First Scotland East (Midland Bluebird and West Lothian operations)

GusB

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Combined thread carrying on the discussion from:

and the First operations from here:
 
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Anyone know when the 600 is going back to Edinburgh Airport?
Just my luck - a sensible question about a First West Lothian route. I only came here to see some bitterness, anger and division.

I can't imagine it would be anytime soon, given the continuing low level of passenger trade at the airport. Did the 600 carry much of a load on the Kirkliston to airport section last year? Always nearly empty on the rare occasions it passed me. I tended to view it as more of a local bus that extended to the airport almost for somewhere to terminate rather than a dedicated route. The marketing was certainly geared towards holidaymakers but it doesn't have advantages like the park & ride facilities for Fife's 747.
 

Jordan Adam

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Just my luck - a sensible question about a First West Lothian route. I only came here to see some bitterness, anger and division.

I can't imagine it would be anytime soon, given the continuing low level of passenger trade at the airport. Did the 600 carry much of a load on the Kirkliston to airport section last year? Always nearly empty on the rare occasions it passed me. I tended to view it as more of a local bus that extended to the airport almost for somewhere to terminate rather than a dedicated route. The marketing was certainly geared towards holidaymakers but it doesn't have advantages like the park & ride facilities for Fife's 747.

The 21A took a better route. Logically First should revise the 600 to operate direct to the Airport and then to the Gyle Centre linking up with the 20, 63 and 68. Then reinstate the Queensferry service. Putting the E400s on it was a waste imo but i get that they wanted extra marketing. Ideally they should've refurbished some midlife singles for the 600 and left the E400s unbranded so they could be used on the X22/X23 & X24/X25. It's unlikely to happen but it would be nice to see more branded buses in the region. It's a shame WL don't have any of the E300s as they'd be well suited to the single decker operated runs X24/X25.

I'm somewhat surprised Glasgow haven't gained more Streetlites with FSE getting Enviros instead, at an operational perspective it would make more sense as out of all the newer stock First have the E300s are best suited to the faster out of town routes.
 

CN04NRJ

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The 21A took a better route. Logically First should revise the 600 to operate direct to the Airport and then to the Gyle Centre linking up with the 20, 63 and 68. Then reinstate the Queensferry service. Putting the E400s on it was a waste imo but i get that they wanted extra marketing. Ideally they should've refurbished some midlife singles for the 600 and left the E400s unbranded so they could be used on the X22/X23 & X24/X25. It's unlikely to happen but it would be nice to see more branded buses in the region. It's a shame WL don't have any of the E300s as they'd be well suited to the single decker operated runs X24/X25.

I'm somewhat surprised Glasgow haven't gained more Streetlites with FSE getting Enviros instead, at an operational perspective it would make more sense as out of all the newer stock First have the E300s are best suited to the faster out of town routes.

The 600 extending to the Gyle sounds like an excellent idea now that First are running the 20/63, although the E400s do seem like a bit of a waste of capacity on the service as it stands.
 

ScotRail158725

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Is there a site that shows what vehicles are on what services for FSE? tried bustimes.org but that doesn’t work
 
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The 600 extending to the Gyle sounds like an excellent idea now that First are running the 20/63, although the E400s do seem like a bit of a waste of capacity on the service as it stands.
Not sure I see the point in running yet another bus service along the A8. Hardly anyone uses the 20 and 63 buses as it is. Losses will be massive on those. The airport to Gyle route also mirrors the tram. The 38 (or was it 38A?) never succeeded in serving the Gyle centre when the route was tried a few years back. Would the 600 just 'call in' at the airport when passing? Don't think any other buses do that, for a very good reason.
If First feel flush maybe extending the 600 beyond the airport is worth a punt, but seems a bit random to me.
 

Jordan Adam

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Not sure I see the point in running yet another bus service along the A8. Hardly anyone uses the 20 and 63 buses as it is. Losses will be massive on those. The airport to Gyle route also mirrors the tram. The 38 (or was it 38A?) never succeeded in serving the Gyle centre when the route was tried a few years back. Would the 600 just 'call in' at the airport when passing? Don't think any other buses do that, for a very good reason.
If First feel flush maybe extending the 600 beyond the airport is worth a punt, but seems a bit random to me.

Won't be any losses for First as the 20 and 63 are subsidised.
 

Jordan Adam

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Running to the Gyle Centre via the Airport has been done before. That's how the 21A used to operate (and i think the old Horsburgh 555/777?), however i do agree it can be a risk on reliability, you'd need recovery time at the Airport which would just put Gyle passengers off using it.
 

Baileygirl

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Not sure I see the point in running yet another bus service along the A8. Hardly anyone uses the 20 and 63 buses as it is. Losses will be massive on those. The airport to Gyle route also mirrors the tram. The 38 (or was it 38A?) never succeeded in serving the Gyle centre when the route was tried a few years back. Would the 600 just 'call in' at the airport when passing? Don't think any other buses do that, for a very good reason.
If First feel flush maybe extending the 600 beyond the airport is worth a punt, but seems a bit random to me.
The reason the 600 did not go past the airport to the Gyle is due to the charges the airport levies and the enhanced fair of £5.00 upwards to the airport. It was changed to the 600 after the first year free trial which the airport gave First when the 21A charged normal fares.
 
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33443-33449 only, 33436-33438 staying as is
I wonder if they are extending the route or increasing the frequency, because SN66 WGY is in a two tone pink (or purple i don't really know) Unfinished 600 Branding.

Ive had an idea for another airport bus in west Lothian.
It would be operated by first and be numbered service 500.

There might not be a lot of demand for it but it would be the route that Follows:
Blackridge/Fauldhouse to Edinburgh Airport via
North Whitburn(from Fauldhouse hourly) or Westrigg(from Blackridge hourly), Armadale North, Bathgate (At Morrisons, South Bridge street and in train station), Boghall A89, Deans South Alderstone road, St Johns Hospital, Howden, Livingston the Centre stance (F to Airport and Stance A to Fauldhouse or Blackridge), Dedridge West and east, Mid Calder Spottiswoodie Gardens, East Calder Main Street, Kirknewton, Dalmahoy, Sighthill, Edinburgh Park, The Gyle Centre (Stance KF To Airport and Stance KC to West Lothian), RBS Gogarburn and Ingliston Park & Ride
 

GusB

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Sometimes forum members will come up with ideas that don't seem viable. There is nothing to stop anyone else disagreeing, but please do so in a respectful way.
 

LiviCrazy

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I wonder if they are extending the route or increasing the frequency, because SN66 WGY is in a two tone pink (or purple i don't really know) Unfinished 600 Branding.

Ive had an idea for another airport bus in west Lothian.
It would be operated by first and be numbered service 500.

There might not be a lot of demand for it but it would be the route that Follows:
Blackridge/Fauldhouse to Edinburgh Airport via
North Whitburn(from Fauldhouse hourly) or Westrigg(from Blackridge hourly), Armadale North, Bathgate (At Morrisons, South Bridge street and in train station), Boghall A89, Deans South Alderstone road, St Johns Hospital, Howden, Livingston the Centre stance (F to Airport and Stance A to Fauldhouse or Blackridge), Dedridge West and east, Mid Calder Spottiswoodie Gardens, East Calder Main Street, Kirknewton, Dalmahoy, Sighthill, Edinburgh Park, The Gyle Centre (Stance KF To Airport and Stance KC to West Lothian), RBS Gogarburn and Ingliston Park & Ride
On a similar thought. Could First have some success by turning the 600 into a sort of circular similar to the old 555/777. As part of the First Bus Network in West Lothian, it would had some missing links. With East Calder growing massively since the 555/777 was pulled and a few other areas growing. It would also provide links to The Gyle and Bankhead for the College/University which are often hard to get to from parts of West Lothian.

Thinking a pan shaped circular. Existing route from Whitburn to Airport, then onto the Gyle like the 21A did, up to Bankhead, along Calder Road, East Calder, Mid Calder, Dedridge, Livingston Centre, Whitburn. (and Vice Versa)

They could even use it to slightly cut the frequency of the X22/X23.


Obviously all under normal bus circumstances.
 
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no, Larbert. was only there temporarily at the end of last year
Ok thanks

On a similar thought. Could First have some success by turning the 600 into a sort of circular similar to the old 555/777. As part of the First Bus Network in West Lothian, it would had some missing links. With East Calder growing massively since the 555/777 was pulled and a few other areas growing. It would also provide links to The Gyle and Bankhead for the College/University which are often hard to get to from parts of West Lothian.

Thinking a pan shaped circular. Existing route from Whitburn to Airport, then onto the Gyle like the 21A did, up to Bankhead, along Calder Road, East Calder, Mid Calder, Dedridge, Livingston Centre, Whitburn. (and Vice Versa)

They could even use it to slightly cut the frequency of the X22/X23.


Obviously all under normal bus circumstances.
It would probably effect reliability to Livingston from Uphall, Broxburn, Winchburgh and Kirkliston if it done a circular but maybe it would work
 

overthewater

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On a similar thought. Could First have some success by turning the 600 into a sort of circular similar to the old 555/777. As part of the First Bus Network in West Lothian, it would had some missing links. With East Calder growing massively since the 555/777 was pulled and a few other areas growing. It would also provide links to The Gyle and Bankhead for the College/University which are often hard to get to from parts of West Lothian.

Thinking a pan shaped circular. Existing route from Whitburn to Airport, then onto the Gyle like the 21A did, up to Bankhead, along Calder Road, East Calder, Mid Calder, Dedridge, Livingston Centre, Whitburn. (and Vice Versa)

They could even use it to slightly cut the frequency of the X22/X23.


Obviously all under normal bus circumstances.

If they killed off the X22 the could easily make that 600 a half circular, operating in to Edinburgh City centre is a complete waste of time and is so over bused, but I think having links to the unis, slight hill, The Gyle could do rather well, and in fact you could save a bus or two aswell. Mind you Shotts - Whitburn - Livingston - East Calder - Heriot watt PR - Gyle - Airport - Broxburn - Livingston - whitburn. Lets be fair here old 555/777 was a mess, and thus never had a real chance, just look at the 63.
 

LiviCrazy

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If they killed off the X22 the could easily make that 600 a half circular, operating in to Edinburgh City centre is a complete waste of time and is so over bused, but I think having links to the unis, slight hill, The Gyle could do rather well, and in fact you could save a bus or two aswell. Mind you Shotts - Whitburn - Livingston - East Calder - Heriot watt PR - Gyle - Airport - Broxburn - Livingston - whitburn. Lets be fair here old 555/777 was a mess, and thus never had a real chance, just look at the 63.
Yeah, I think the idea was the right one, but needed more time and some tweaks. But unfortunately it never persevered. I think that route could work in the long term. Maybe cut one x22 journey and one x25 journey per hour and replace with a 600. Would still give three journeys into the city centre per hour on each corridor.
 

Tartanarmy85

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777 and 555 could be profitable till 7pm then depending what bus got through Broxburn or East Calder first after 7pm was the what killed the service pre-covid the airport was busy depending recovery airport this could be viable
 

overthewater

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The service was Bus route development grant, The route had funding for 3 years. The route had brand new deckers which was overkill, The route kept on changing within livingston, it become clear it was acting more like local service at times then what it was supposed to do. Then E&H started a completing service to the Gyle, 559 every 30mins. Trouble was they was also another council service 557 which did after 7pm.

Passenger from broxburn started using the FAST buses instead because they were faster.
 

CN04NRJ

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The 52 plate Darts seem to be pretty regular on the 63 recently - are these the allocated buses?

Seems quite a downgrade from what was used prior to this - even when Horsburgh ran it.
 

Jordan Adam

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The 52 plate Darts seem to be pretty regular on the 63 recently - are these the allocated buses?

Seems quite a downgrade from what was used prior to this - even when Horsburgh ran it.

There's only one 52 plate Dart (43861) active just now and it's been on the 68 only. The 20 & 63 have been almost entirely operated by 14/64 plate Streetlites, although the odd 09 plate B7RLE was on last week.

As i type this 47564, 63221 and 63254 are on the 20 while 63241 and 63248 are on the 63.
 

CN04NRJ

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There's only one 52 plate Dart (43861) active just now and it's been on the 68 only. The 20 & 63 have been almost entirely operated by 14/64 plate Streetlites, although the odd 09 plate B7RLE was on last week.

As i type this 47564, 63221 and 63254 are on the 20 while 63241 and 63248 are on the 63.

I must have been imagining seeing a Dart on the 63 several times recently then.
 

overthewater

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I've only seen Streetlites on the 63 and 20, however is it possible onte of Jersey darts was used on one of them?
 

CN04NRJ

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I've only seen Streetlites on the 63 and 20, however is it possible onte of Jersey darts was used on one of them?

They have been used on the 63, unless of course I was misreading '63 Queensferry', picking up on the 63 stop at the Gyle, as somehow being a 68.
 

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