• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

First West of England (Bristol, Bath & The West)

TheGrandWazoo

Veteran Member
Joined
18 Feb 2013
Messages
19,966
Location
Somerset with international travel (e.g. across th
Ahh that makes sense! Though couldn't remember if it was Yeovil or Taunton 66956/8/60-1 transferred to. That said I remember the fanfare when they were introduced on the 54.

IIRC, they were Taunton vehicles nominally but that 2 boards were operated by Yeovil; I don't think Yeovil had a permanent pair? I remember when they went and then returned, seeing one working a Fishponds Road service along Stapleton Road.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Wessexbuses

Member
Joined
10 Mar 2018
Messages
118
Location
Weymouth
Sorry for late reply, just spotted this. At the moment from what I can remember there are 8 Darts on strength with 5 E200s but I expect this to alter after the pandemic as only a limited amount of vehicles are required at present. 45115 is/was here from Taunton, 44918/920/921 have been about but haven't seen 44919 since its arrival a couple of weeks ago.
Several Deckers have arrived at Bridgwater from Cornwall but as the 54 is only 3 hourly at the moment just a single Yeovil Dart is fulfilling that duty for the time being.
Expect there will be more changes after pandemic eases.
Cheers, Mike
I can confirm 45115 is still in Yeovil as of this morning
 

Whiteway215

Established Member
Joined
15 Sep 2015
Messages
1,989
Location
Bath
GW saying about 30871/77 being on loan to Wells. I’ve said it before and I will say it again I could never believe such old buses being trusted on the 172/3/4 with, as GW states, such steep climbs especially out of Wells up through the Horringtons.
Anyway it looks as though we won’t be seeing 30871 or 75 being hauled off for scrap just yet. 30871 (with the bashed in roof after arguing with Bristol Parkway bridge) is at present being converted to a library bus at Bath Depot. 30875 is parked up with a windscreen sticker ‘Library bus-do not remove parts.’
 

freetoview33

Established Member
Joined
24 May 2009
Messages
3,721
Location
West of England
The tracker shows four CLE gas buses (39411/12/18/39) having an outing on the 75/76 today. LH routes (1/2, 3/4, 5, 6/7, 42, 43, 45, 48/48A/49) are showing as 100% CLE buses (except 1 SGL each on the 2 and 5). It appears from the tracker that another five CLE gas buses aren't in use today, so plenty of spares. There are also three 73, six m3 (including 39489) and two SGL buses showing as not used today. Two of the m3 buses will probably go out on the m1 at 16:00. I haven't worked out the PVR of the current operations.
I have had clarification that the 4 gas buses on the 75/76 are being run from Hengrove and based at Hengrove (but I guess calling in at Lawrence Hill or Parson Street for filling up)
 

Buses in Bath

Member
Joined
16 Feb 2020
Messages
246
Location
Weston, Bath
First of all, it's fair to have opinions and that's what this forum is about.

In terms of the 126, that's certainly new information. @D2007wsm had suggested that Wells were to keep the two boards; FWIW I'd wonder if it could really be run with Streetlites in terms of capacity.

However, I do query what you're saying as I don't think it reflects the reality of the decker situation at Wells; it feels like you're selectively picking out information and interpreting because you don't like the e400s. The B7TLs including the oldest were there long, long before the e400s began moving over in August/September. Frequent loans from Bath to Wells have been commonplace over the last two years. That includes stuff like 30871 and 30877 which were there at various times during the spring. I've seen X39 B9s, ex London Geminis, ex Glasgow Geminis, various ALXs etc. Such were the issues that 32669/73/88 were sent there from April 2019. Unfortunately, there were problems with 32669 and 32688 - the former was a dog and 32688 was also VOR for much of Oct/Nov. To blame it on 33754 and 33667 is ignoring the issues that have beset Wells and hastened the replacement of the Streetdecks.

I know it's all about opinions but I think you're wrong in terms of the Streetdecks on the Bath corridor as they wouldn't have survived there either. There's as many sharp hills whether its Dunkerton, Chilcompton, Nettlebridge or through the Horringtons as there are on the 376. Also, whilst the ALXs are surprisingly good vehicles for their age, to suggest that they are as comfortable as an e400 (especially the 2000/1 examples with their a**e numbing seats).....not a chance. The main issues with the e400s are the heating as others have suggested but otherwise, they are robust if uninspiring. Yes, they do need a refresh but given the issues that Wells were experiencing (i.e. having four additional deckers and it still not being enough), the 12 plates were pushed into service quicly

@D2007wsm is right about USBs in that these are relatively new features. You filming routes is pretty extraordinary rather than the norm and if it's an issue, just take a juice bar out with you. Same with variety - the idea was originally to have just B9s (172-4) and Streetdecks (376). Having fewer types means you minimise spares issues and type training - stuff that is quantifiable int terms of financial and operational performance rather than something esoteric about it being nice to have depending on your view.

A few other points. All the e400s will need to be Euro VI to comply with the Bath or Bristol CAZs. I'd assume that in practice, the 12 and 14 plates will simply be a mixed pool and the better ones will appear on whichever boards are out the longest!! Also, there are 6 not 5 B9/Gemini 2 at Bath (36229-34).
There are actually 7 gemini 2s (36228-36234)
 

CD

Member
Joined
22 Jun 2014
Messages
990
Location
34004
IIRC, they were Taunton vehicles nominally but that 2 boards were operated by Yeovil; I don't think Yeovil had a permanent pair? I remember when they went and then returned, seeing one working a Fishponds Road service along Stapleton Road.
66961 was the Taunton vehicle, the other 3 outstationed/allocated to Yeovil.
 

THarris123

Established Member
Joined
20 Apr 2014
Messages
2,843
Location
Wells, Somerset
My issue is that the 12 reg Enviros that arrived were rushed. One still doesn't have a full livery with vinyls, months after arriving (33662), one is falling to pieces already (33754), one isn't the same colour as the rest (33658), they weren't given charging ports, of which are essential for my journeys, one has been given a very poor euro 6 upgrade (33660) and one is always making odd noises (33665). Their reliability hasn't been the best, with 33754 spending over a month off the road, 33667, the same, 33660 spending a few weeks in one of the Bristol depots. A few of the 14 reg Enviros aren't in a good shape, 33835 has a hole in the roof downstairs, 33836's windows seem to be on the verge of falling out the amount they rattle, 33838 rattles like mad and makes grinding noises at speed, 33840 seems to be a hoover, 33857's drivers side is covered with rust. The buses are unbearable in the Winter, with their lack of heating, I'm gonna miss being able to be warmed by the engine on B9tls. I get the reasons why they want to have the same style buses together in one depot, though the lack of variety is going to bore me very quickly, and I have spoken to a couple of drivers who don't even like the Enviros, and are dreading having a fleet of just them. In my personal opinion, Wells needs MMC's. They are far nicer than their predecessors, and with Lazzers being the prefered seating option for First, much more comfortable for longer journeys. I was considering becoming a driver for Wells at some point in the next few years, however Bath may get me instead, just for the variety in fleet.
Few points of order on this.

Firstly, the arrival of the 12 plate E400s were not rushed. Generally most of them received vinyls and were repainted in plenty of time. I understand that there were a handful of engineering issues with some of them too which had to be sorted before leaving Hengrove.

12 plate E400s - generally speaking they aren't bad. From a driving perspective, they accelerate well and are comfortable to drive. However the brakes aren't the best and on some, in particular the ex Weston ones, the brakes snatch. There are two annoying problems I find with them - one is the change pot - most of us have change dispensers, so having to count out change each time you get on a different bus can be quite annoying, especially when you're late. This wouldn't be such an issue if we only had to carry around £1 and 50p coins for simple fares. The other problem is the n/s wing mirror - the legacy of these buses for me will be the pain in the neck that I'll forever have. From a passenger perspective, I have very little issues with them. They're generally comfortable, however I agree with your points about USB charging points and the heating - we can't control the heating and its rather annoying. I'll come onto USB points later. The worst thing about all of these E400s is generally the non-existent suspension - going over any speed hump or hitting a pothole is particularly bad, especially on the 14 plates. Each one of these buses have their own problems - however 33661 and 33664 have generally been well behaved. 33754 has problems with starting, hence why its off the road. 33658 and 33660 are generally brilliant buses, but just breakdown quite a bit. 33662, 33666, 33667 and 33754 are the worst for snatchy brakes. 33659 used to have very bad problems accelerating on hills, but has thankfully been fixed. And finally 33665 is generally a good bus. All of them rattle, some more than others, but like I say all are different. They are well suited to 376, but in my opinion would be better suited to 172/3/4 (age related).

14 plate E400s - the first one of these I drove was 33835, which I was impressed with. Generally the 14 plate E400s have a vastly better braking system - but that's all they have going for them. 33838 doesn't have any change pot (a nightmare), 33840 rumbles when above 40mph and 33836 was littered with problems. All of them have significantly worse suspension and the acceleration is awful. Generally they can't decide what gear they want to stay in and they are rather annoying to me. The headlights also have a filter which lowers them - so you can't see as far along the road as you can with a 12 plate.

MMCs - by far the best type of decker I've driven. They could do with a bit more room in the cab and the brakes are rather "Streetdecky", but generally they're pretty good. Not the best with acceleration, but still cope with the hills particularly well. The only real issue I have with them is once again the n/s wing mirror - which is positioned in an even worse place than the older Enviros. These, as in my previous opinions, would have been the best bus to buy for 376 in 2015 over the Streetdeck and we wouldn't have suffered all the problems that we've had previously.

So yes I agree with some of your points, but generally speaking the E400 deckers are a far better choice over the Streetdeck and some are even better than B9s. I'm generally pleased with the approach of the fleet - having the same type of decker is a good idea and using 54/55 plate B7RLEs (of which I'm hopeful it'll be 54 plate, since they accelerate better) on 126 is a good idea. If First withdraw all the B7RLEs, they'll be short of vehicles, which even before this crisis they couldn't afford to bring in new stock to replace. So keeping some of the best singles in service on routes which don't get affected by any emission zones are ideal in my opinion.

As much as it will surprise some, I can't wait to get rid of the B9s. Although most have had to have new gearboxes (I believe 37605 is about to get another one only after a few months of getting a new one), they have been pretty reliable. The big issue that I find is they aren't designed for hills - 37605 is particularly bad and will get down to 15mph before deciding it wants to go up the hill. The 09 plates are generally better and are more comfortable.

With the B7RLEs, all of the Wells drivers will be mostly disappointed at them leaving. They're an excellent bus in so many ways - I've been privileged enough in the last few weeks (before going on furlough) to drive most of them on 172/3/4, some for my whole duty. They will be deeply missed, but they do unfortunately have several problems creeping up - the only one that hasn't had any issues is 69443 and, obviously, 66720.

If we can get a fleet of E400MMCs, I expect most of us will enjoy them, especially since the 14 plates aren't anywhere as good.

When it comes to USB charging points, I fully understand your frustration, but generally speaking USB charging points, as others have said, aren't a necessity. However saying that, 376 carries a lot of commuters and many that need to charge their phones. I've been under the view that if all of Wells was run by Stagecoach, it would all come under the Stagecoach Gold brand, so would receive such luxuries as comfortable seating and USB points. I think that all our routes also need to have next stop announcements - as much as it annoys drivers, its very useful to passengers. I don't think unfortunately we'll see anything like this anytime soon under the current situation.
 
Last edited:

henairs

Member
Joined
12 May 2014
Messages
506
Location
Yeovil
IIRC, they were Taunton vehicles nominally but that 2 boards were operated by Yeovil; I don't think Yeovil had a permanent pair? I remember when they went and then returned, seeing one working a Fishponds Road service along Stapleton Road.
Hi Wazoo,
Here at Yeovil we had 66956/58 and 960 with just 66961 being allocated to Taunton.
They all had the green Wessex wyvern logo from roofline to skirt on the side which is very similar to the Welsh dragon but a different colour. Sometimes one of ours worked on 58 to Wincanton whilst on 5th Nov 2008 I rode 66960 on the 202 service between Crewkerne and Dorchester on the Wednesday only market run from Chard to Dorsets county town.
Decent vehicles in their day,
Cheers, Mike
 

THarris123

Established Member
Joined
20 Apr 2014
Messages
2,843
Location
Wells, Somerset
The 12" never got an interior refurbishment which greatly frustrates me (1), and I find myself frequently travelling on them with low phone battery. My phone is less than a year old, however I do a lot of filming bus rides, as well as general use, which drains the battery throughout the day. The 12 reg Enviros should stay on the 376, as the 14 reg ones I believe are coming specifically for the Bath to Wells corridor, though the few euro 6 upgraded 12 reg ones will be able to join them in a years time. The B9TLs were off the road, yes, however Wells depot has been short of engineers for months (2), as so buses have been sent to Bath. Bath depot's maintenance standards are pretty awful if you ask me (3). I get the B9TL's are old, and they were being killed by the hills they dealt with every day, however I was thinking the Gemini 2's that are in Bath would be far superior at Wells. Having had them on loan, they are as fantastic as the Gemini 1s (4), but yet are more comfortable, with civic 3's. Granted, there are only 5 of them, but if you threw them into the mix with the Enviros, It would atleast give variety (5). The old B7tl's were actually on loan due to 33754 and 33667 being off the road for such a long time (6), and 32009 was also not long ago on loan, due to 37772 (the least reliable b9) being off the road with a gearbox or clutch issue I believe (7). I've never said that the Streetdecks shouldn't have gone, whilst I actually think they weren't too bad on the Wells to Bath corridor (8), they are much better suited in Bristol. The B7rle's are the buses I don't want to let go of. They are perfect during the majority of the day, I can sometimes find myself being the only passenger on them. Their reliability has been incredibly good, with 69445 & 6 being the only ones to have any issues (And 69437 which has disappeared) (9). I'll let First realise their mistakes with the Enviros, as they aren't gonna last long before breaking down frequently and having a load of issues (10). I look forward to seeing tons of issues with the Enviros, and more loans at Wells (11). Some more MMC's on loan would be fantastic in my opinion, and would give me & the drivers some much needed variety (12).
1) I'm not too sure why you expect to have 7 year old buses refurbished - internally none of the E400s need a refurbishment. In an ideal world they could do with next stop and USB points, but they don't need it.
2) Wells hasn't been short of engineers particularly - they're just taking holiday. They are looking for another mechanic which will help the situation, but usually there is somebody in each day.
3) what justification do you have for that exactly? Granted they don't prioritise our buses over their own, but generally they do the job to the standards needed.
4) The Gemini 2's aren't too bad, but having a fleet of them won't be ideal since they struggle on hills
5) why do you want variety? Its a pain in the backside for drivers and engineers to have so many different types of bus. So far being 10 months into the job, I've had to be trained on 6 different types of bus, which isn't ideal. Obviously as an enthusiast, its great, but think on the other side for a moment.
6) each of the enviros have been off for a long time, not just 33754 and 33667. 33666 I think was off for the longest.
7) trust me, 37772 is one of the better ones. 37605 is the worst.
8) yes they were. Streetdecks on one day will work fine, but on the next be totally awful.
9) 69445 is one of the best perfoming ones we have, though it does have a coolant sensor issue. 69437 blew its engine and is waiting a replacement.
10) First won't realise its "mistakes" with the E400s. There aren't any mistakes to be had - they work well on country routes and are pretty good. They just all have niggly little faults and annoyances.
11) I'd rather not have them off the road, since it means cancellations. More loans from Bath only creates problems. Some of those loans we've had have been dreadful - all the ALX400s were very tired, 32009 being one of the best ones however. I'd rather keep our fleet on the road than off the road.
12) we don't need more variety - what we need is simplicity
 

THarris123

Established Member
Joined
20 Apr 2014
Messages
2,843
Location
Wells, Somerset
Streamer MXP out of interest did you ever travel on or have an opinion on 30871 32008 or 09 when they were on loan from Bath?
30871, 30877 and 32008 were all dreadful. 32009 was actually quite nice. All of them very tired and I know from experience as a passenger the ride is rather bumpy.
 

THarris123

Established Member
Joined
20 Apr 2014
Messages
2,843
Location
Wells, Somerset
The vehicles are not allocated unfortunately based on personal preference of customer’s or drivers, they are allocated based on what is best for the service and the company.

Yes some vinyls may yet to be added, this is done by an outside company. Perhaps they didn’t get to the depot to do them. Likewise if one has been painted the wrong shade, that’s again done by an outside company. A slot probably has to be found for it to go back. Yes it would be nice to have them all looking pretty, but the priority is to get them out on the road.

Regular E400s when maintained properly cope fine with the hills and indeed fast running on the motorway. It is only once they get older or have a defect they stuggle a little and being 12 or 14 plate they are not that old. I think the excel network should recieve MMCs first to get rid of the 334** and 335** which are 6 and 8 years older doing the same sort of work. In terms of uncomfy E400s, you’re welcome to the 335*** I’m sure Weston would welcome the 12 and 14 plates.

The USB charging yes is a nice bonus, it’s a free service and isn’t guaranteed. I don’t think First see it as their responsibility to keep someone’s phone charged. Battery packs are very cheap and useful which most have to make do with.
Trust me Excel won't be receiving new fleet anytime soon. 376 turns a rather good profit, unlike Excel
 

THarris123

Established Member
Joined
20 Apr 2014
Messages
2,843
Location
Wells, Somerset
Listed on Weston-Super-Mare's operations on First West of England's website, was service 126, listed as "The Strawberry Route". And don't remember seeing it on Wells' most recent operations. (Pages has been temporarily removed due to Coronavirus). This does suggest that it's being transferred to Weston, and Wells is going fully double decker operations. Judging by Weston's allocations for their run of the 126, It will most likely be ran by Streetlites. I very much doubt 54" and 55" B7RLEs will operate the route, as they are all being withdrawn from service, and I believe two (66940 & 66941) are replacing two b10's for training. I may be wrong, but these are a few things i've noticed recently.
The 55 plate B7RLEs are mostly going into training from what I'm led to believe. Not entirely certain whats happening with the 54 plates, but some of the older ones will be for 126.
 

TheGrandWazoo

Veteran Member
Joined
18 Feb 2013
Messages
19,966
Location
Somerset with international travel (e.g. across th
Hi Wazoo,
Here at Yeovil we had 66956/58 and 960 with just 66961 being allocated to Taunton.
They all had the green Wessex wyvern logo from roofline to skirt on the side which is very similar to the Welsh dragon but a different colour. Sometimes one of ours worked on 58 to Wincanton whilst on 5th Nov 2008 I rode 66960 on the 202 service between Crewkerne and Dorchester on the Wednesday only market run from Chard to Dorsets county town.
Decent vehicles in their day,
Cheers, Mike

I remember seeing them in Taunton but just never travelled on them. Did have a trip on 66958 on the 234 before they were moved (with the 234 getting Darts)

I've been under the view that if all of Wells was run by Stagecoach, it would all come under the Stagecoach Gold brand, so would receive such luxuries as comfortable seating and USB points.

You are undoubtedly right. In fact, it would probably be on its second round of Gold deckers to be honest. In fact, it illustrates the fact that Stagecoach have managed to use e400s on enough inter-urban services. I look at First on the 376 (and when they had the 231) and compare that with the Stagecoach Swindon 55 or S6 (66) - the 376 has grown but you wonder if it has been maximised?
 

THarris123

Established Member
Joined
20 Apr 2014
Messages
2,843
Location
Wells, Somerset
First of all, it's fair to have opinions and that's what this forum is about.

In terms of the 126, that's certainly new information. @D2007wsm had suggested that Wells were to keep the two boards; FWIW I'd wonder if it could really be run with Streetlites in terms of capacity.

However, I do query what you're saying as I don't think it reflects the reality of the decker situation at Wells; it feels like you're selectively picking out information and interpreting because you don't like the e400s. The B7TLs including the oldest were there long, long before the e400s began moving over in August/September. Frequent loans from Bath to Wells have been commonplace over the last two years. That includes stuff like 30871 and 30877 which were there at various times during the spring. I've seen X39 B9s, ex London Geminis, ex Glasgow Geminis, various ALXs etc. Such were the issues that 32669/73/88 were sent there from April 2019. Unfortunately, there were problems with 32669 and 32688 - the former was a dog and 32688 was also VOR for much of Oct/Nov. To blame it on 33754 and 33667 is ignoring the issues that have beset Wells and hastened the replacement of the Streetdecks.

I know it's all about opinions but I think you're wrong in terms of the Streetdecks on the Bath corridor as they wouldn't have survived there either. There's as many sharp hills whether its Dunkerton, Chilcompton, Nettlebridge or through the Horringtons as there are on the 376. Also, whilst the ALXs are surprisingly good vehicles for their age, to suggest that they are as comfortable as an e400 (especially the 2000/1 examples with their a**e numbing seats).....not a chance. The main issues with the e400s are the heating as others have suggested but otherwise, they are robust if uninspiring. Yes, they do need a refresh but given the issues that Wells were experiencing (i.e. having four additional deckers and it still not being enough), the 12 plates were pushed into service quicly

@D2007wsm is right about USBs in that these are relatively new features. You filming routes is pretty extraordinary rather than the norm and if it's an issue, just take a juice bar out with you. Same with variety - the idea was originally to have just B9s (172-4) and Streetdecks (376). Having fewer types means you minimise spares issues and type training - stuff that is quantifiable int terms of financial and operational performance rather than something esoteric about it being nice to have depending on your view.

A few other points. All the e400s will need to be Euro VI to comply with the Bath or Bristol CAZs. I'd assume that in practice, the 12 and 14 plates will simply be a mixed pool and the better ones will appear on whichever boards are out the longest!! Also, there are 6 not 5 B9/Gemini 2 at Bath (36229-34).
Firstly, hello Wazoo, hope you're well.

126 could be run with Streetlites fairly easily in winter, however school loadings can be quite a lot and in the summer the loadings off peak can be quite high. Its better to use something older which won't be affected by the emission zones really for 126 and economically it doesn't justify using something as new as a Streetlite (thankfully).

There are certain things that he's picked out about the Enviros, but I like them and have many issues with them, most of what Streamr says is about right to be fair with regards to them. Generally 32669 was pretty good - it had a few issues with spilling its coolant and needing new gearboxes and engines, but it was far better than having to put up with 32673. 32688 was pretty good, but had gearbox issues, hence why it was off the road.

The ALX400s are as good as the Enviros for comfortability - I agree with your point about the seats, but the serious lack of suspension on the E400 makes it feel like there's nothing on the seat anyway. The older B7RLEs and B7TLs have such good suspension that you don't even notice the speed hump when you go over it.
 

Whiteway215

Established Member
Joined
15 Sep 2015
Messages
1,989
Location
Bath
30871, 30877 and 32008 were all dreadful. 32009 was actually quite nice. All of them very tired and I know from experience as a passenger the ride is rather bumpy.
THarris good to see you back reporting. Did these oldies have absolutely nothing good about them?
 

THarris123

Established Member
Joined
20 Apr 2014
Messages
2,843
Location
Wells, Somerset
I remember seeing them in Taunton but just never travelled on them. Did have a trip on 66958 on the 234 before they were moved (with the 234 getting Darts)



You are undoubtedly right. In fact, it would probably be on its second round of Gold deckers to be honest. In fact, it illustrates the fact that Stagecoach have managed to use e400s on enough inter-urban services. I look at First on the 376 (and when they had the 231) and compare that with the Stagecoach Swindon 55 or S6 (66) - the 376 has grown but you wonder if it has been maximised?
I'll probably get told off for writing this (policies, etc), but despite 376 still making a good profit, because of all the reliability problems and Coxley roadworks, the profit is much lower than it once was. It still justifies new fleet though (whenever they can afford it).
 

THarris123

Established Member
Joined
20 Apr 2014
Messages
2,843
Location
Wells, Somerset
THarris good to see you back reporting. Did these oldies have absolutely nothing good about them?
32008 was dreadful. I drove it once. Got it to Bath and it died. Its extremely tired, but apparently better than the other pink panther (32004).
32009 was pretty good. Not the fastest up hills. The last time I had it, I was on 173 - when it came into Bath bus station for me to take on, my face dropped. By the time I got to Norton and onto the flats after Chilcompton, I didn't want to leave it.
30871 and 30877 were generally ok, but very very tired.
The whole bodywork on the W reg ones were better and mechanically theyre really good - all of which better than the newer ALX400s.
We nicknamed 32284 "the bus with the indoor swimming pool" since there was water slushing around above the driver. Other 03/53 plates were generally quite bad and very tired. Mechanically still pretty good though.
Then the 54 plate ex Glasgow B7TLs were brilliant - absolutely fine machines and very well looked after for their age.
The only other oldies I've driven are 32669 and 32673 which as stated previously are awful in every manner, and the 53 ex London B7TLs, which are also awful in many ways.
 

Whiteway215

Established Member
Joined
15 Sep 2015
Messages
1,989
Location
Bath
Th
32008 was dreadful. I drove it once. Got it to Bath and it died. Its extremely tired, but apparently better than the other pink panther (32004).
32009 was pretty good. Not the fastest up hills. The last time I had it, I was on 173 - when it came into Bath bus station for me to take on, my face dropped. By the time I got to Norton and onto the flats after Chilcompton, I didn't want to leave it.
30871 and 30877 were generally ok, but very very tired.
The whole bodywork on the W reg ones were better and mechanically theyre really good - all of which better than the newer ALX400s.
We nicknamed 32284 "the bus with the indoor swimming pool" since there was water slushing around above the driver. Other 03/53 plates were generally quite bad and very tired. Mechanically still pretty good though.
Then the 54 plate ex Glasgow B7TLs were brilliant - absolutely fine machines and very well looked after for their age.
The only other oldies I've driven are 32669 and 32673 which as stated previously are awful in every manner, and the 53 ex London B7TLs, which are also awful in many ways.
Thank you for your reply.
A few weeks ago I spoke to a driver who had to take 32008 back to the depot from Bath bus station. It was a day with heavy rain and he reckoned he got wetter in the cab than when he had been standing outside the bus station In the rain!
 

TheGrandWazoo

Veteran Member
Joined
18 Feb 2013
Messages
19,966
Location
Somerset with international travel (e.g. across th
Firstly, hello Wazoo, hope you're well.

126 could be run with Streetlites fairly easily in winter, however school loadings can be quite a lot and in the summer the loadings off peak can be quite high. Its better to use something older which won't be affected by the emission zones really for 126 and economically it doesn't justify using something as new as a Streetlite (thankfully).

There are certain things that he's picked out about the Enviros, but I like them and have many issues with them, most of what Streamr says is about right to be fair with regards to them. Generally 32669 was pretty good - it had a few issues with spilling its coolant and needing new gearboxes and engines, but it was far better than having to put up with 32673. 32688 was pretty good, but had gearbox issues, hence why it was off the road.

The ALX400s are as good as the Enviros for comfortability - I agree with your point about the seats, but the serious lack of suspension on the E400 makes it feel like there's nothing on the seat anyway. The older B7RLEs and B7TLs have such good suspension that you don't even notice the speed hump when you go over it.

Hi there Tom

Sorry to hear you've been furloughed...hopefully not for too long.

I was thinking about the summer 126 to be fair in terms of capacity. And yeah, I meant 32673 rather than 32669 - in fact 32673 still hasn't turned a wheel in service in Essex AFAIK.

The 376 is a strong route and I'm sure it will get a newer fleet in a couple of years or so. However, it feels (and appreciate that it's a subjective view rather than based in fact) that it has sort of plateaued
 
Last edited:

THarris123

Established Member
Joined
20 Apr 2014
Messages
2,843
Location
Wells, Somerset
Hi there Tom

Sorry to hear you've been furloughed...hopefully not for too long.

I was thinking about the summer 126 to be fair in terms of capacity.
They're doing it on a 3 week on, 3 week off. So I'm back on 10th May. Since Wells is quite a small depot, there's more in work than off on this 3 week rota (some drivers are off for a full 12 weeks if they're considered to be high risk), so some drivers are having to work longer than 3 weeks. I've got plenty to keep me going at the moment thankfully.
 

Tommy Walters

Member
Joined
9 Nov 2017
Messages
567
Location
Ottery St Mary
32008 was dreadful. I drove it once. Got it to Bath and it died. Its extremely tired, but apparently better than the other pink panther (32004).
32009 was pretty good. Not the fastest up hills. The last time I had it, I was on 173 - when it came into Bath bus station for me to take on, my face dropped. By the time I got to Norton and onto the flats after Chilcompton, I didn't want to leave it.
30871 and 30877 were generally ok, but very very tired.
The whole bodywork on the W reg ones were better and mechanically theyre really good - all of which better than the newer ALX400s.
We nicknamed 32284 "the bus with the indoor swimming pool" since there was water slushing around above the driver. Other 03/53 plates were generally quite bad and very tired. Mechanically still pretty good though.
Then the 54 plate ex Glasgow B7TLs were brilliant - absolutely fine machines and very well looked after for their age.
The only other oldies I've driven are 32669 and 32673 which as stated previously are awful in every manner, and the 53 ex London B7TLs, which are also awful in many ways.

You haven't missed much with 32004, doesn't have kickdown and is slow as anything at even the slightest hint of a hill!

Am in full agreement about the 54-plates, 32551 is especially good! It can get up Bathwick Hill on a fully loaded U1 faster than an MMC with a half load!

Even some MMCs have been known to leak in the cab (33947 comes to mind). If you really want a shower though, then sit in the rear half of artics 10036, 10175 or 10178 on a rainy day!
 

Tommy Walters

Member
Joined
9 Nov 2017
Messages
567
Location
Ottery St Mary
GW saying about 30871/77 being on loan to Wells. I’ve said it before and I will say it again I could never believe such old buses being trusted on the 172/3/4 with, as GW states, such steep climbs especially out of Wells up through the Horringtons.
Anyway it looks as though we won’t be seeing 30871 or 75 being hauled off for scrap just yet. 30871 (with the bashed in roof after arguing with Bristol Parkway bridge) is at present being converted to a library bus at Bath Depot. 30875 is parked up with a windscreen sticker ‘Library bus-do not remove parts.’

Anyone know whether former Bath based 30857/67/70 from the same batch are still operating anywhere? (pre-COVID of course)
 
Last edited:

BBC

Member
Joined
26 Mar 2016
Messages
419
I just thought all the gas buses were already being used on LH routes is all, so didn't think there were any spare, so something else must be now being used. It is fact as there is a picture, this wasn't from the tracker.
There’s normally about 4/5 spare so enough for a few dupes. Plus they have many more they can re tax if they have to n
 

BBC

Member
Joined
26 Mar 2016
Messages
419
Exactly, there are only a handful of buses in London with USB chargers (mainly electric vehicles), and I'd add that none of them have Wifi fitted either as per all of FWoEs fleet, even the W-PAEs!
WiFi isn’t fitted to the gas buses and by all accounts will never be fitted.
 

Private Baxter

Established Member
Joined
22 Sep 2013
Messages
1,787
The 55 plate B7RLEs are mostly going into training from what I'm led to believe. Not entirely certain whats happening with the 54 plates, but some of the older ones will be for 126.
Good to hear from you again Tom. Obviously Wells already have 66720 and 66942, the former of course being in much better condition, so perhaps they will send 66942 away for refresh, or more likely, use one of the Bath ones currently used on the 5, such as 66722.
 

TheGrandWazoo

Veteran Member
Joined
18 Feb 2013
Messages
19,966
Location
Somerset with international travel (e.g. across th
Good to hear from you again Tom. Obviously Wells already have 66720 and 66942, the former of course being in much better condition, so perhaps they will send 66942 away for refresh, or more likely, use one of the Bath ones currently used on the 5, such as 66722.

Also, the Discover fleet should also have some spares? The D3 withdrawal will have released 4 vehicles.... the three Solars and...?

WiFi isn’t fitted to the gas buses and by all accounts will never be fitted.

Interesting in that FWoE received a load of Better Bus Area funding in 2014 to enable all of First's Bristol and Bath fleets to have wifi fitted.
 

Top