Sleepy
Established Member
First Kernow will increase the frequency of 300 St Ives - Lands End open top route to every 2 hours this summer (29th May - 17th Sept.)
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First South West (Kernow & Buses of Somerset)
- Thread starter RPI
- Start date
First Kernow will increase the frequency of 300 St Ives - Lands End open top route to every 2 hours this summer (29th May - 17th Sept.)
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RailUK Forums
GBM
Member
More driver discussion as to who meets who; where, and what the protocol will be! (as I understand it).
THarris123
Established Member
Is that an improvement or just the same as it was last year?
andyc20050
Member
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- 98
TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
It has been two hourly in the past - hope this cached link from 2012 works
http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/new_service_updates/attach_1329929182_7681_300 sum.pdf
It's a great route and a last hurrah for the 30 year old B10Ms. To everyone ... If you can, get a ride on it this year!!
Penwithian
Member
During a conversation I had with a First Kernow employee during last Sunday's running day in Penzance, I was told the intention is that 300 will change back to the circular route last used in 2013.
This means the same bus will be used Penzance-Land's End-St Ives-Marazion-Penzance, so no need to change buses I assume the bus will display 300 on the entire length of the route.
I live in Pendeen on the route which will mean with increased frequency, a faster and more scenic trip to St Ives via Zennor for shopping!
It was a circular last year, the 300 arriving from st Ives became a 1 and vice versa, so passengers could stay on the same bus throughout, it was just the 17 bit missing
Goldfish62
Established Member
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The registration variation was just for a timetable change, not a route change, so if it's the same bus throughout it'll be 1/1A - 300 - 17B or vice versa.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I drove on the 10A St Just - PZ via Morvah at the running day last Sunday, so covered a reasonable section of the 300 and loved every minute of it. No Summer traffic to contend with, mind.:roll:
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
By my reckoning there are seven Solos that fit into Mousehole (same number as last year). Of the 7.9m slimlines, there's the two long-established ones, plus one transfer from within FG last year, and the silver one. Then there are the three B0S-liveried 7.1m mini ones.
I'm surprised that the latter are the regulars on the 6 - the route really needs the slightly larger ones for capacity - it's not a quiet route! I would have thought the BOS ones would be ideal for the lightly loaded 11 and 16.
Busaholic
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Oh, the flack I got on here when I suggested that First had blundered when they withdrew the circular service, in that it was a moneymaker in season and a huge PR plus for the company. I don't revisit posts, but I recollect no support whatever for my arguments. If the reports are true, I shall make sure that the local paper trumpets it, just as I made sure that the original decision was scrutinised (to an extent) and criticised. By the way, don't discount Cornwall Council's hand in this - they never successfully (imo) countered my argument to them that withdrawing concessionary fares from the St Ives to Land's End via Pendeen section could be construed as illegal.
THarris123
Established Member
Lovely pic that
THarris123
Established Member
With the order for Kernow now confirmed as 30 E400s, do we know what will happen to the B7RLEs?
TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
They will probably have to leave Kernow as the number of routes that they can operate is limited - same goes for the Solars. The 17/17A is the only one that stands out in that respect.
The obvious thought would be to send them to Somerset but they still have quite a bit of NBV on them. Being heavy on fuel and the likelihood of some major units coming up for renewal (they've been worked hard on the 14/18), you'd wonder how that chimes with trying to keep costs down in the battle vs. WB.
In short, they could go anywhere
I'm "very jealous" that First Kernow is to get 30 E400s !
- I didn't expect anything like that number and that level of investment.
Clearly First are confident that Cornwall Council now have a clear understanding of the real-world of the operation and economics of a commercial bus company (?) -
and that they have an "agreement" that will last a long time, and not be affected by changes in local politics (etc).
(Franchising for example, which I know is currently "off the agenda").
Any replies, information surrounding, and corrections to that appraisal are welcome.
ALSO, as such a large batch has been ordered, will they be to a special spec. for Cornwall (example short wheelbase) or will they be "bog-standard" ?
- I didn't expect anything like that number and that level of investment.
Clearly First are confident that Cornwall Council now have a clear understanding of the real-world of the operation and economics of a commercial bus company (?) -
and that they have an "agreement" that will last a long time, and not be affected by changes in local politics (etc).
(Franchising for example, which I know is currently "off the agenda").
Any replies, information surrounding, and corrections to that appraisal are welcome.
ALSO, as such a large batch has been ordered, will they be to a special spec. for Cornwall (example short wheelbase) or will they be "bog-standard" ?
Goldfish62
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I wouldn't disagree with your assessment in general, but I think it's a bit more two-way. Would First have committed to this huge investment had CC not thrown around a few threats unless standards were raised?
Whatever the truth, it really is fantastic news for Cornwall and something that no one could have imagined a few years ago.
However, bear in mind that the 14/18 are commercial and the overall threat to Cornwall's extensive supported network remains.
In respect of the vehicle spec it would make sense for flexibility if they are short wheelbase, like the Glasgow examples, as the long wheelbase Tridents and E400s really do struggle on a number of routes and I don't want to see all our posh new local kit bashed up!
Goldfish62
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Due in "Autumn" apparently, so anytime September - December I'd say.
They will probably have to leave Kernow as the number of routes that they can operate is limited - same goes for the Solars. The 17/17A is the only one that stands out in that respect.
The obvious thought would be to send them to Somerset but they still have quite a bit of NBV on them. Being heavy on fuel and the likelihood of some major units coming up for renewal (they've been worked hard on the 14/18), you'd wonder how that chimes with trying to keep costs down in the battle vs. WB.
In short, they could go anywhere
BoS would be the obvious place to send them for the 21 to replace non-PSVAR Tridents, or for the new 55/54/77 routes.
But you are right; they could end up anywhere (Glasgow maybe........).
THarris123
Established Member
Just looking at the number of old buses
I make it 34 Tridents in Kernow that are older than Y reg. That doesn't necessarily mean that they are all non compliant, but it is probably a safe bet to say that at least 25 Tridents need replacing. The 30 E400s will move the 14/18 vehicles and the Bendies from 101. I have no idea where the Bendies will go, but I will put a safe bet on the B7RLEs heading to either BoS or staying in Kernow and replacing deckers on certain routes. The Scanias are pretty likely to stay.
So there will be cascades - I think it could either be ALX400s from Bristol/Bath (if not I expect they'll head to Yorkshire) or some Presidents from east.
Surely there are some routes that are operated by deckers which B7RLEs can be used on?
I make it 34 Tridents in Kernow that are older than Y reg. That doesn't necessarily mean that they are all non compliant, but it is probably a safe bet to say that at least 25 Tridents need replacing. The 30 E400s will move the 14/18 vehicles and the Bendies from 101. I have no idea where the Bendies will go, but I will put a safe bet on the B7RLEs heading to either BoS or staying in Kernow and replacing deckers on certain routes. The Scanias are pretty likely to stay.
So there will be cascades - I think it could either be ALX400s from Bristol/Bath (if not I expect they'll head to Yorkshire) or some Presidents from east.
Surely there are some routes that are operated by deckers which B7RLEs can be used on?
I cannot see the need for deckers on the 87, 90 & 93 all year round. Maybe in the peak summer period the loadings justify a decker.Possibly put the B7RLE's on some of those routes. What do others think? Or the Truro to Bodmin run, I have seen Scania's on it fairly regularly.
Someone who knows the vehicle workings from start to finish may be in a better position to comment!
Perhaps even try Scania's / B7RLE's on the 2 between Penzance & Helston.
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THarris123
Established Member
That was my thinking. The other day when I was in St Ives, coming back I saw a dart on 27.
Am I pushing my luck to ask FSW Official and South Westerly whether they know or not?
The 87 needs deckers in summer and a minibus would do in winter! The Bodmin run is often Scania or B7RLE and I've seen them on the 90/93 as well. They also work 17 and 10 on occasion.
TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
That would've been the 17 in St Ives and is one of the routes that can take full size single decks. May have been one of the ex Lothian SPDs even?
Whiteway215
Established Member
Can I ask what buses will work on the 584 and 595 and from which depot or base?
Thanks.
Thanks.
FSW Official
Member
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So before pure speculation becomes confused with fact...
There are no bendies on the 101. It is notionally a 1 PVR Solo route.
The bendies are staying on the internal Eden contract
The B7RLEs and Scanias are not 'likely to stay'. At this stage they are all 'likely' to be surplus and are not yet allocated anywhere.
From memory we have 31 DDs to replace due to DDA but that includes the open tops.
We are about to receive 9 B7TLs from Eastern Counties to Kernow followed by about a dozen Tridents from 2 or 3 op cos. The remainder will be dealt with later in the year - we still have 8 months.
We haven't yet decided what we will convert to open top but convert we will
BoS only has 4 non DDA Tridents
There are no bendies on the 101. It is notionally a 1 PVR Solo route.
The bendies are staying on the internal Eden contract
The B7RLEs and Scanias are not 'likely to stay'. At this stage they are all 'likely' to be surplus and are not yet allocated anywhere.
From memory we have 31 DDs to replace due to DDA but that includes the open tops.
We are about to receive 9 B7TLs from Eastern Counties to Kernow followed by about a dozen Tridents from 2 or 3 op cos. The remainder will be dealt with later in the year - we still have 8 months.
We haven't yet decided what we will convert to open top but convert we will
BoS only has 4 non DDA Tridents
TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
Thanks for the info. Regarding the FEC B7TLs, what sort of vintage will these be and will these see off the last of the Olympians?
I do understand about the B7RLEs. They've been worked hard, judging by the cosmetic internal appearance that I saw on a couple I went on.
Again, thanks for the update and look forward to more arrivals from across the empire.