets e400s it will leave 14 which is enough to cover the likes of the 77. Not enough to cover the 60

All singles on this order are meant for overtowns 242/254
 

TheGrandWazoo

Veteran Member
Joined
18 Feb 2013
Messages
19,969
Location
Somerset with international travel (e.g. across th
Generally speaking Glasgows 2004 B7TLs are still pretty good and sturdy, studying the extent to which Wrights, ADL or Thorntons can refurbish a bus they could be like new again if first had the capital to do that before they went south are they are mingin to look at.

Indeed, I wouldn't disagree with that. In fact, the refurbishments that have been done on various First and Transdev vehicles have really given them a new lease of life.

However, I suspect that there are various newer vehicles that are approaching mid life so more likely to do those and, to be honest, I was on 32548 the other week and it was reasonably tidy internally.
 
Joined
16 Oct 2011
Messages
280
seen an unbranded enviro 400mmc in the revised livery in Caledonia depot does anyone know what its for if its getting route branding
 

CM

Member
Joined
28 Dec 2010
Messages
667
The who


The 38E sees good numbers in the morning but it’s not the busiest service. The old 213 was the same. It’s great for people going to the Royal Infirmary from Baillieston way or the City Centre but the numbers fade at night. The 38B is fairly quiet through Springboig etc also. The 60 is very frequent and the 41 goes throughout Carntyne etc so single deckers could probably do this routes. They get busier on the other side and into the City Centre I believe but if the other variations are running behind more frequent with E400MMCs that’ll pick up the load.

I’m not sure of the PVR of the 38 but I imagine it’s high. Does anyone know the PVR of the 60? The reminder of E400MMCs may be going there?

The 60 is in no way "very frequent" as you put it. It runs every 20 minutes, hardly a frequent service.
 

Jordan Adam

Established Member
Joined
12 Sep 2017
Messages
5,514
Location
Aberdeen
Had a look on the Glasgow website today, i bloody hope they sort out the network map, it appears they've just pasted a badly compressed image of the network map on to a PDF. It's been like this for quite some time too.

The 60 is in no way "very frequent" as you put it. It runs every 20 minutes, hardly a frequent service.

In most places "Every 20 Minutes" is regarded as a high frequency and/or core service, however typically it's the limit with anything less frequent not being a core service.
 

38A-Z

Member
Joined
28 Jun 2018
Messages
40
Good to hear the 38 is getting new buses! The Geminis are ok, the Tridents not so much.

Just a thought, if the 38 gets new buses, is it possible it’s just for the 38 (not the B/C/E)?

38 is Easterhouse to Eastwood Toll every 10 mins (with every second one extended to Newton Mearns)
The B/C/E run south side to Alexandra Parade then separate into the 30 minute service.

If the 38s need 39 buses to run, I guess 20-21 of them will be for the main 38 to Easterhouse. If the new ones were only for the 38 (not BCE), that would probably still leave enough to run the 60/A as well. That way half of the 38s get the new buses plus the 60/A get the rest so benefits both services??
The BCE do see quite a mix of single and double deckers now so they could still run with singles/ Gemini’s.

Would be great if the full 38s get the new buses but it’s been mentioned a few times on here that the 60s would be getting the new ones.
 

CM

Member
Joined
28 Dec 2010
Messages
667
Between the City Centre and Easterhouse, the 60/A is every 10 minutes.

The 60 and 60A combined, he metioned only the 60 which is every 20 minutes and 20 minutes is hardly frequent, especially when the 60 was the 40 it was as frequent as every 8-9 minutes.
 

lastbus

Member
Joined
9 Sep 2018
Messages
1,001
True or overtown will get 11 with again 1 extra e200 like the pink ones running around but I have heard the 242 getting increased frequency with the expansion of virgin media moving to eurocentral and that they were both in talks
Have heard the buses due for Overtown will start to arrive at Blantyre on Monday.
 

Scott mac

Member
Joined
24 Apr 2018
Messages
229
Good to hear the 38 is getting new buses! The Geminis are ok, the Tridents not so much.

Just a thought, if the 38 gets new buses, is it possible it’s just for the 38 (not the B/C/E)?

38 is Easterhouse to Eastwood Toll every 10 mins (with every second one extended to Newton Mearns)
The B/C/E run south side to Alexandra Parade then separate into the 30 minute service.

If the 38s need 39 buses to run, I guess 20-21 of them will be for the main 38 to Easterhouse. If the new ones were only for the 38 (not BCE), that would probably still leave enough to run the 60/A as well. That way half of the 38s get the new buses plus the 60/A get the rest so benefits both services??
The BCE do see quite a mix of single and double deckers now so they could still run with singles/ Gemini’s.

Would be great if the full 38s get the new buses but it’s been mentioned a few times on here that the 60s would be getting the new ones.
The full 38 are getting new e400mmc 39 in all 14 for 77 this is a rumour and 10 e400mmc city's for the 500
 

SarahDFIG

Member
Joined
9 Jan 2019
Messages
381
Have heard the buses due for Overtown will start to arrive at Blantyre on Monday.
Wonder if they are coming from down south ADL rather than Falkirk as no reports of anything sitting there.

Sad to see the b10s end near.

In other news defo looks like the airport e200mmcs will be leaving the fleet and going to Wales. City 400s must be due soon if talk already in regards to them
 

JumpinTrainz

Established Member
Joined
30 Jul 2018
Messages
1,654
Good to hear the 38 is getting new buses! The Geminis are ok, the Tridents not so much.

Just a thought, if the 38 gets new buses, is it possible it’s just for the 38 (not the B/C/E)?

38 is Easterhouse to Eastwood Toll every 10 mins (with every second one extended to Newton Mearns)
The B/C/E run south side to Alexandra Parade then separate into the 30 minute service.

If the 38s need 39 buses to run, I guess 20-21 of them will be for the main 38 to Easterhouse. If the new ones were only for the 38 (not BCE), that would probably still leave enough to run the 60/A as well. That way half of the 38s get the new buses plus the 60/A get the rest so benefits both services??
The BCE do see quite a mix of single and double deckers now so they could still run with singles/ Gemini’s.

Would be great if the full 38s get the new buses but it’s been mentioned a few times on here that the 60s would be getting the new ones.

You make a good point I did consider that. I thought it’d be unlikely they’d cover the full 38 as it’s such a big service but then on the other hand it would make sense to have buses to cover the full thing as it would be silly to have brand new buses on part of the route and old rattly tridents on the other variations. If not then perhaps some will be for the 38 and perhaps some for the 60? Who knows..
 

Top