First TPE Class 185 services from Glasgow Central

Discussion in 'Allocations, Diagrams & Timetables' started by GaryBrown156, 8 Jan 2020.

  1. GaryBrown156

    GaryBrown156 Member

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    Hi,
    i was wondering if anyone could help me please?, within the next week or two i'm planning on visiting visiting family down in Lockerbie and I was wondering what TPE services from Glasgow are usually operated by Class 185's?. Any time i've made this trip in the past the service has always been operated by an EMU however in the last 3 weeks or so I have seen quite a few 185 DMU's in Central station (one of the 185's was going to Liverpool Lime street at around 5pm ish but I never seen the destination on any of the others although I have seen them in the station at various times of day). Are the Liverpool services the only ones operated by 185's?. I've never been on one of these units before but I'm eager to experience one if possible. visually they look good and the engines definitely have a distinctive sound. The other day I was standing Gordon street entrance and heard the grumble before I seen the unit!!!, Not in a bad way, I really like the sound.
    Thanks in advance
     
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  3. Scotrail314209

    Scotrail314209 Member

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    All the Liverpool services are 185s for now. There may be some on Manchester but I'm not entirely sure which ones.

    However, the Manchester services seem to be overcrowded most times, so if you want a seat i'd reserve.
     
  4. Jamesrob637

    Jamesrob637 Member

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    350s have had to go to the Midlands and not enough 397s for now. Simple :lol: enjoy! As the previous poster mentioned, can be very crowded at certain times of the day so reservation almost essential on most services.
     
  5. Scotrail314209

    Scotrail314209 Member

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    They may be even more busier now that the Motherwell stop has been added, as Motherwell has quite a decent trade for long distance travel.
     
  6. Peter Bonner

    Peter Bonner Member

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    See there are any 1st class deals with reservations. 185s like the 350s before them can get very crowded and often unpleasantly so.
     
  7. route101

    route101 Established Member

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    Liverpool services are best bet , not sure until 397s take over on the route . Watch though as i had a cancelled Manchester TPE before my Liverpool which resulted in everyone on the Liverpool , also every seat apart from the priority seating had a seat reservation !
     
  8. voyagerdude220

    voyagerdude220 Established Member

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    I believe a Glasgow to Liverpool service got cancelled yesterday afternoon, as the booked driver didn't sign 185s.
     
  9. Scotrail314209

    Scotrail314209 Member

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    that sounds like they are covering up something, as all drivers should sign both 350s and 185s
     
  10. voyagerdude220

    voyagerdude220 Established Member

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    Well officially what I said is what was sent out on Tyrell. Whether it's accurate is anyone's guess.
     
  11. djpontrack

    djpontrack Member

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    I’ve been told that there is some new drivers at Glasgow that have not been trained on 185’s.
     
  12. SuperNova

    SuperNova Member

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    TPE recruited a fair few new drivers for the depot in Glasgow and they have not been trained up on the 185s. It's also a good 5 years since the 350's have been in use, so any new drivers in that time will not have driven 185s.
     
  13. Scotrail314209

    Scotrail314209 Member

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    Surely the new drivers should’ve been trained up on 185s, given that they operate into Glasgow on a fairly regular basis now. Even before the Liverpool was introduced a couple of Manchester services would throw up a 185
     
  14. SuperNova

    SuperNova Member

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    185s were never intended to be used. Should have all been 397s by now.
     
  15. hexagon789

    hexagon789 Established Member

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    Wasn't there a Saturday or Sunday working that was a 185 instead of a 350, retained for traction knowledge or something?
     
  16. MDB1images

    MDB1images Member

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    Glasgow didn't have any booked Class 185 work after the booked Saturday/Sunday diagram finished a while ago.
    A big intake of new drivers wasn't expected to need Class 185 traction (as they'd never be booked to work them)which has now needed to be re-planned for.

    In terms of the OP: Liverpool to Glasgow are booked 185 short term so your best bet but 185s do cover on Airport services to Glasgow, again short term.
     
  17. Peter Bonner

    Peter Bonner Member

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    Shame that TPE didnt put into place some contingency plans just in case there were issues with new stock. More evidence of management failings I think.
     
  18. MDB1images

    MDB1images Member

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    Only so many staff available to do the training as it was ever planned all new traction would arrive pretty much at once.
    Class 802 training along with ECML road learning was in full swing so you wouldn't have got 185 training in especially when factoring Class 397 training starting up and so many new staff who needed to learn the new traction & routes plus the old traction(350s)and routes (WCML).
     
  19. Peter Bonner

    Peter Bonner Member

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    But as I said...just in case....Contingency plans are critical. Did TPE have any?
     
  20. route101

    route101 Established Member

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    There was a Friday only 185 too.
     
  21. MDB1images

    MDB1images Member

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    Not had a booked 185 midweek on WCML work(until recently!)for quite a while.
    They generally only turned up of late if a 350 failed.
     
  22. hexagon789

    hexagon789 Established Member

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    So there was, but until recently Central TPE workings were a sea of 350/4s
     
  23. MDB1images

    MDB1images Member

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    Deleted, wrong thread.
     
    Last edited: 10 Jan 2020
  24. CC 72100

    CC 72100 Established Member

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    It's a significant piece of work to carry out traction training.

    It will consist of having a trainer available throughout, unit for static duties and prodding around with, a certain amount of hours handling in service, and a practical assessment.

    Now bearing in mind that there isn't any planned work for 185s, so when they do appear they are only doing so on a short term unplanned basis, it raises a few questions:

    1) How can you practically put a plan in place to do the training when you don't know whether a unit will appear?

    2) Say one does appear, is it for long enough for the training and is your trainer and person requiring training still available? Can they be put on the training at short notice?

    3) You may have multiple training schemes going on at once - should you prioritise training on the new trains or on the trains that shouldn't turn up but you want to do 'just in case'?

    It is perfectly logical therefore when there is a 'changing of the guard' of traction to, when you reach a certain point (and presuming that all other people in the depot sign the old traction) to train new recruits on only the new traction.

    And if that means that all the stars align and the day one of the old trains turns up it's a new recruit booked to drive it and there's no spares (trains or crew) available to make the combination work... well than that's the nature of the beast.

    I appreciate you may think that the reasoning is poor and that TPE or whatever TOC it is should be pulling out all the stops all the time to plan for every scenario but there are only finite resources.
     

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